Avengers Academy #29 *Spoilers*

[dkostus]

It looks like Crosta gets some time in AA #30. He tries to jump into the ocean, and the sentinel catches him before he hits the water. How F'ing inhumane could they be? Stopping an Atlantean mutant from going into the water... with a Sentinel?

[Rheged]

It looks like Crosta gets some time in AA #30. He tries to jump into the ocean, and the sentinel catches him before he hits the water. How F'ing inhumane could they be? Stopping an Atlantean mutant from going into the water... with a Sentinel?

Speaking of inhumane condition -> there are some telepathic dampener in Avengers Academy, Martha is held blind, deaf and isolated.

That is pretty awful.

[Khajit]

I don't read Deadpool, so I'm not sure what you are referring to. My understanding was the parents were sending their children to school / be trained, not that they had signed legal custody over to Cyclops. I know for a fact, that Loa's parents did no such thing. They reamed Cyclops out when they couldn't reach Loa, when she went to hell with Namor. Crosta, is a legal ward of Atlantis, only because his parents were in the middle of an ugly custody battle.

The X-kids weren't in Utopia because of any schooling. They were there because the parents themselves all abandoned their children there. Loa is a bit of an exception. Teon's parents tried to get custody as well but Hope used her mind control to convince the parents to leave him with Hope. I think that the X-men got custody of Hellion, Teon. Noriko and elixir , none of the lights really have any ability to choose staying elewhere anyway thanks to Hope's influence.

There's also the fact that Wolverine told Cap that Utopia was like a cult and everyone was indoctrinated.
Sending them to their parents would just result in them running away is he underestimated the "cultish influence" Cap would have to assume the children might be under. In a sense AA would be an observation station as he waits until he can decided what to do with them and figure out how to contact the parents. I can't say I imagined myself as anything but outraged over the AA custody but abandoning them all when there are myriad safe places like the FF headquarters to place the kids was a bad move by Cyclops for garnering my sympathy. I'm almost surprised Namor wasn't enraged with Cyclops for abandoning Loa. Almost being the fact that Namor still respects Captain America's honour (as in he wouldn't expect torture from Cap)even if he disagrees with the actions.


As far as the deadpool thing goes Mercury's Dad started making a stink about how the X-men wouldn't give him his daughter back( he didn't actually care since he was being paid to do so) deadpool went on about since he's an X-man he should solve the problem by killing her dad so now Cyclops has to stop deadpool from making things worse . Deadpool gets the dad to confess that he was only in it for the money from Osbourne(at gunpoint) cyclops gets tired of Deadpool's shit and rants at DP about how he's not a bloody X-man and it all in the end turns out to be deadpool planned on getting cyclops to disavow deadpool while getting the father to confess on live TV.

I just took a look and only 3 of the Kids are even under the legal custody of parents that can be easily contacted (or possess the mental faculties to disobey Hope) . 6 if you count the cockoos but i recall something about weapon X and them actually being Emma clones so handing them Emma to be used in battle probably isn't an option.
Basically Loa, prodigy, and crosta can be given to thier parents. Prodigy would just immediately leave to go back into the fight though.
Pixie's parents are legally dead on paper and i doubt they're contacting pixies without Dr. Strange.
Noriko was abandonded.
Dust doesn't know how to find her parents or she'd already be there.
Not sure about Martha. perhaps she might actually have parents to take care of her.
Teon: light so under mind control and a bit difficult to handle when he doesn't appear to understand communication if you're a new observer.
Gabriel: light. Also extremly loud about what he wants to do.
Laurie:Legally of age according to Hope but without a job or access to money for supporting herself. Also a light.
Crosta: should have returned him to Atlantis.
Cuckoos: Clones.

[LeonardEugenius]

The X-kids weren't in Utopia because of any schooling. They were there because the parents themselves all abandoned their children there. Loa is a bit of an exception. Teon's parents tried to get custody as well but Hope used her mind control to convince the parents to leave him with Hope. I think that the X-men got custody of Hellion, Teon. Noriko and elixir , none of the lights really have any ability to choose staying elewhere anyway thanks to Hope's influence.

There's also the fact that Wolverine told Cap that Utopia was like a cult and everyone was indoctrinated.
Sending them to their parents would just result in them running away is he underestimated the "cultish influence" Cap would have to assume the children might be under. In a sense AA would be an observation station as he waits until he can decided what to do with them and figure out how to contact the parents. I can't say I imagined myself as anything but outraged over the AA custody but abandoning them all when there are myriad safe places like the FF headquarters to place the kids was a bad move by Cyclops for garnering my sympathy. I'm almost surprised Namor wasn't enraged with Cyclops for abandoning Loa. Almost being the fact that Namor still respects Captain America's honour (as in he wouldn't expect torture from Cap)even if he disagrees with the actions.


As far as the deadpool thing goes Mercury's Dad started making a stink about how the X-men wouldn't give him his daughter back( he didn't actually care since he was being paid to do so) deadpool went on about since he's an X-man he should solve the problem by killing her dad so now Cyclops has to stop deadpool from making things worse . Deadpool gets the dad to confess that he was only in it for the money from Osbourne(at gunpoint) cyclops gets tired of Deadpool's shit and rants at DP about how he's not a bloody X-man and it all in the end turns out to be deadpool planned on getting cyclops to disavow deadpool while getting the father to confess on live TV.

Do you have any on panel proof that those kids' parents gave up their rights? All of your posts boil down to Cyclops being evil and crazy. "There's also the fact that Wolverine told Cap that Utopia was like a cult and everyone was indoctrinated." What does that have to do with anything? Does everything that Wolverine says become an instant fact now. What if Wolverine says the Cyclops is right? Will you stop blaming Cyclops for the death of every child ever conceived in the Marvel Universe? Wolverine is as biased as they come. He's not in the business of doing Cyclops any favors. When Exodus was coming to kill him, Wolverine didn't have the decency to give him a heads up. My statement proves that it's not Cyclops arrival at the school that endangers the kids but the Avengers'. The Avengers who wouldn't be involved with the school had Wolverine not sided with them initially. Now that he's no longer on their side, they can't take chances with his school. That's how the school got dragged into this.

[John Ossie]

Thought it was another good issue by Gage.

Thought he handled the X23 and Wolverine scene well, enjoyed the bit where Mettle got to surf the turf lol and then see Hazmat give the girl who done it (her name escapes me for now) a hug, nice art and of course Hercules was awesome funny in this issue.

Also it was nice to see the cover was nothing like the issue at all.

[LeonardEugenius]

I just took a look and only 3 of the Kids are even under the legal custody of parents that can be easily contacted (or possess the mental faculties to disobey Hope) . 6 if you count the cockoos but i recall something about weapon X and them actually being Emma clones so handing them Emma to be used in battle probably isn't an option.
Basically Loa, prodigy, and crosta can be given to thier parents. Prodigy would just immediately leave to go back into the fight though.
Pixie's parents are legally dead on paper and i doubt they're contacting pixies without Dr. Strange.
Noriko was abandonded.
Dust doesn't know how to find her parents or she'd already be there.
Not sure about Martha. perhaps she might actually have parents to take care of her.
Teon: light so under mind control and a bit difficult to handle when he doesn't appear to understand communication if you're a new observer.
Gabriel: light. Also extremly loud about what he wants to do.
Laurie:Legally of age according to Hope but without a job or access to money for supporting herself. Also a light.
Crosta: should have returned him to Atlantis.
Cuckoos: Clones.

Hope is not, I repeat, is not mind controlling the Lights anymore. The whole finale of Generation Hope dealt with that issue. She didn't mind control Teon at his hearing either. You're argument about the Lights being her cerebral zombies doesn't work.

[Khajit]

"There's also the fact that Wolverine told Cap that Utopia was like a cult and everyone was indoctrinated."

I'll get to the other stuff later perhaps. now to the part I quoted. It isn't a bloody Wolverine is 100% right post you GIT. It's me pointing out that all Captain America knows is what Wolverine told him and what he was told is that it's a cult compound. of course he's going to expect them to go running back to help said cult. They're already child soldiers as it is. Do you seriously think he's going to leave a bunch of (as far as he knows)indoctrinated child soldiers running in the wild with the ability to inflict tons of damage while said child soldiers think of him as the enemy?

Hope is not, I repeat, is not mind controlling the Lights anymore. The whole finale of Generation Hope dealt with that issue. She didn't mind control Teon at his hearing either. You're argument about the Lights being her cerebral zombies doesn't work.

The whole generation Hope issue dealt with the issue badly. Hope failed to see the irony in her killing Kenji for his actions whilst being unrepentant for hers. It's extremely difficult to believe she was telling the truth when she said she would stop when she doesn't even understand why it's wrong is SHE does it. Hope had a gun to her head over the fact that she was mind controlling the lights and she still went around warping their minds. How easily everyone went into line and forgave Hope for enslavement despite multiple protestations throughout the series was off putting and makes it suspect that she was sincere. until the very last issue she was constantly warping Laurie's mind and erasing the original personality. There's a huge amount of room for interpretation on that issue you're trying to reference.

[coconutphone]

We've done the back and forth half a hundred times in the thread; we're so over that now.

Ummm... yeah I don't care how much 3 people here have debated the point. It's a message board. I'll come in and post my thoughts on the issue when feel like. Sorry I haven't spent the day here debating it with you people. Doesn't mean I don't get to chime in. There's no deadline. It's not like I asked a question that people had already answered. I was stating my thought on the issue.

[coconutphone]

GOOD LORD!! Is THAT the definition of "prison"?? How could I have been so blind in all this? I've been under the mistaken impression that prisons were places of punishment where people are sent to answer for crimes they have committed. Well, I hope my kids are learning something in prison today. They seem fine when they get out at 3'o clock, but I never realized how horrible it must be for them to go to prison every morning for five days a week and spend 8 hours of their day there. Ya see, I've been calling it a school all this time, but since the students --I mean prisoners-- are forced to stay there even against their will, then schools are just prisons.

Hey, you know what else is a prison? Mental health facilities. Yeah, nevermind the fact that the doctors are there to "help," the patients are just prisoners and the asylums are prisons. Hell, maybe the patients didn't even do anything wrong or aren't capable of telling what's right and wrong. Maybe they were born with special needs that can only be fulfilled in a prison-like environment. And hey, old folks homes too... because, you know, even though they don't let those adults wander off to do whatever they please for their own good, those adults are still prisoners and they did nothing wrong.




At the end of the story, the X-kids aren't imprisoned. Detained, yes. For their own good. They are minors, and it would be irresponsible for adults to allow them to fight in a dangerous conflict that can be considered a war. Protective custody means protective custody --not jail, not prison. They have adults from their own community there watching them (Rao and Jeffries), and the Utopia Island probably isn't the safest place to leave them under the current circumstances. In fact, Rao and Jeffries aren't prisoners and are working with the Avengers to keep the X-kids out of trouble. So yeah, until legal guardians who aren't recklessly endangering the world show up to take them off the hands of the Avengers Academy, the X-kids are being detained. Boohoo, its so unfair (not) and they're pissed off about being treated like children. Its still not prison. Get over it.

And besides, if I recall correctly, Hope was sent away from the fight in AvX #2 to be removed from the battle... put with the X-kids who are now at the AA facility, and the X-kids were told pretty much the same thing: Don't let Hope leave. Now its turned around on them, so its sooooo unfair. Whatever.

yes because school and this are these same thing! Well done internet! Your kids get shot at if they try to leave school? Like the X Kids said: they are being 'detained' for something they haven't done.

For their own good? In who's opinion? The X-Men don't think it's for their own good. Kavita and Madision are going along to not make things worse. Doesn't mean they agree or it will last.

[LeonardEugenius]

I'll get to the other stuff later perhaps. now to the part I quoted. It isn't a bloody Wolverine is 100% right post you GIT. It's me pointing out that all Captain America knows is what Wolverine told him and what he was told is that it's a cult compound. of course he's going to expect them to go running back to help said cult. They're already child soldiers as it is. Do you seriously think he's going to leave a bunch of (as far as he knows)indoctrinated child soldiers running in the wild with the ability to inflict tons of damage while said child soldiers think of him as the enemy?

Namecalling-inappropriate. Thank you for capitalizing the insult. So according to you three of the kids have parents who have legal custody and left them in the care of the X-Men. The Avengers have now taken those kids without their parents consent. Correct? You asked in an earlier post why I wasn't ashamed that Cyclops was using children as shields. While it probably has a lot to do with me being a GIT, some of it lies with the fact that he had all the children sequestered from the fighting. You know what though? Let's ignore that. Those kids were definitely on the front lines like sandbags at a flood wall. Let's talk about the fighting to come at the Jean Grey School, which is obviously Cyclops' fault. He probably is going to call the Avengers and let them know he's there, then teleport right out before they arrive. This will force the staff at the Jean Grey School to fight the Avengers, thus injuring some of the children. It couldn't be that the leader of the Avengers just kicked Wolverine out of a plane, effectively terminating his spot on the team. It couldn't be that Cap decides that with Logan as a wildcard, he can't count on the school to stay out of it. As you said, Captain America had no reason to think that the Utopia kids wouldn't think of him as an enemy. It would be utterly ridiculous for him to think the same of the kids at the Jean Grey School. Obviously, I am a GIT for thinking in such a way. Let's finally move onto Kid Gladiator. Kid Gladiator has been shown to be unruly and battle hungry. He doesn't follow rules at all and was happy to hear that he'd either join the Avengers or fight them in the earlier issues of WATXM. Let's forget all that though, because Cyclops has somehow managed to goad Kid Gladiator, who was previously unruly, into fighting the Avengers. No doubt Cyclops has Emma put him in psychic contact with KG and clue him on his nefarious plan. It doesn't make any sense that when the Avengers show up and the staff starts to fight that KG takes that as an open invitation since it's been established that he loves to fight. You're right. That, too, is the product of me being a GIT.

[Rheged]

The X-kids weren't in Utopia because of any schooling. They were there because the parents themselves all abandoned their children there. Loa is a bit of an exception. Teon's parents tried to get custody as well but Hope used her mind control to convince the parents to leave him with Hope. I think that the X-men got custody of Hellion, Teon. Noriko and elixir , none of the lights really have any ability to choose staying elewhere anyway thanks to Hope's influence.

Crosta was specifically sent to Utopia to learn how to deal with his powers. I think that's how it was presented for a number of parents amongst the New X-Men. The Lights ... well, that remains to be seen how it will fall out. But they are aware of what Hope is doing. But did Hope convince the parents to let Teon go 'to school' or to sign over custody to Cyclops?

There's also the fact that Wolverine told Cap that Utopia was like a cult and everyone was indoctrinated.
Sending them to their parents would just result in them running away is he underestimated the "cultish influence" Cap would have to assume the children might be under. In a sense AA would be an observation station as he waits until he can decided what to do with them and figure out how to contact the parents. I can't say I imagined myself as anything but outraged over the AA custody but abandoning them all when there are myriad safe places like the FF headquarters to place the kids was a bad move by Cyclops for garnering my sympathy. I'm almost surprised Namor wasn't enraged with Cyclops for abandoning Loa. Almost being the fact that Namor still respects Captain America's honour (as in he wouldn't expect torture from Cap)even if he disagrees with the actions.


As far as the deadpool thing goes Mercury's Dad started making a stink about how the X-men wouldn't give him his daughter back( he didn't actually care since he was being paid to do so) deadpool went on about since he's an X-man he should solve the problem by killing her dad so now Cyclops has to stop deadpool from making things worse . Deadpool gets the dad to confess that he was only in it for the money from Osbourne(at gunpoint) cyclops gets tired of Deadpool's shit and rants at DP about how he's not a bloody X-man and it all in the end turns out to be deadpool planned on getting cyclops to disavow deadpool while getting the father to confess on live TV.

I just took a look and only 3 of the Kids are even under the legal custody of parents that can be easily contacted (or possess the mental faculties to disobey Hope) . 6 if you count the cockoos but i recall something about weapon X and them actually being Emma clones so handing them Emma to be used in battle probably isn't an option.
Basically Loa, prodigy, and crosta can be given to thier parents. Prodigy would just immediately leave to go back into the fight though.
Pixie's parents are legally dead on paper and i doubt they're contacting pixies without Dr. Strange.
Noriko was abandonded.
Dust doesn't know how to find her parents or she'd already be there.
Not sure about Martha. perhaps she might actually have parents to take care of her.
Teon: light so under mind control and a bit difficult to handle when he doesn't appear to understand communication if you're a new observer.
Gabriel: light. Also extremly loud about what he wants to do.
Laurie:Legally of age according to Hope but without a job or access to money for supporting herself. Also a light.
Crosta: should have returned him to Atlantis.
Cuckoos: Clones.

Teon understands communication just fine, if not better than most, if that trial issue was any indication. I think Gabriel and Laurie are legal age and have parents they can return to. And the Deadpool stuff always seem out of continuity to me, but thanks for the explanation.

Yes, see my previous post, where I said that any relationship, outside of being an X-Men or an Avenger, doesn't seem to count in this event. Ostensibly, Namor and his fellow Defender Doctor Strange or his war buddy Cap could have sat down with Cyclops and handled this situation like heroes, but then there wouldn't be an excuse for slugging each other, would there? And there are other relationships that could have also been used for reasonable discourse, but weren't.

Yeah, the 'abandoning' doesn't sit well with me at all. I'm hoping we see something from the X-Men side of things about that soon. And no. I don't see Namor happy about Loa and Crosta, or any of them being taken.

[mikekerrIII]

It looks like Crosta gets some time in AA #30. He tries to jump into the ocean, and the sentinel catches him before he hits the water. How F'ing inhumane could they be? Stopping an Atlantean mutant from going into the water... with a Sentinel?

He is a mutant Abusing him with Sentinels is simply procedure

[Khajit]

Crosta was specifically sent to Utopia to learn how to deal with his powers. I think that's how it was presented for a number of parents amongst the New X-Men. The Lights ... well, that remains to be seen how it will fall out. But they are aware of what Hope is doing. But did Hope convince the parents to let Teon go 'to school' or to sign over custody to Cyclops?


Teon understands communication just fine, if not better than most, if that trial issue was any indication. I think Gabriel and Laurie are legal age and have parents they can return to. And the Deadpool stuff always seem out of continuity to me, but thanks for the explanation.

Yes, see my previous post, where I said that any relationship, outside of being an X-Men or an Avenger, doesn't seem to count in this event. Ostensibly, Namor and his fellow Defender Doctor Strange or his war buddy Cap could have sat down with Cyclops and handled this situation like heroes, but then there wouldn't be an excuse for slugging each other, would there? And there are other relationships that could have also been used for reasonable discourse, but weren't.

Yeah, the 'abandoning' doesn't sit well with me at all. I'm hoping we see something from the X-Men side of things about that soon. And no. I don't see Namor happy about Loa and Crosta, or any of them being taken.

I wasn't saying Teon couldn't understand communication. I was saying that from the perspective of the Avengers they would assume he cant considering that his vocabulary consists of woof mate and fight.
I'll find some GH issues floating about to see if they won legal custody outright. I may have assumed so since it was a custody battle.
EDIT: It only says Teon's parents sued for custody. I'd have to guess that means the courts already assume any mutants on Utopia are under the custody of the X-men? It seems like a rather stupid precedent to me personally. I mean the parents should have already been able to contest any paperwork filed for official X custody at the start so really the parents shouldn't have had to sue for custody. The X-men should have had to try and get custody of Teon instead.

[Phoenix]

I'm feeling a little lost over the Shaw bits here.... Does he remember? Is he escaping because he believes they are being held unjustly? Is he all evil man again!? Anyone have thoughts on this!? The cover to next months show's him in his old costume going toe to toe with Mettle!

[Mark_S]

Anger and/or resentment that one would imagine many of these Acadmey cadets could easily relate to, given the reason for their own admittance to the Academy.

And it's GAGE. Not Cage. Unless you're referring to Luke.

When I type in a hurry I make mistakes and this morning I was in a hurry. The difference between the Academy students and the X-kids has been defined by Captain America. One group can leave whenever they want, the other can't.

Mark_S