Who remembers the OMD deal?

[Spider-Dragon]

See thats the thing about OMIT, is that you dont really know if Mephisto really altered time and returned to the present, or he simply watched everything play out after being the bird. Cause if the the first thing then your right about Baby May, but if its the second one, then Baby May never happened yet and her existenced is just being delayed.

How can baby May not have happened yet when stories about baby May have already been done in the original timeline?

OMD erased baby May from existence along with the marriage, before that baby May and the marriage existed.

In this new timeline baby May never existed and she will never exist in the future either because she was meant to be born in the past during the timespan of the second clone saga. Any future child that may end up being born should Peter and Mary Jane get re-married in the new timeline won't be the original baby May...the child can be given her name, but she won't be the original baby May that got erased from existence via OMD.

If someone went back in time and prevented one's conception then that sperm and egg that was meant to be that person never came into contact with each other to form that person and as a result will never exist unless the original timeline is restored.

That's what happened to baby May due to OMD.

[Scott Taylor]

would depend on if that cosmic ruler cared enough to enforce it. Living Tribunal is the go to guy for universal law.... but why would he care about Mephisto and a deal that may or may not have wiped itself out of existence.

I assume such an entity would only come into effect via the rules he set forth. So, in other words, if Mephisto violated his rules for the universe then he would know about it and be put out. THis kind of goes back to the rules of devil deals and who has jurisdiction over them. I mean, we all know its really Wacker, but who is his vehicle in the comics?

[lazyav4]

How can baby May not have happened yet when stories about baby May have already been done in the original timeline?

OMD erased baby May from existence along with the marriage, before that baby May and the marriage existed.

In this new timeline baby May never existed and she will never exist in the future either because she was meant to be born in the past during the timespan of the second clone saga. Any future child that may end up being born should Peter and Mary Jane get re-married in the new timeline won't be the original baby May...the child can be given her name, but she won't be the original baby May that got erased from existence via OMD.

If someone went back in time and prevented one's conception then that sperm and egg that was meant to be that person never came into contact with each other to form that person and as a result will never exist unless the original timeline is restored.

That's what happened to baby May due to OMD.

Yeah that's true and all, but the affects of OMD and OMIT is that the 616 we knew for Spider-Man changed. So what happened when Peter and MJ were married can no longer apply to the new timeline. So instead Baby May doesn't occur in the new 616 Spider-Man, but instead the situation where we knew it happened occurred in another universe.

[Spider-Dragon]

Yeah that's true and all, but the affects of OMD and OMIT is that the 616 we knew for Spider-Man changed. So what happened when Peter and MJ were married can no longer apply to the new timeline. So instead Baby May doesn't occur in the new 616 Spider-Man, but instead the situation where we knew it happened occurred in another universe.

Which means that child Mephisto revealed to Peter and Mary Jane at the end of OMD as being their would have been future daughter isn't baby May as many believed her to be, she is someone totally different.

The only way the original baby May can end up being in this new reality is if it's revealed that Mephisto pulled her out of the original timeline before she got erased from it and then placed her in the present of the new timeline.

In theory (if time travel was actually possible) I think if you could pull something out of the timeline before a change to it would wipe it from existence you might be able to save that something from being erased because it would exist outside of time with you.

That something in an of itself would then be an alternate reality object that survived the temporal changes of its reality that would've normally wiped it from existence and would then exist in the reality in which it never existed once it was placed in it.

[lazyav4]

Which means that child Mephisto revealed to Peter and Mary Jane at the end of OMD as being their would have been future daughter isn't baby May as many believed her to be, she is someone totally different.

The only way the original baby May can end up being in this new reality is if it's revealed that Mephisto pulled her out of the original timeline before she got erased from it and then placed her in the present of the new timeline.

In theory (if time travel was actually possible) I think if you could pull something out of the timeline before a change to it would wipe it from existence you might be able to save that something from being erased because it would exist outside of time with you.

That something in an of itself would then be an alternate reality object that survived the temporal changes of its reality that would've normally wiped it from existence and would then exist in the reality in which it never existed once it was placed in it.

Yeah but that just makes Baby May a living Paradox, and I'm pretty sure in anything i have read about time travel in fiction, they tend to avoid living paradox.

[CMBMOOL]

Which means that child Mephisto revealed to Peter and Mary Jane at the end of OMD as being their would have been future daughter isn't baby May as many believed her to be, she is someone totally different.

The only way the original baby May can end up being in this new reality is if it's revealed that Mephisto pulled her out of the original timeline before she got erased from it and then placed her in the present of the new timeline.

In theory (if time travel was actually possible) I think if you could pull something out of the timeline before a change to it would wipe it from existence you might be able to save that something from being erased because it would exist outside of time with you.

That something in an of itself would then be an alternate reality object that survived the temporal changes of its reality that would've normally wiped it from existence and would then exist in the reality in which it never existed once it was placed in it.

So is it like Rachel Grey of the X-men ?

Also, what does the non-existance of Baby May do to the Death of Ben Reilly in the Post OMD world ?

[lazyav4]

Also, what does the non-existance of Baby May do to the Death of Ben Reilly in the Post OMD world ?

See, this is the main reason OMD and OMIT suck. They just cause major plot holes in which no one knows how to deal with or make sense from.

[Spider-Dragon]

Yeah but that just makes Baby May a living Paradox, and I'm pretty sure in anything i have read about time travel in fiction, they tend to avoid living paradox.

She'd be a contained living paradox that wouldn't cause damage to a timeline outside of existing in a universe that she didn't originate from.

She'd be like a character from a parallel universe living in a universe that is not her own because she doesn't have a universe anymore. Marvel has characters from other universes doing that already.

If Marvel actually went in this direction for baby May I think it would be pretty interesting. But, we all know that such a thing is quite unlikely to happen.

[Khajit]

Only if he himself remembers the deal...which according to ShaggyB he doesn't.

Of course I happen to disagree with him, but whatever.

Mephisto isn't stupid enough to make a deal he cant remember. That's preposterous. While on occasion one can be clever enough to beat the devil I simply cant imagine a person that regularly matches wits with Loki would do something as silly not realize exactly what he was doing.


Oh and on the subject of baby May. I thought the spider-girl universe has the original baby may from when MJ was pregnant(I'm too young to know the full comics details outside of knowing she was pregnant back then). The girl from OMD was a different future child who probably would have been called May too since the original isn't alive(miscarried) in 616. Before OMD came out it's what i was told anyway. The point of divergence for that has long passed.

[Spider-Dragon]

Mephisto isn't stupid enough to make a deal he cant remember. That's preposterous. While on occasion one can be clever enough to beat the devil I simply cant imagine a person that regularly matches wits with Loki would do something as silly not realize exactly what he was doing.


Oh and on the subject of baby May. I thought the spider-girl universe has the original baby may from when MJ was pregnant(I'm too young to know the full comics details outside of knowing she was pregnant back then). The girl from OMD was a different future child who probably would have been called May too since the original isn't alive(miscarried) in 616. Before OMD came out it's what i was told anyway. The point of divergence for that has long passed.

Peter and Mary Jane believed baby May was stillborn, but she was actually kidnapped by Osborn. Although Marvel would want us to believe otherwise. But, going by the facts from the story she was kidnapped, and just because aunt May was recovered instead doesn't mean Osborn still didn't have baby May alive somewhere before the events of OMD.

But, you are correct the child revealed by Mephisto in OMD wasn't baby May. She in fact had no name in the story...people are just calling her baby May...they shouldn't though because it does cause some confusion for some people.

[ShaggyB]

While on occasion one can be clever enough to beat the devil I simply cant imagine a person that regularly matches wits with Loki would do something as silly not realize exactly what he was doing.

how does making a deal that cancels itself out = not realizing exactly what he was doing? What if he knew the results of the deal and was good with that? You seem to be suggesting that him not remembering the deal is something he would not have seen.

[Mr. NickerNacker]

How can baby May not have happened yet when stories about baby May have already been done in the original timeline?

OMD erased baby May from existence along with the marriage, before that baby May and the marriage existed.

In this new timeline baby May never existed and she will never exist in the future either because she was meant to be born in the past during the timespan of the second clone saga. Any future child that may end up being born should Peter and Mary Jane get re-married in the new timeline won't be the original baby May...the child can be given her name, but she won't be the original baby May that got erased from existence via OMD.

If someone went back in time and prevented one's conception then that sperm and egg that was meant to be that person never came into contact with each other to form that person and as a result will never exist unless the original timeline is restored.

That's what happened to baby May due to OMD.

What issue of OMD or OMIT is it stated or shown that baby May was erased from existence?

[classicgmer]

Personally I never got from OMIT that Mephisto erased the deal from existence and that he can't remember it... The way I took it when he basically said (paraphrasing here) "as far as I'm concerned this never happened" is that the whole thing for whatever reason wasn' that important to him anymore...I'm sure that if he cared enough to he'd remember or reflect back on the deal BUT since it's inconsequential to him he's not gonna think about it too often if at all.

[matthewaos]

What issue of OMD or OMIT is it stated or shown that baby May was erased from existence?

Never mentioned. I think JQ or someone from marvel said it. I think that someday here some guy who is working on thee marvel universe section of marvel.com said that he was asked to remove baby May from the relatives section of Spider-Man. And I think JQ confirmed it in those lengly interviews I did not care to read in CBR. Something like "if there was no marriage then there is no baby cause Spider-Man can't have a baby out of... (what's the expression now, I can't remember?) anyway.