Space & Exploration

[dupont2005]

I don't think mankind is going to colonize any other planet or moon. Especially not at a rate where we could abandon Earth after we run out of whatever the next scary thing it. Our species will die on this planet some day, probably not any time soon, definitely not in any of our lifetimes. I don't think the colonization of alien planets should even be on the radar of our space program. Easier to just fix Earth. As inhabitable as Earth seems to you, Mars and the moon are even more inhabitable. Infinitely so. As far as private space exploration companies, as far as I know they are basically a tour bus that barely exits the Earth's atmosphere for a shirt while and then lands. REAL space exploration is not for tourists. REAL space exploration thus far isn't even profitable and real investors aren't even interested in retrieving a small number of samples from the moon for analysis. Where do I think NASA should be right now? I don't know a whole lot about their study on other planets or what benefits those studies have brought to mankind, but I am very interested in Japan's plan to launch a giant solar panel into orbit and I think we should be looking into that. I don't care all that much though because if we did do that as a nation it would be handed over to private interests who would gouge us just the same as they would no matter where our energy comes from so screw it.

[Marc]

We have made HUGE breakthroughs since the end of Apollo. Hubble has expanded our knowledge of space astronomically. We are constantly expanding our knowledge of distant galaxies and solar systems. Not to mention major advances in Astrophysics. I really do not care about getting to Mars. I am much more excited for the moons of Saturn and Jupiter. I really hope we can find some form of "life". I believe they are the future, not so much Mars. It just isn't a interesting planet to me.

I want to see the James Webb Space telescope in the sky soon! I am so pumped for that. It will be like Hubble on crank. It is going to be amazing. If I had the money, I would be donating so much to that program it wouldn't even be funny.

[Paradox]

chrisgiff notes the money:

I read something with Neil Degrasse Tyson recently where he said that it has to be a manned mission because that's the only way to capture the public's attention. People don't care about robots I guess. We have 2 rovers on Mars already, not to mention Voyager I, II and the Kepler out there and no one seems to care at all.

I will certainly agree with that, as far as funding goes. Scientifically, it doesn't make much difference, but yeah it's gotta be paid for.

[dupersuper]

I'm more and more leaning towards the current idea that putting a man on anywhere isn't all that necessary. It's far far more economical to send robots. Space exploration should continue, but manned missions don't bring a whole lot more to the picture than unmanned missions do.

In general robots would be safer, but long term we'll have to look at manned missions because:
1 overpopulation
2 decisions will need to be made if we establish mining or other facilities
3 every romantic "spirit of exploration" speech from Star Trek and other sci-fi
4 the aforementioned Neil Degrasse Tyson reason
5 research
6 possible alien contact if we start going far enough (I said long term)
7 sun dying (I said long term)

As inhabitable as Earth seems to you, Mars and the moon are even more inhabitable.

I think you meant uninhabitable...

[dupont2005]

Dang, that's what I typed. Goddamn autocorrect

[Archamedes]

Both the moon and mars are obviously uninhabitable on their own of course. As they lack the one thing we need to survive and that is oxygen...

However if mars had a breathable atmosphere, I think it looks no different than the nevada desert, just a bit more red

[Paradox]

Unfortunately, it's also covered in radiation (as was noted earlier in the thread) like the desert in Nevada!

[thehod]

Unfortunately, it's also covered in radiation (as was noted earlier in the thread) like the desert in Nevada!

And home to aliens. Just like the desert in Nevad.... <sound of silencer. THUD!>

[Archamedes]

And home to aliens. Just like the desert in Nevad.... <sound of silencer. THUD!>

its less of a home to the aliens, more a prison

[chrisgiff]

The thing that I really think is mind-blowing is that we essentially have no choice if we want to survive as a species.

The sun will explode in 5 billion years and destroy our solar system. Assuming humans live that long and have survived all the war, global warming, poverty, famine and disease that we create-we will have to not only get to Mars, but get completely out of our solar system and colonize another planet that we haven't even discovered yet.

Yeah...

[Paradox]

Assuming humans will still be around is kind of silly. Species don't last billions of years, especially "higher" ones. Even simple sharks, when you really stretch the definition, have only managed less than half a billion.

[chrisgiff]

Assuming humans will still be around is kind of silly. Species don't last billions of years, especially "higher" ones. Even simple sharks, when you really stretch the definition, have only managed less than half a billion.

Sharks and humans are really different. Nothing has ever existed on this planet that is as intelligent as us. Are you familiar with Ray Kurzweil at all? If more of his predictions come true, humans will eventually be immortal.

[Paradox]

Human arrogance and speculative wishful thinking. If we make things that make us "immortal" it wouldn't be humans, it'd be some new techno-species. And it's entirely possible that cetaceans and elephants are as intelligent as we are, as long as your only measure isn't "technological ability". We're basically really smart monkeys with a lot of toys.

[chrisgiff]

Human arrogance and speculative wishful thinking. If we make things that make us "immortal" it wouldn't be humans, it'd be some new techno-species. And it's entirely possible that cetaceans and elephants are as intelligent as we are, as long as your only measure isn't "technological ability". We're basically really smart monkeys with a lot of toys.

Fair enough.

I can see the singularity both ways though. I agree with the arrogance/other species bit, but I find the example that Kurzweil always uses to be pretty compelling: when he talks about the exponential growth of technology, he has said a child with a smart phone today has access to more information at any given time than Bill Clinton did as President.

I'm just saying that we are far more likely to colonize other planets than elephants. However, if I were a betting man I would say we would kill ourselves via nuclear war or environmental catastrophe way before the sun explodes.

[Paradox]

chrisgiff notes:

Fair enough.

I can see the singularity both ways though. I agree with the arrogance/other species bit, but I find the example that Kurzweil always uses to be pretty compelling: when he talks about the exponential growth of technology, he has said a child with a smart phone today has access to more information at any given time than Bill Clinton did as President.

Technically, yes, but how much of that is actual useful information? I mean, you can get regular updates on what Miley Cyrus is wearing today, but that doesn't really do much to advance the species.

I'm just saying that we are far more likely to colonize other planets than elephants.

And fair enough back atcha. But that's at least partially (if not more) due to our aggressive, conquering nature as opposed to our intelligence. Whales and elephants simply don't give a shit about that stuff.

However, if I were a betting man I would say we would kill ourselves via nuclear war or environmental catastrophe way before the sun explodes.

I don't think you'll get disagreement from anyone on that one.

WE'RE DOOMED! DOOMED I TELL YOU!!!!

...eventually.