EDT: My bad; Gwen died in 1973, making her dead almost fifteen years before I was even born, not ten. And I'm still sick of reading about her. I mean, sheesh, people complain that bring Osborn back "lessens the impact" of Amazing 121, but you know what really, really lessens its impact? Revisiting the story every other year. I'm sick of bridges and blonds.
Last edited by E. Wilson; 05-01-2012 at 12:46 PM.
Last edited by stillanerd; 05-01-2012 at 01:16 PM.
...so, your response to SAN's fairly well-phrased and thought-out response is one line?
Last edited by stillanerd; 05-01-2012 at 01:14 PM.
Maybe. While I agree that Otto is built to be a better nemesis, his list of achievements and personal relationship to Spider-Man pales in comparison to Norman's even if you remove "The Night Gwen Stacy Died" and "Sins Past".However, I do agree that the only reason why the Green Goblin is #1 is because he killed Gwen; otherwise, Doc Ock would be #1 instead of #2, as Ock has so many similarities and contrasts to Spidey to make him ideal arch-nemesis.
- Dealt Spidey his first major defeat where he considered giving up.
- First villain to unmask Spider-Man.
- Released Blackie Gaxton who killed Betty's brother dooming that relationship.
- Formed original Sinister Six
- Brain washed Spidey into becoming a criminal.
- Accidentally killed George Stacy
- Had relationship with and nearly married Aunt May.
- Nearly beat Black Cat to death, leading to Spider-Man doing the same to Otto.
- Saved Peter's life from Vultures virus.
- Blames Spider-Man for medical problems that are killing him.
- Father to best friend Harry, whom he set down the path to becoming a Goblin.
- First to disable Peter's spider sense.
- First villain to truly learn Spider-Man's identity.
- Mastermind of the whole mindjob that was the Clone Saga.
- Killed Peter's "brother" Ben.
- Poisoned Mary Jane.
- Abducted and possibly killed Baby May (Yeah I know new continuity this did not happen, but I still own the issue where it does.)
- Abducted Aunt May and replaced her with an actress.
- Bought the Bugle.
- Kidnapped, tortured, and brainwashed Peter to become a Goblin.
- Put Flash in a drunk driving coma.
- Attempted to blackmail Peter into betraying his morals and killing him.
- Kidnapped May from prison.
And that doesn't really even include the full number of times that Norman just really messed with Peter's head like sending him photos of family and friends in their homes, or the time he strung Peter up like a pinata hung him unmasked from his glider and flew him around town...
So yeah both have had their share of victories and beatings over Spidey, but Otto has never intentionally killed someone Peter cares about, and Otto has never really intentionally just screwed with Peter's head (not counting the brief mindcontrol thing). His relationship with May was not done to mess with Peter, even his hospitalizing of Felicia was because she had played a role in stopping him and was not just done to get to Spider-Man.
So despite the fact that I like Otto a good bit more than Norman, I think I would have to give the definite nod to Norman as having intentionally made things a lot more personal and being the bigger villain and archenemy to Peter.
And Norman is just a mad man. We loves our mad men in fiction.
Otto isn't really the same kind of crazy.
(I loved the story where Norman goes to the villain bar with Vulture and Kraven Jr.)
I'm shocked. SHOCKED!
I am an anarchist. Deal with it.