Was Jean Grey a Real Character or a Clone?/X-Factor a retrospective

[ExodusCloak]

[alf_to_the_rescue]

Jean looks very pretty asian.

[ExodusCloak]

Fongji is a perfect add-on to the Phoenix mythos when you think about it. Iron Fist was always hanging around Misty Knight and Jean Grey's studio apartment. The Phoenix Force mistook Jean Grey for Fongji. Bendis is damn good when it comes to ideas.

[otipep_90]

Fongji is a perfect add-on to the Phoenix mythos when you think about it. Iron Fist was always hanging around Misty Knight and Jean Grey's studio apartment. The Phoenix Force mistook Jean Grey for Fongji. Bendis is damn good when it comes to ideas.

That is PIS andnothing else. The only reason Ironfist ever hanged out at Jean's and Misty's apartment is because he was the landlord and Misty's boyfriend. What Bendis doesn't see in the long run or those that actually think this is a good idea, is that they are taking the significance of being a host away from any past and future host, including Hope. Why, because the only reason the PF is atracted to anyone now is because they are a red-head with green eyes. So Hope is not going to be a Phoenix avatar because she is the mutant messiah, but only because she is a red-head that is being confused for an ancient Chinese red-head. What a horriblely childish idea that is indeed. As a professional of the creative class one would expect more from him and Marvel. Why isn't the Black Widow, Mary-Jane Watson, or Ameila Voght the Phoenix?

[xhx23x]

I think the idea could still work for Hope if they make Hope reincarnation of Fongi and Jean of the descendant of the same.

[ExodusCloak]

Why isn't the Black Widow, Mary-Jane Watson, or Ameila Voght the Phoenix?

The story hasn't come out yet but none of those characters have much of a connection with Iron Fist. Hope will and who knows maybe there's something else that makes Fongji and Hope special.There are mysterious circumstances surrounding both Hope and Fongji's fathers (Which is not the case for Jean). It's a great idea by Mr. Bendis.

[alf_to_the_rescue]

Bendis fathered the Phoenix force.

[otipep_90]

Thats just dancing around the original idea of Hope being the reincarnation of Jean. How is that any better? Its not like Hope is going to servive this event. Because if she does she still has the issue that has being plaguing her since her conception, originality. She was never ment to be her own character as far as the story goes. Whatever little development she got as a seperate entity from Jean, was just so there would be some emotional lose when she would inevitably sacrifice herself for mutantkind and in the end Jean would be back. It would have been like Inferno when Jean and Maddie merged, after being fractured into two souls and bodies when Jean first turned into Phoenix (uncanny #100, classic #8).

[otipep_90]

The story hasn't come out yet but none of those characters have much of a connection with Iron Fist. Hope will and who knows maybe there's something else that makes Fongji and Hope special.There are mysterious circumstances surrounding both Hope and Fongji's fathers (Which is not the case for Jean). It's a great idea by Mr. Bendis.

So Bendis is going with the emaculate conception angle that Chris Claremont introduced for Rachel, until Marvel turned him down?

[ExodusCloak]

So Bendis is going with the emaculate conception angle that Chris Claremont introduced for Rachel, until Marvel turned him down?

It was alluded to in Fractions 5 Lights arc.

[Phoenix Egg]

"The Phoenix was looking at redheads trying to find Fongji" is a dumb idea.

It's just stupid.

I mean, would the Phoenix even see colors like that?

Why isn't Mary Jane Phoenix?



I think Bendis writes down the first random thought that comes into his head.


Just terrible.

[darknessatnoon]

1. There was never any rationale given as to why the Phoenix came to Jean in that space-shuttle, and every time Claremont tried to provide one it came off as vague and inconsequential. Morrison helped somewhat with his explanation of the Phoenix force, but he also opened the door to Fongji and Hope via the creation of the Phoenix Corps. Bendis is starting to fill in some blanks for us, connecting it to now classic continuity.

2. Damn, Fongji looks good. I think she might be a contender for hottest Phoenix.

[sweetdumbass]

Asian Phoenix doesn't contradict established continuity. Phoenix just wants Scott Summers to love "it". Endsong canon. And a red-haired fake asian girl is like his ultimate fantasy. Phoenix got it right the first time.

[otipep_90]

As was it in Gillen's Generation Hope. Wwhen the PF told Hope our children. In which case that means Fongji, Hope and even Jean are all daughters of the Phoenix. There is nothing to say that Jean's father was her real biological father, Elaine may have not known and after all none of the Greys were red-heads. In which case all three could just as easily be reincarnations of each other and the Phoenix Force. I mean how many daughters does the Phoenix need if they are not the same? Which is what Cable ment when said Hope is Phoenix, like Jean is Phoenix and Fongji is Phoenix. This again is dancing around the original idea of Hope being Jean reincarnated. This is much simpler than being another complicated clone saga or as trivial as just being a red-head that is confusing the PF. Does it not know that all Earth women with red hair are not the same person? One could easily say that the Pheonix is coming for Hope because it thinks its Fongji but the same can be said about Jean or Rachel. At least they are clearly caucasian like Hope and not half asian like Fongji? So if they are reincarnations of one another than they doen't need to look like a 100% alike.

[darknessatnoon]

As was it in Gillen's Generation Hope. Wwhen the PF told Hope our children. In which case that means Fongji, Hope and even Jean are all daughters of the Phoenix. There is nothing to say that Jean's father was her real biological father, Elaine may have not known and after all none of the Greys were red-heads. In which case all three could just as easily be reincarnations of each other and the Phoenix Force. I mean how many daughters does the Phoenix need if they are not the same? Which is what Cable ment when said Hope is Phoenix, like Jean is Phoenix and Fongji is Phoenix. This again is dancing around the original idea of Hope being Jean reincarnated. This is much simpler than being another complicated clone saga or as trivial as just being a red-head that is confusing the PF. Does it not know that all Earth women with red hair are not the same person? One could easily say that the Pheonix is coming for Hope because it thinks its Fongji but the same can be said about Jean or Rachel. At least they are clearly caucasian like Hope and not half asian like Fongji? So if they are reincarnations of one another than they doen't need to look like a 100% alike.

Hope is not Jean reincarnated. How many times does the editor of the X-Men have to answer that in interviews for you? Hope is the real thing. It only came to Jean to get to Scott's eye beams. And just because Hope's mom couldn't remember who the father was, doesn't mean there wasn't one. In fact, in the Messiah War flashback to Hope's birth, there was an unnamed relative alluded to by the nurse just as the Purifiers came in.