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  1. #1

    Default fate of female bat family members

    So the women of the bat clan have been, shall we say less then respected with the reboot. Huntress has been killed and replaced which as been discussed elsewhere,Batgirl well i wont get into. barbara has been retconned heavily and steph and cass have been "benched" with no hope in site it being specific to females it seems odd to me that they took the hit for the batman mythos yet none of the robins did.

    Do you guys think this was intentional maybe someone at dc thought "little girls dont read comics" so the hacked away all the females in the family save for oddly the two red heads.
    -this posters ragging on rob leifelds art is not ment as hatred toward the man he is a professional artist and got that way for a reason...however i cannot condone the use of pouches-

  2. #2
    Mind Controller ArnoldoAAD's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RohanRiderX View Post
    So the women of the bat clan have been, shall we say less then respected with the reboot. Huntress has been killed and replaced which as been discussed elsewhere,Batgirl well i wont get into. barbara has been retconned heavily and steph and cass have been "benched" with no hope in site it being specific to females it seems odd to me that they took the hit for the batman mythos yet none of the robins did.

    Do you guys think this was intentional maybe someone at dc thought "little girls dont read comics" so the hacked away all the females in the family save for oddly the two red heads.
    not to mention thatBatwoman barely have anything to do with Batman

    i guess Morrison is kind of right and the gayness of the batman concept ust attracts other men while the women fail to accomplish that for the same reason

    or maybe is just pure coincidence
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    Senior Member Ed Sizzers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ArnoldoAAD View Post
    not to mention thatBatwoman barely have anything to do with Batman
    To be honest, I consider that a plus.

    With regards to the other characters, I guess it's open to debate (a lot of debate usually!) if Barbara Gordon is better off now than before Flashpoint.

    The Huntress situation is weird, in that it's as though DC/Levitz specifically went out of their way to make it worse than it needed to be. Whilst some fans weren't happy that Helena W was going to the the Huntress, (once the true nature of World's Finest was received), I think most people did understand that it worked for the nature of the story. However, it's hard to look at the unneccesary off-screen 'killing off' of Bertinelli (and the manner/symbolism of the reveal on the first page of WF#1) as anything other than rubbing salt in the wound to her fans.

    Cass and Steph's treatment obviously hurts the most. None of the justification/excuses we've heard for not using them make any sense against the fact that all the former Robins are still active and their backstories (apparently) remain largely intact.
    Last edited by Ed Sizzers; 04-29-2012 at 12:41 AM.

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    Veteran Member JaggedFel's Avatar
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    IMO, DC Plays favorites and some characters like Cass Cain, Steph, Wally West, Donna, Connor Hawke, etc got shafted some of this because they wanted a younger DC Universe some of it because they don't like certain characters.
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  5. #5
    Mind Controller ArnoldoAAD's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ed Sizzers View Post
    To be honest, I consider that a plus.

    With regards to the other characters, I guess it's open to debate (a lot of debate usually!) if Barbara Gordon is better off now than before Flashpoint.

    The Huntress situation is weird, in that it's as though DC/Levitz specifically went out of their way to make it worse than it needed to be. Whilst some fans weren't happy that Helena W was going to the the Huntress, (once the true nature of World's Finest was received), I think most people did understand that it worked for the nature of the story. However, it's hard to look at the unneccesary off-screen 'killing off' of Bertinelli (and the manner/symbolism of the reveal on the first page of WF#1) as anything other than rubbing salt in the wound to her fans.

    Cass and Steph's treatment obviously hurts the most. None of the justification/excuses we've heard for not using them make any sense against the fact that all the former Robins are still active and their backstories (apparently) remain largely intact.
    i think is very obvious that Levitz started writing Huntress as Bertinelli and suddenly someone at DC told him to make the change
    but the change alone is complely uncalled for
    i dont even like what was done with powergirl on mr terrific, she was unlikable so who thought this was a good idea

    but being fair we will have to wait until the actual comic comes to judge fairly

    the treatment of Cass and Steph i think is something to be judged separately
    Cass was used before the relaunch very nicely in both Red Robin and Gates of Gotham and then it just stop
    it feels like she was finally getting back into business after a pretty long hiatus and then suddenly she goes back to hiatus again
    its unjustifiable just to make take less attention from barb

    the thing with Steph is more comprehensible, she doesnt have an easy continuity so relaunching her again as batgirl might had been a problem(a lesser of a problem than what is happening with current bg but thats my opinion)
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    The Alpha and The Omega Godlike13's Avatar
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    I think DC thought "character X isn't drawing enough readers" so they decided to change things and streamline focus on the ones they thought will draw more. I really don't know why people keep bring up the Robins. All the Robins present and past decently draw, which is why they are all still around.
    Last edited by Godlike13; 04-29-2012 at 01:53 AM.

  7. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by Godlike13 View Post
    I think DC thought "character X isn't drawing enough readers" so they decided change things and streamline focus on the ones they thought will draw more. I really don't know why people keep bring up the Robins. All the Robins decently draw, which is why they are all still around.
    ya know what god, your right. they are a better draw then the females, But it just seems odd that its a female only thing. the boys lost nothing, where as the girls lost EVERTHING hell tim even got to keep his old costume.
    Last edited by RohanRiderX; 04-29-2012 at 02:04 AM.
    -this posters ragging on rob leifelds art is not ment as hatred toward the man he is a professional artist and got that way for a reason...however i cannot condone the use of pouches-

  8. #8
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    Let's see. Babs has been de-aged and is less experienced than before, back to being a Distaff Counterpart of Batman, her relationships with - mostly woman - have been erased and the team she lead apparently never existed. Bertinelli was killed off screen. Steph has been benched and probably won't appear anytime soon and I doubt her development will be kept intact. Cass is apparently going to appear in Inc - but until I see the page, I'm not believeing it. The Court of Owls was the perfect moment to introduce her. Batwing is going to China and is teaming with... Nightwing of all people, another lost opportunity.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ed Sizzers View Post
    To be honest, I consider that a plus.
    So do I. If she was more connected to Batman and her solo hadn't been planned before the reboot, I bet she would be gone too.

  9. #9
    Senior Member WhitOro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shark View Post
    Batwing is going to China and is teaming with... Nightwing of all people, another lost opportunity.
    Yeah seriously. Batwing + Cassandra would have been the most kickass team up of the Bat-Universe (Wonder Woman + Aquaman being the best of universe).
    Also, Red Hood have been hanging around Hong Kong for a while in his book, both in flashbacks and in the present, and even Cassandra's shadow doesn't shows up.

  10. #10
    Junior Member Little MY's Avatar
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    Question: Fate of Female Bat Family Members?
    Answer: The Fridge.

    Batgirl: Insecure little girl with mommy and victim issues.
    Huntress (Helena B): Killed
    Huntress (Helena W): An obnoxious stalwart, who has identity and self esteem issues.
    Oracle: erased
    Black Canary: No longer a strong determined passionate 3d legacy character, instead a stoic spy who purportedly murdered her husband either by shattering his skull with a Canary cry or a punch Dc can’t make up their mind.
    Catwoman: Batman’s love slave, who enjoy’s posing in every page.
    Princess Kori: A promiscuous sex slave, whose main objective is to titillate the heroes that run the show.
    Posion Ivy: Team member with less screen/page time than supporting newcomers.
    Cass: MIA
    Steph: MIA

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by ArnoldoAAD View Post
    i guess Morrison is kind of right and the gayness of the batman concept ust attracts other men while the women fail to accomplish that for the same reason

    or maybe is just pure coincidence
    I said the exact same thing, although it was more tongue in cheek. But thinking about it, I think the idea that the females in the Batman family are expendable, and only Alfred, Robins, etc. are the stable ones sort of only supports what Morrison said.

  12. #12

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    Cassandra Cain, Stephanie Brown, and Helena Bertinelli are out of the picture altogether. Selina Kyle, Barbara Gordon, and Dinah Lance are still in the spotlight but have all undergone a serious regression in character, making them far weaker- and, at least for the first two, virtually unrecognizable- characters from the versions before the reboot. Only Kate Kane was remained unscathed.

    Yet Damian is still around, despite him seriously aging Bruce Wayne and going against the New 52 reason d'etre of de-aging the super-heroes. I guess that must be because he's so integral to what Morrison is doing. Jason Todd's also still here and he's one character I wish would just stay dead and never be mentioned again.
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  13. #13

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    Male-led comics outsell female-led comics. This is not unique to Batman, and it's not unique to DC. That's the market.

    So, yes, titles/characters that were selling well pre-boot, had less reason to shake things up; they were already successful. Even good ol' Supes got regressed. And there are lots of Robins because Robins outsell Batgirls.

    As others have said, we still have Batwoman, Batgirl, Catwoman, Birds of Prey, World's Finest - the Bat-ladies aren't doing too bad for themselves. Last time I checked, Marvel, the market leader, doesn't have as many female-led comics as the Bat-ladies.
    Last edited by americanwonder; 04-29-2012 at 11:04 AM.
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  14. #14

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    O i entirely forgot about cat woman, the made her crazy. or well she comes off crazy what the hell.and not not happ with bailing on the history with bruce.
    Last edited by RohanRiderX; 04-29-2012 at 01:25 PM.
    -this posters ragging on rob leifelds art is not ment as hatred toward the man he is a professional artist and got that way for a reason...however i cannot condone the use of pouches-

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by RohanRiderX View Post
    So the women of the bat clan have been, shall we say less then respected with the reboot. Huntress has been killed and replaced which as been discussed elsewhere,Batgirl well i wont get into. barbara has been retconned heavily and steph and cass have been "benched" with no hope in site it being specific to females it seems odd to me that they took the hit for the batman mythos yet none of the robins did.

    Do you guys think this was intentional maybe someone at dc thought "little girls dont read comics" so the hacked away all the females in the family save for oddly the two red heads.
    Im a little girl at heart...

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