Peter Parker x Carlie Cooper: The Black Cat Connection

[Kevinroc]

I am not trying to force any team ups at all. When I talked about the said heroines, I was implying that the ones I have mentioned have mutual feelings for Spider-Man. And the only way for a mutual relationship to be establish is by dating. And I believed that part of the relationship should be kept in the background, like the one he has with Carol Danvers as friends. The reason why I felt that Ms. Marvel, Silver Sable, Psylocke, Spider-Woman, She-Hulk, or Black Widow could work is because of shared interest in the same manner as he had with The Black Cat before OMD ever happened. This is just a list of heroines who might have an interest with Spider-Man. It does give another writer the option of using any one of them from that list to use in a story with Spider-Man. I never said that any of these heroines will ever have the sort of relationship that Spidey had with the Pre-OMD Black Cat. But the list comes quite close to the sorts of heroines who would want a similar relationship with Spider-Man.

What you're arguing sounds very forced. I don't mind team-ups but this sounds very forced and repetitive. (You even evoke Black Cat's name in how you think they should all have an interest in Spider-Man like Felicia.)

I want random team-ups of fun. Silver Surfer. Nova. Red She-Hulk. Emma Frost. Bring 'em on!

[Darthfury78]

What you're arguing sounds very forced. I don't mind team-ups but this sounds very forced and repetitive. (You even evoke Black Cat's name in how you think they should all have an interest in Spider-Man like Felicia.)

I want random team-ups of fun. Silver Surfer. Nova. Red She-Hulk. Emma Frost. Bring 'em on!

I wasn't trying to be forceful at all. I know that Spidey's friendship with Ms. Marvel is far different from his friendship with The Black Cat. I was implying that the woman who are interested in Spider-Man respectively would have a partnership that's different from the one he had with Black Cat. It's sorta similar to Batman's love interests:

http://geek-news.mtv.com/2011/03/22/...ove-interests/

So, it's possible that a mutual relationship with either:

Ms. Marvel
Silver Sable
Psylocke
Black Widow
She-Hulk
Spider-Woman

Could become much more than that. But I doubt that it will go beyond the friends level for obvious reasons.

[Kevinroc]

I wasn't trying to be forceful at all. I know that Spidey's friendship with Ms. Marvel is far different from his friendship with The Black Cat. I was implying that the woman who are interested in Spider-Man respectively would have a partnership that's different from the one he had with Black Cat. It's sorta similar to Batman's love interests:

http://geek-news.mtv.com/2011/03/22/...ove-interests/

So, it's possible that a mutual relationship with either:

Ms. Marvel
Silver Sable
Psylocke
Black Widow
She-Hulk
Spider-Woman

Could become much more than that. But I doubt that it will go beyond the friends level for obvious reasons.

Still sounds like an anime harem style situation. As if we didn't have enough of that with Peter's relationships with civilians. Let's not try to turn Spider-Man into Tenchi Muyo here.

I want to see Spidey team up with everybody. Not just these six costumed ladies. That sounds boring.

[One More Day]

Still sounds like an anime harem style situation. As if we didn't have enough of that with Peter's relationships with civilians. Let's not try to turn Spider-Man into Tenchi Muyo here.

I want to see Spidey team up with everybody. Not just these six costumed ladies. That sounds boring.

I don't want to see Spidey team up with anyone. What happened to when they distrusted him and thought he was a wall crawling menace?

[Zak213]

Does she actually have these hex powers and did carlie and felicia ever interact?

[Darthfury78]

Still sounds like an anime harem style situation. As if we didn't have enough of that with Peter's relationships with civilians. Let's not try to turn Spider-Man into Tenchi Muyo here.

I want to see Spidey team up with everybody. Not just these six costumed ladies. That sounds boring.

I wasn't talking about an anime harem for Spider-Man. On the contrary. Like you, I want to see Spidey team-up with everyone. But, the six heroines that I was talking about would fall into the The Black Cat type friendship that he had with her before OMD. This meant that he never had a romantic relationship with Felicia while he was married to Mary Jane. This doesn't necessary mean a team-up story. I was implying that Felicia isn't the only heroine who wanted to have a relationship with Spider-Man. I only talked about the six heroines who might have feelings for Spidey in the same manner that Felicia did when she knew that Spidey was Peter Parker.

Let's remember that the six heroines that I identified who might be interested in Spider-Man/Peter Parker are those he would never expect to have an attraction to him. And The Black Cat isn't the first costumed heroine to fall for Spider-Man; it was The Black Widow. Otherwise, why would she attacked him in the first place when she first appeared in ASM #87 in her new costume? The Black Widow is powerful enough to take on Spider-Man if she really wanted to in a rematch after her first defeat by him. Natasha isn't a woman that takes defeat lightly. Especially not by a man, such as Spider-Man. But that's just my opinion.

[Kevinroc]

I wasn't talking about an anime harem. Like you, I want to see Spidey team-up with everyone. But, the six heroines that I was talking about would fall into the The Black Cat type friendship that he had with her before OMD. This meant that he never had a romantic relationship with Felicia while he was married to Mary Jane. This doesn't necessary mean a team-up story. I was implying that Felicia isn't the only heroine who wanted to have a relationship with Spider-Man. I only talked about the six heroines who might have feelings for Spidey in the same manner that Felicia did when she knew that Spidey was Peter Parker.

Let's remember that the six heroines that I identified who might be interested in Spider-Man/Peter Parker are those he would never expect to have an attraction to him. And The Black Cat isn't the first costumed heroine to fall for Spider-Man; it was The Black Widow. Otherwise, why would she attacked him in the first place when she first appeared in ASM #87 in her new costume? The Black Widow is powerful enough to take on Spider-Man if she really wanted to in a rematch after her first defeat by him. Natasha isn't a woman that takes defeat lightly. Especially not by a man, such as Spider-Man. But that's just my opinion.

Spider-Man and his Amazing Platonic Female Super Friends?

[Darthfury78]

Spider-Man and his Amazing Platonic Female Super Friends?

A cool thought. Although I could see his platonic female friends get scattered around so that no one knows who his platonic partner will be in a pool of other superheroes who he teams up with in future storylines. And this makes it less likely that some else will come along and tear it a part, since its not a romantic relationship. Gives a writer an alternative to The Black Cat if he doesn't want to use her with Spider-Man.

[Kevinroc]

A cool thought. Although I could see his platonic female friends get scattered around so that no one knows who his platonic partner will be in a pool of other superheroes who he teams up with in future storylines. And this makes it less likely that some else will come along and tear it a part, since its not a romantic relationship. Gives a writer an alternative to The Black Cat if he doesn't want to use her with Spider-Man.

It really sounds more like such a set-up will eventually just be ignored and forgotten about rather than "torn apart." And then somebody else will have Spidey team up with one of these characters again and odds are won't place a large amount of emphasis on friendship.

(Besides. Spidey shouldn't have too many friends he's really close to.)

[Darthfury78]

It really sounds more like such a set-up will eventually just be ignored and forgotten about rather than "torn apart." And then somebody else will have Spidey team up with one of these characters again and odds are won't place a large amount of emphasis on friendship.

(Besides. Spidey shouldn't have too many friends he's really close to.)

I agree. But the heroines I've talked about won't be forgotten so easily. Especially since the six women I have mentioned are very much is use. And a friendship with Spider-Man that could become a serious relationship is quite appealing to the writers who wouldn't mind going in that direction with the heroines I've talked about with Spider-Man into their stories. And a friendship with Spider-Man allows that writer to take the relationship adventures to different places that we could only imagine. And it's been close to 30 years since Spidey and Black Cat were in a serious relationship ended. And that has not been forgotten.

[Kevinroc]

I agree. But the heroines I've talked about won't be forgotten so easily. Especially since the six women I have mentioned are very much is use. And a friendship with Spider-Man that could become a serious relationship is quite appealing to the writers who wouldn't mind going in that direction with the heroines I've talked about with Spider-Man into their stories. And a friendship with Spider-Man allows that writer to take the relationship adventures to different places that we could only imagine. And it's been close to 30 years since Spidey and Black Cat were in a serious relationship ended. And that has not been forgotten.

That's the real problem. Any relationship you described going forward would be seen as some kind of partial retread of Black Cat. Black Cat was created to be a part of Spidey's world. Characters like Black Widow and Carol Danvers were not.

In fact, Jessica Drew was intentionally created to be separate from Spidey's world.

I think what you're hoping for is pretty much impossible. You'll see Spidey team-up with them but anything that evokes anything similar to Black Cat? Not gonna happen.

[Darthfury78]

That's the real problem. Any relationship you described going forward would be seen as some kind of partial retread of Black Cat. Black Cat was created to be a part of Spidey's world. Characters like Black Widow and Carol Danvers were not.

In fact, Jessica Drew was intentionally created to be separate from Spidey's world.

I think what you're hoping for is pretty much impossible. You'll see Spidey team-up with them but anything that evokes anything similar to Black Cat? Not gonna happen.

I never said that such a relationship was going to be exactly like the Black Cat. You're right that it isn't going to happen because none of the women mentioned has Felicia's personality mindset.

And I never said that Black Widow or Carol Danvers will be a part of Spidey's as a statue quo. Nor would She-Hulk, Spider-Woman, or Psylocke. Then again, just because a character is created within Spider-Man doesn't mean that they have to be a part of his world. And the opposite could be true as well. I never said that any of the heroines mentioned have to be in Spidey world. Nor did I ever said that they have to be in The Amazing Spider-Man.

But I will admit that out of the list of women I've mentioned, I don't know if any of them will be of interest to any other writer who gets to write Spider-Man or his related books. Six heroines as Spidey's friends isn't too many in my opinion. And like anyone who are your friends, you don't see them in one place because they are scattered all over the place. They will not appear in Spider-Man's life all the time. Nor will he appear in theirs. The list of heroines I talked about are simply alternatives to the Black Cat. Thus, I only based it on the character's background history and felt that they would fit into the type of friendships that Spider-Man had with Felicia. This is just the Spider-Man side that I felt needed a little diversity in the Black Cat category. But it doesn't mean it has to be a romantic relationship, while the potential is there. This means that while there is a potential friendship, any one of the heroines mentioned could have a relationship with Spidey beyond the friends level. But it doesn't mean that they should.

I have never advocate a status quo within The Amazing Spider-Man as the types of partnership I talked about could/should happen outside of The Amazing Spider-Man into either Avenging Spider-Man or Astonishing Spider-Man storyline mini-series. The flagship Spider-Man title(ASM) should be about Spidey's world, which I agree with. But if characters like the Black Cat isn't available for a proposed ASM storyline, why not use an outside character like The Black Widow? Everything doesn't always have to be Spidey exclusive because they are other writers who would like to use those Spidey created characters for their respective title series, like The Punisher, Daredevil, or Captain America.

You did mentioned that Spider-Woman was created to be separate from Spidey's world. That's true. But what about Julia Carpenter as she was the second Spider-Woman who never had much contact with Spider-Man world until she became the new Madam Web. But even she doesn't appear that often either. I wouldn't be surprise if Julia starts to bother Jessica Drew from time to time with her premonitions as she does with Spider-Man.

[Darthfury78]

Well. I think I'd better stay on topic. I just think Felicia bad luck powers had the ability to jinx anyone she choose. We do not know the full extent of its powers. So, I assumed that Carlie and Peter's relationship was doomed the moment when he broke up with Felicia by telling her that he found the perfect person as his new girlfriend. And I felt that's the reason why Carlie broke up with him. I still hope that Carlie and Peter will come to an understanding and slowly rebuild their trust in each other once again.

[thecrimson]

Well. I think I'd better stay on topic. I just think Felicia's bad luck powers had the ability to jinx anyone she chose. We do not know the full extent of its powers. So, I assumed that Carlie and Peter's relationship was doomed the moment when he broke up with Felicia by telling her that he found the perfect person as his new girlfriend. And I felt that's the reason why Carlie broke up with him. I still hope that Carlie and Peter will come to an understanding and slowly rebuild their trust in each other once again.

Black Cat wasn't ever really his girlfriend though. They were more friends with benefits. And Cat's jinx powers have never worked unless she was around them, so for this to have worked, she would have had to stalk Peter and Carlie 24/7. And even then it doesn't cause break-ups. Carlie was able to figure out Pete's identity because the magic spell protecting his identity was nullified (and not by Cat; she wasn't even around when he nullified the spell). Again, Cat isn't one to go out for revenge, especially in recent times. Maybe if this were when she was first introduced...but she couldn't use her powers in such a way at any rate.

She's never been able to hex anyone, just affect probability fields, causing improbable, but not impossible, things to happen to enemies within her line of sight. It's even happened several times to Spidey in recent times.

[Spider-Dragon]

Well. I think I'd better stay on topic. I just think Felicia bad luck powers had the ability to jinx anyone she choose. We do not know the full extent of its powers. So, I assumed that Carlie and Peter's relationship was doomed the moment when he broke up with Felicia by telling her that he found the perfect person as his new girlfriend. And I felt that's the reason why Carlie broke up with him. I still hope that Carlie and Peter will come to an understanding and slowly rebuild their trust in each other once again.

Trust perhaps, but being with Peter is a place that is for Mary Jane alone...they will end up back together, most likely in issue #700 when Peter hands the mantle of Spider-Man over to someone else.