The New 52: Is There A Miscommunication Between DC And Old Fans?

[Lexrules]

I'm a long-time fan (but still relatively young--I'm only 27), but I haven't really been bothered by the New 52 at all. In fact, I'm glad it happened. I think it should've been done a long time ago actually.

Your a young man. I'm 39 and have been reading since 1978. I'm a long time fan. Your still a young-in.

[Zak213]

I think most of the miscommunication came thru the pr as they weren't able to describe what exactly this thing was and the state of continuity

[CaptCleghorn]

I've been fairly open in that I don't like the DCnU. A lot of what i enjoyed was cancelled or changed into something that lost the appeal I had for it.

Let's start with poster girl Barbara Gordon. Before Flashpoint, she was a more mature woman (late 20's, maybe even 30?). Because of her time in a wheelchair, she was forced to develop other qualities to survive as a viable character. She did and grew tremendously as leader of Birds of Prey. Now she's a much younger heroine minus the growth she'd had in the previous couple of decades. It was like getting another season of the Sopranos with Big Pussy, but losing any development characters like Carmela and Christopher got. I've seen those episodes already and I want the next step, not a recap of the last.

My main criticism is that the DCnU is much more retelling than advancing. Wally doesn't take over from Barry; Barry's story starts again. In 1971, Denny O'Neil updates the trinity, in 1985, Superman and Wonder Woman were revamped, but the other heroes pretty much remained the same. In 2011, most of the DCU went through major changes.

I have books I'd LOVE to see. But I'm also aware that if published peobably wouldn't sell. My tastes and likes are in the minority. It's OK. I drink Moxie, I eat anchovy pizza; I'm used to this. I'm sure if DC could sell me more books that a lot of other people would buy as well, they would.

[lantern1991]

I don't know about everyone but for me it doesn't bother me that some of the history doesn't matter anymore I can still read those old stories and still enjoy them even if they have been erased from the current continuity

[Buried Alien]

I don't know about everyone but for me it doesn't bother me that some of the history doesn't matter anymore I can still read those old stories and still enjoy them even if they have been erased from the current continuity

We certainly can. In terms of reading the current books with the current versions of the characters, however, we need to make certain mental and emotional adjustments. Until September, 2011, who the characters were was the sum total of who they had been for decades. With much of that history now altered beyond recognition, for better or worse, we're meeting the characters all over again. We cannot assume that everything we've known about these characters for years or even decades remains applicable.

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

[BohemiaDrinker]

We certainly can. In terms of reading the current books with the current versions of the characters, however, we need to make certain mental and emotional adjustments. Until September, 2011, who the characters were was the sum total of who they had been for decades. With much of that history now altered beyond recognition, for better worse, we're meeting the characters all over again. We cannot assume that everything we've known about these characters for years or even decades remains applicable.

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

Pretty much. I have said on te boards that some characters that I used to love, now I`m totally indifferent to, the main examples being Barbara Gordon and Black Canary; Barbara, I`m not really feeling her new history. I hope I don`t sound like a jerk saying, but for me is not that she`s walking, but pretty much about what happened while she was on the chair. Wen it was "she lost the use of her legs, but was able to let go and become more important to the DCU and competent that she ever was before", I thought it was awesome. Now it appears that she just lost the use of her legs and then gained it again, and there`s a lot of moping around involved.... and I just don`t care. Dinah is even a worse; she remains largely unchanged, but somehow the fact that it was not Wildcat that taught her boxing, that her mother was not BC before her and all that stuff really make the character feel hollow to me.

[MajorHoy]

I've been fairly open in that I don't like the DCnU. A lot of what i enjoyed was cancelled or changed into something that lost the appeal I had for it.

Let's start with poster girl Barbara Gordon. Before Flashpoint, she was a more mature woman (late 20's, maybe even 30?). Because of her time in a wheelchair, she was forced to develop other qualities to survive as a viable character. She did and grew tremendously as leader of Birds of Prey. Now she's a much younger heroine minus the growth she'd had in the previous couple of decades. It was like getting another season of the Sopranos with Big Pussy, but losing any development characters like Carmela and Christopher got. I've seen those episodes already and I want the next step, not a recap of the last.

Pretty much. I have said on te boards that some characters that I used to love, now I`m totally indifferent to, the main examples being Barbara Gordon and Black Canary; Barbara, I`m not really feeling her new history. I hope I don`t sound like a jerk saying, but for me is not that she`s walking, but pretty much about what happened while she was on the chair. When it was "she lost the use of her legs, but was able to let go and become more important to the DCU and competent that she ever was before", I thought it was awesome. Now it appears that she just lost the use of her legs and then gained it again, and there`s a lot of moping around involved.... and I just don`t care.

I do wonder how many of the changes (especially to Babsgirl) for the DCnU may have been influenced by what was presented to people in their cartoons rather than in past comic book stories. Was she ever shown as Oracle in the animated series (not the movies)?

In the case of Flash, I know he was "Barry" on the live-action show years ago. Did they ever say who he really was in the animated Justice League series?

And, yes, I know that by using this theory, we'd have John Stewart instead of Hal as the main DCnU Green Lantern. But Hal's book was still popular before the change to the DCnU, and John Stewart is still a Green Lantern.

[shark]

I do wonder how many of the changes (especially to Babsgirl) for the DCnU may have been influenced by what was presented to people in their cartoons rather than in past comic book stories. Was she ever shown as Oracle in the animated series (not the movies)?

In the case of Flash, I know he was "Barry" on the live-action show years ago. Did they ever say who he really was in the animated Justice League series?

And, yes, I know that by using this theory, we'd have John Stewart instead of Hal as the main DCnU Green Lantern. But Hal's book was still popular before the change to the DCnU, and John Stewart is still a Green Lantern.

Oracle only appeared in the Batman and the games. Babs has been the only Batgirl DC/Warner ever cared to promote, no wonder the other two are obscure.

Besides, that doesn't really work as an excuse. TV fans are more familiar with Wally and John, not Barry and Hal. You have Donna in BFF and Cassie in YJ and the comics, so this isn't to avoid confusion either. Damian only appeared in one episode of Batman: The Brave and the Bold, yet he is Robin when Dick is easily the most popular and well known one and Tim is the one that had a successful book for years. Then you have the cartoon version of Teen Titans and the popular comics of the 80s, yet most characters are either gone (Wally, Donna, Raven) or completely changed (Starfire, Roy Harper).

[Lexrules]

Only in the Batman. Babs has been the only Batgirl DC/Warner ever cared to promote, no wonder the other two are obscure.

Besides, that doesn't really work as an excuse. TV fans are more familiar with Wally and John, not Barry and Hal. You have Donna in BFF and Cassie in YJ and the comics, so this isn't to avoid confusion either. Damian only appeared in one episode of Batman: The Brave and the Bold, yet he is Robin when Dick is easily the most popular and well known one and Tim is the one that had a successful book for years. Then you have the cartoon version of Teen Titans and the popular comics of the 80s, yet most characters are either gone (Wally, Donna, Raven) or completely changed (Starfire, Roy Harper).

That depends on what generation you grew up in. For a child of the late 70's into middle 80's Barry and Hal are your Flash and GL. That was the gen raised on The Superfriends.

[shark]

That depends on what generation you grew up in. For a child of the late 70's into middle 80's Barry and Hal are your Flash and GL. That was the gen raised on The Superfriends.

Isn't DC trying to entice younger people or people who haven't tried comics before?

I watched Superfriends and I honestly don't remember if Barry's identity was a big deal. And Hal is not my GL either, I barely paid attention to him.

I do remember the Wonder Twins though. Where are they in this reboot?

[wiski]

I have never read Kingdom Come, Infinite Crisis and most other pre-Flashpoint essentials, or anything pre-Flashpoint at all actually. DC understands that I am the future, and that my race, the New 52ers are the next generation in the industry.

This fits with the example of my cousin, who was all Marvel all the time since we were kids. He is currently getting sick of Marvel shenanigans and is excited to have an easy point of entry into DC books.

[Lexrules]

Isn't DC trying to entice younger people or people who haven't tried comics before?

I watched Superfriends and I honestly don't remember if Barry's identity was a big deal. And Hal is not my GL either, I barely paid attention to him.

I do remember the Wonder Twins though. Where are they in this reboot?

Well Things go in circles as Barry and Hal are this Gens GL and Flash again now too.

And Yes, we need to see Wonder Twins powers activate...

[Lexrules]

I have never read Kingdom Come, Infinite Crisis and most other pre-Flashpoint essentials, or anything pre-Flashpoint at all actually. DC understands that I am the future, and that my race, the New 52ers are the next generation in the industry.

Man. Not telling you what to do but I'm telling you what to do, Go out and read those stories and learn the history of the most historic comic book company of them all. You are only hurting yourself by not doing so.

[shark]

Well Things go in circles as Barry and Hal are this Gens GL and Flash again now too.

And Yes, we need to see Wonder Twins powers activate...

That's the thing, is not because they are the most iconic, it's because the people in charge like them and grew up with them.

I guess we need to wait until fans of Wally and Donna take over DC.

[Lexrules]

That's the thing, is not because they are the most iconic, it's because the people in charge like them and grew up with them.

I guess we need to wait until fans of Wally and Donna take over DC.

Most Likely. It's sad we all can't get what we want when DC has the means to do so.