Uncanny X-Men 11 (Spoilers)

[Deus ex Chris]

Please re-read what I wrote. I said Rulk is/was a variable that has shown to take extreme measures in the past. I didn't say the Avengers were out for blood. Again, Petey chose the lesser of two evils by submitting (if you will) to Rulk instead of Cyttorak.

I ignored that part, since that was the pretty obvious implication. Colossus had to be the one to submit in order for the fight to end.

[mikekerrIII]

I'm sorry but how does that mandate from Cyclops translate to the Avengers being out for blood? The Avengers weren't there to kill anybody. Captain America told Cyclops as much, and I think we can assume that's understood amongst the X-Men. Captain America doesn't roll that way, so Colossus wasn't endangering anyone by throwing the fight.

From an in Universe perspective why would you trust that Rulk is not out for blood?

[mikekerrIII]

Yes, Colossus should have beat the Rulk. And he would have, if he did not give up his advantage at the last minute. The fight begins with Rulk beating down Colossus. Then Colossus going Cytorrak and pummeling Rulk into submission, blowing off any blows dealt to him. The fight could have ended there, if Colossus would have allowed the Cytorrak side of him to finish off the Rulk. But ripping off the helmet was removing the Cytorrak advantage, and him returning to Colossus form. A lame finish, but only means that so far, the X-men seem to be holding back more than their Avenger counterparts. Round one goes to the Avengers. But expect the X-men to start going all in when their backs are against the wall.

If they had contined fighting people on Utopia and all the folk under it might have been killed. Was beating rulk worth that?

[Deus ex Chris]

From an in Universe perspective why would you trust that Rulk is not out for blood?

Because he's following the orders of Captain America and seems to have changed his tune anyway.

[mikekerrIII]

I'm sorry but how does that mandate from Cyclops translate to the Avengers being out for blood? The Avengers weren't there to kill anybody. Captain America told Cyclops as much, and I think we can assume that's understood amongst the X-Men. Captain America doesn't roll that way, so Colossus wasn't endangering anyone by throwing the fight.

He sure as hell was en danging Hope and the future of the Mutants He made the right choice but it was taking a risk.

[Deus ex Chris]

He sure as hell was en danging Hope and the future of the Mutants He made the right choice but it was taking a risk.

How was he--I assume you mean Captain America--endangering Hope and the future of mutants? Hope wasn't in any danger until Colossus turned into a demon and, of course, when Wolverine tried to gut her.

[mikekerrIII]

Because he's following the orders of Captain America and seems to have changed his tune anyway.

He has chosen for himself when to obey orders, is known for being willing to kill, and even in his human form is a nutcase.

Wolverine was under the order of Cap also and that didn't stop him

[mikekerrIII]

How was he endangering Hope and the future of mutants? Hope wasn't in any danger until he turned into a demon and, you know, when Wolverine tried to gut her.

She was in danger form Caps idiotic plan for one, she was in danger if she was moved away from people that would protect her.

And if She doesn't get the PF it looks like the mutants are doomed to extinction and Caps is trying to prevent that from happening

[Deus ex Chris]

He has chosen for himself when to obey orders, is known for being willing to kill, and even in his human form is a nutcase.

Wolverine was under the order of Cap also and that didn't stop him

You asked for an "in universe" reason, and I gave it, Mike. I've already mentioned Wolverine. Try to keep up.

[Deus ex Chris]

She was in danger form Caps idiotic plan for one, she was in danger if she was moved away from people that would protect her.

And if She doesn't get the PF it looks like the mutants are doomed to extinction and Caps is trying to prevent that from happening

We've already done this, and your misreading was corrected. Captain America was there to protect her and the Earth--which would include mutants--and he attempted to enlist the X-Men's help to do it.

[Kieran_Frost]

BRILLIANT ISSUE!!! How do people NOT see the X-men as the wounded party in this? Thank-you, thank-you, THANK-YOU Kieron Gillen, for making it clear how amazing, awesome and good the X-cast is... Steve Rogers, you should be ashamed of yourself! Loved this issue, everyone got some great time to shine; this is EXACTLY what a tie-in story should be, Bendis! Not a random tangent of pointlessness!!!

[Perfection/Emma 2]

Rulk and Wolverine are piece of shits that deserve the most painful death imaginable

[mikekerrIII]

We've already done this, and your misreading was corrected. Captain America was there to protect her and the Earth--which would include mutants--and he attempted to enlist the X-Men's help to do it.

What part of Caps plan provides any protection at all to Hope?

He intended to protect her, but that protection sees to mainly be an intent to remove her from anyone that can help her, and moving her off planet provides no defense for her at all. Being surrounded by people who will both protect her and whom she can get power from is protecting her, feeding her to the PF without that Back-up is not protection. It also leaves Earth with no protection at all from the PF.

[Deus ex Chris]

What part of Caps plan provides any protection at all to Hope?

He intended to protect her, but that protection sees to mainly be an intent to remove her from anyone that can help her, and moving her off planet provides no defense for her at all. Being surrounded by people who will both protect her and whom she can get power from is protecting her, feeding her to the PF without that Back-up is not protection. It also leaves Earth with no protection at all from the PF.

They're operating under the assumption that the Phoenix is coming directly for Hope, since she's--you know--the only person on Earth manifesting Phoenix power. That's where the hope that it'll save the Earth comes from. They're trying to change its trajectory. Moving her helps her, if only by delaying the Phoenix and giving them more time to come up with something better. It's not a great plan, but it's better than just waiting.

[mikekerrIII]

They're operating under the assumption that the Phoenix is coming directly for Hope, since she's--you know--the only person on Earth manifesting Phoenix power. That's where the hope that it'll save the Earth comes from. They're trying to change its trajectory. Moving her helps her, if only by delaying the Phoenix and giving them more time to come up with something better. It's not a great plan, but it's better than just waiting.

Wther it is better than waiting is the subjevct of the debate here

What if it is not coming for Hope?
What if it coming for someone else, or in it's apparently crazed state is coming back to someplace it's familiar with?
Maybe it is coming for Quire, Emma or the Cuckoos all of which could be possible hosts
what is it comes to Earth before looking for Hope elsewhere?

Can the Avengers move Hope far enough away for any meaningful delay? Putting her on Alpha Centari would only provide a miniscule delay for example, not enough to make a fall back plan, that is if it doesn't simply jump to earth. The thing is moving at hundreds of times the speed of light or more and can go anywhere in the omniverse.