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  1. #511
    Wallace Likes It That Way Deus ex Chris's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikekerrIII View Post
    Wther it is better than waiting is the subjevct of the debate here

    What if it is not coming for Hope?
    What if it coming for someone else, or in it's apparently crazed state is coming back to someplace it's familiar with?
    Maybe it is coming for Quire, Emma or the Cuckoos all of which could be possible hosts
    what is it comes to Earth before looking for Hope elsewhere?

    Can the Avengers move Hope far enough away for any meaningful delay? Putting her on Alpha Centari would only provide a miniscule delay for example, not enough to make a fall back plan, that is if it doesn't simply jump to earth. The thing is moving at hundreds of times the speed of light or more and can go anywhere in the omniverse.
    Once again, Hope is the only one on Earth manifesting the Phoenix Force. She's the likely target. That's just common sense.

    As for how far they can move her, I guess that depends on the writers, Mike. As written, Captain America seems to think he could make some difference. However, it doesn't seem like we'll ever find out, since the story's veered down a different path.

    Of course, Illyana could certainly move her far enough for a meaningful delay--Dr. Strange and Thor too. That's not the way it's playing out, though.

  2. #512
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    Reading the blurbs for upcoming issues of AVX it appears Hope takes matters into her own hands and will be on the blue side of the moon when The Phoenix reaches earth. So she's off planet, but still not at a safe difference away from earth.

  3. #513
    Elder Member mikekerrIII's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deus ex Chris View Post
    Once again, Hope is the only one on Earth manifesting the Phoenix Force. She's the likely target. That's just common sense.

    As for how far they can move her, I guess that depends on the writers, Mike. As written, Captain America seems to think he could make some difference. However, it doesn't seem like we'll ever find out, since the story's veered down a different path.

    Of course, Illyana could certainly move her far enough for a meaningful delay--Dr. Strange and Thor too. That's not the way it's playing out, though.
    Th thing is unless they can mover here completely out of the Omniverse, not just to another dimension the can't mover her far enough away to make any difference. Neither Magik or Strange can move her far enough to make a difference and that is part of the point.

    And what if Cap get her and the assumption that he is making on very thin facts and misinformation is wrong? He is making an assumption as dangerous as Cykes but with far less to base his assumptions on.

    Caps plan is based on what he thinks is coming, but it is clearly shown that he doesn't really have a grasp on what is coming. He even thinks the PF is more dangerous with a host ad that doesn't even track with what is happening in the AvX books. I think they are intentional writing the Avengers to be operating on bad information, that doesn't make them evil it just makes them dangerously wrong.

    Did you notice that Cap was surprised when told the Pf was a force of re-birth?
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  4. #514
    Elder Member mikekerrIII's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Optic Rage View Post
    Reading the blurbs for upcoming issues of AVX it appears Hope takes matters into her own hands and will be on the blue side of the moon when The Phoenix reaches earth. So she's off planet, but still not at a safe difference away from earth.
    IS there a safe distance away form earth?
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  5. #515
    Ghostly Roboto Ebon Phantom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Optic Rage View Post
    Reading the blurbs for upcoming issues of AVX it appears Hope takes matters into her own hands and will be on the blue side of the moon when The Phoenix reaches earth. So she's off planet, but still not at a safe difference away from earth.
    I'm more interested in seeing how the Phoenix = automatic destruction belief the Avengers possess will play in allowing Hope back on Earth.

  6. #516
    Wallace Likes It That Way Deus ex Chris's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikekerrIII View Post
    Th thing is unless they can mover here completely out of the Omniverse, not just to another dimension the can't mover her far enough away to make any difference. Neither Magik or Strange can move her far enough to make a difference and that is part of the point.
    Sure they could. The Phoenix is traveling ridiculously fast, but it's not teleporting. They're still waiting for it to arrive. Dr. Strange, Thor, and Magik are all capable of instantaneous inter-dimensional travel, and the Phoenix isn't or at least isn't utilizing it.

    And what if Cap get her and the assumption that he is making on very thin facts and misinformation is wrong? He is making an assumption as dangerous as Cykes but with far less to base his assumptions on.
    I disagree. He's operating with the knowledge that the Phoenix is destroying planets. That's what's driving him. That's not misinformation. Hope is having Phoenix flare-ups, and she's the only one in the world who is having them. That's not misinformation. Is it a leap to assume that it's coming for Hope? Maybe but it's not a huge leap. Again, she's the ONLY PERSON ON EARTH exhibiting the Phoenix power.

    Caps plan is based on what he thinks is coming, but it is clearly shown that he doesn't really have a grasp on what is coming. He even thinks the PF is more dangerous with a host ad that doesn't even track with what is happening in the AvX books. I think they are intentional writing the Avengers to be operating on bad information, that doesn't make them evil it just makes them dangerously wrong.

    Did you notice that Cap was surprised when told the Pf was a force of re-birth?
    Again, his plan is based on what is coming. The Phoenix is wiping out planets. That's not an assumption on his part. It's fact.

    Also, he wasn't surprised to learn it's a force of rebirth. I'm not sure where you're getting that from. In his briefing with the Avengers, he tells them that some mutants will see the Force as a good thing. He already knew about the rebirth. It's the destruction part that has him worried.
    Last edited by Deus ex Chris; 04-29-2012 at 06:40 AM.

  7. #517
    IMPERIUS REX!!! Rheged's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Optic Rage View Post
    Reading the blurbs for upcoming issues of AVX it appears Hope takes matters into her own hands and will be on the blue side of the moon when The Phoenix reaches earth. So she's off planet, but still not at a safe difference away from earth.
    We also haven't seen Hope on any of the newest solicitations, have we?

  8. #518
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rheged View Post
    We also haven't seen Hope on any of the newest solicitations, have we?
    Not name checked. We know it's taken a host...but there is a chance it could be someone other than Hope.

  9. #519
    Senior Member tunasammiches's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikekerrIII View Post
    Wther it is better than waiting is the subjevct of the debate here

    What if it is not coming for Hope?
    What if it coming for someone else, or in it's apparently crazed state is coming back to someplace it's familiar with?
    Maybe it is coming for Quire, Emma or the Cuckoos all of which could be possible hosts
    what is it comes to Earth before looking for Hope elsewhere?

    Can the Avengers move Hope far enough away for any meaningful delay? Putting her on Alpha Centari would only provide a miniscule delay for example, not enough to make a fall back plan, that is if it doesn't simply jump to earth. The thing is moving at hundreds of times the speed of light or more and can go anywhere in the omniverse.
    What if the Phoenix is coming back for Rachel? And this whole AvX story ends up really revolving around her? Yeah, that's probably it.
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  10. #520
    Elder Member mikekerrIII's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deus ex Chris View Post
    Once again, Hope is the only one on Earth manifesting the Phoenix Force. She's the likely target. That's just common sense.
    Common sense if often horrifically wrong, It is not something you risk the fate of the Earth over
    Quote Originally Posted by Deus ex Chris View Post
    As for how far they can move her, I guess that depends on the writers, Mike. As written, Captain America seems to think he could make some difference. However, it doesn't seem like we'll ever find out, since the story's veered down a different path.
    It can go anywhere in the omniverse, instantly if I chooses to do so. It seems to be traveling as slow as multiple times the speed of light so it can eat planets, but otherwise distance means nothing. I think the writers are intentional writing it so that Cap is acting mostly out of ignorance, I think that is one of the plot points
    Quote Originally Posted by Deus ex Chris View Post
    Of course, Illyana could certainly move her far enough for a meaningful delay--Dr. Strange and Thor too. That's not the way it's playing out, though.
    Neither can move her far enough to make any meaningful difference at all. The places they can go it can go just as easily.
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  11. #521
    Elder Member mikekerrIII's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deus ex Chris View Post
    Sure they could. The Phoenix is traveling ridiculously fast, but it's not teleporting. They're still waiting for it to arrive. Dr. Strange, Thor, and Magik are all capable of instantaneous inter-dimensional travel, and the Phoenix isn't or at least isn't utilizing it.
    the PF is capable of instantaneous inter-dimensional travel,why it is moving so slow now is one of the mysteries of the story
    Quote Originally Posted by Deus ex Chris View Post
    I disagree. He's operating with the knowledge that the Phoenix is destroying planets. That's what's driving him. That's not misinformation. Hope is having Phoenix flare-ups, and she's the only one in the world who is having them. That's not misinformation. Is it a leap to assume that it's coming for Hope? Maybe but it's not a huge leap. Again, she's the ONLY PERSON ON EARTH exhibiting the Phoenix power.
    He is operating under the strange idea that the PF is more dangerous with a host, He is also operating under the assumption that it is simply destructive. Both ideas are simply wrong.

    Quote Originally Posted by Deus ex Chris View Post
    Again, his plan is based on what is coming. The Phoenix is wiping out planets. That's not an assumption on his part. It's fact.
    He is operating under the strange idea that the PF is more dangerous with a host, He is also operating under the assumption that it is simply destructive. Both ideas are simply wrong. He is also ignoring the simplwe fact that if it is coming the best chance they have of having any control at all is having the Host control it/

    Quote Originally Posted by Deus ex Chris View Post
    Also, he wasn't surprised to learn it's a force of rebirth. I'm not sure where you're getting that from. In his briefing with the Avengers, he tells them that some mutants will see the Force as a good thing. He already knew about the rebirth. It's the destruction part that has him worried.
    When Scott told him so In AvX his response was "What!"
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  12. #522
    Wallace Likes It That Way Deus ex Chris's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikekerrIII View Post
    the PF is capable of instantaneous inter-dimensional travel,why it is moving so slow now is one of the mysteries of the story
    My point still stands. It's not teleporting.

    He is operating under the strange idea that the PF is more dangerous with a host, He is also operating under the assumption that it is simply destructive. Both ideas are simply wrong.

    He is operating under the strange idea that the PF is more dangerous with a host, He is also operating under the assumption that it is simply destructive. Both ideas are simply wrong. He is also ignoring the simplwe fact that if it is coming the best chance they have of having any control at all is having the Host control it/
    He's operating under the assumption that the Phoenix is destroying planets, which is true. It doesn't matter whether it's a creative force as well, when all it's currently doing is destroying planets. Moreover, Jean Grey ate a star when she had the Phoenix. She annihilated a solar system. Destroying planets is bad, but eating stars is worse. Trying to prevent the Phoenix from obtaining a host is an entirely justifiable stance.
    When Scott told him so In AvX his response was "What!"
    "But--" was his response, friend. Like I said, he was aware.
    Last edited by Deus ex Chris; 04-30-2012 at 04:01 PM.

  13. #523
    Praiseworthy Analyst Emerald_616's Avatar
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    This and W&X #9 have been the superior AvX tie-ins thus far. The only hope I have for the Avengers side is with the New X-Men & Lights going to Avengers Academy next month.

  14. #524
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    Garbage CBR Review gives this issue 2-stars.

  15. #525
    † LINSUS X ZAYNT MALIK † Chase_Stein's Avatar
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    Hmm, too much testosterone perhaps.
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