Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 39
  1. #1
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    1,591

    Default 'Earth's First Superman' story arc upcoming in Action...

    Somehow, I'm surprised there hasn't been much discussion on this in the forums.

    So apparently, the upcoming 'Action' arc (AFTER the one-shot parallel earth issue) will include a sub-plot about Lois investigating 'Earth's First Superman'. This story was kinda foreshadowed in issue 6 when the Legion mention how the 'young Superman' will soon have to deal with 'Earth's First Superman'...

    So what do you think is the deal here? Who is 'Earth's First Superman'? Is he another superhuman whose use of the name predated Clark Kent's? Or are there alternate realities involved?

  2. #2
    Inf‚me et fier de l'Ítre Auguste Dupin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    5,096

    Default

    It has been discussed on the books threads.
    There are (as far as I remember) two main theories:
    -The first one is that Earth's first Superman is a mythological hero, the one who is the most quoted is Heracles, but it could be Samson or Atlas, or any other of this kind.
    -The second one is that this "First Superman" is John Dunn. Basically, it is a character created for a fanzine by Siegel and Shuster before Superman. He's a homeless person who, after an experiment, gains mental powers and use it to improve his life and take over the world. In the end he is defeated and loses his powers. The character is generally considered as a first step to the creation Superman, mainly because the character is called a "superman" over and over in the story. This theory has, in my opinion, a few advantages over the other: it seems easier for Lois to investigate on this case than on the one of a mythological character, the character was called "Superman" before Superman (thus making an obvious link to this "first Superman" thing), and the character is, in a way, linked to Superman's history.Besides, since this character is a villain, it's easy to imagine him in a fight against the Man of Steel. Now, the main problem is that DC doesn't own the characters' rights, but I suppose an expy is still possible.
    "I'm going to paraphrase Nietzsche, when you judge a work, the work judges you."

  3. #3
    Senior Member Jody Garland's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    4,230

    Default

    The tank guy shown with the other villains is also a candidate, since he wasn't named and doesn't seem to be a revamp of an older character, like Terra-Man.

  4. #4
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    1,591

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Auguste Dupin View Post
    It has been discussed on the books threads.
    There are (as far as I remember) two main theories:
    -The first one is that Earth's first Superman is a mythological hero, the one who is the most quoted is Heracles, but it could be Samson or Atlas, or any other of this kind.
    -The second one is that this "First Superman" is John Dunn. Basically, it is a character created for a fanzine by Siegel and Shuster before Superman. He's a homeless person who, after an experiment, gains mental powers and use it to improve his life and take over the world. In the end he is defeated and loses his powers. The character is generally considered as a first step to the creation Superman, mainly because the character is called a "superman" over and over in the story. This theory has, in my opinion, a few advantages over the other: it seems easier for Lois to investigate on this case than on the one of a mythological character, the character was called "Superman" before Superman (thus making an obvious link to this "first Superman" thing), and the character is, in a way, linked to Superman's history.Besides, since this character is a villain, it's easy to imagine him in a fight against the Man of Steel. Now, the main problem is that DC doesn't own the characters' rights, but I suppose an expy is still possible.
    Both are very plausible theories...I particularly like the John Dunn example since it would be a nice tip of the hat to the real-world origins of Superman (much like how Morrison has heavily referenced Siegal/Shuster's early Superman in the first arc).

    My own pet theory (which I know is HIGHLY improbable) was that it was the E2 Superman. The Superman of the new E2 at some point got pulled through a space-time warp to the past of E0 and became an urban legend for the brief time he spent there. It would be especially cool if he turned up in E0 in 1938!

  5. #5
    ..for whom the bell tolls The Frozen Reptile's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Gatineau, Quťbec
    Posts
    913

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by bat39 View Post
    Both are very plausible theories...I particularly like the John Dunn example since it would be a nice tip of the hat to the real-world origins of Superman (much like how Morrison has heavily referenced Siegal/Shuster's early Superman in the first arc).

    My own pet theory (which I know is HIGHLY improbable) was that it was the E2 Superman. The Superman of the new E2 at some point got pulled through a space-time warp to the past of E0 and became an urban legend for the brief time he spent there. It would be especially cool if he turned up in E0 in 1938!
    Man, I love this theory; it could make for a very good "legend" on the new Earth-0.
    "Make yourself comfortable, I havenít time to attend to it." - With these words, a legend was born.

  6. #6
    Elder Member MajorHoy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    here
    Posts
    18,952

    Default

    It will be confusing (since it's Morrison), and could possibly throw off the whole reasoning / creation of the DCnU since I thought DC was trying to revert back to the idea of Superman as the "first superhero" in this world. (Hence the exile of the JSA back to Earth-Two.)

    (Of course, they already had to fudge that and make Batman an "urban legend" operating a few years before Superman went public.)

  7. #7
    Inf‚me et fier de l'Ítre Auguste Dupin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    5,096

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by MajorHoy View Post
    It will be confusing (since it's Morrison), and could possibly throw off the whole reasoning / creation of the DCnU since I thought DC was trying to revert back to the idea of Superman as the "first superhero" in this world. (Hence the exile of the JSA back to Earth-Two.)

    (Of course, they already had to fudge that and make Batman an "urban legend" operating a few years before Superman went public.)
    First "Superman" and first superheroes aren't the same things, and it has already been established Superman wasn't the first metahuman (if you ever manage to read Frankenstein......good book really).
    "I'm going to paraphrase Nietzsche, when you judge a work, the work judges you."

  8. #8
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    1,591

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by MajorHoy View Post
    It will be confusing (since it's Morrison), and could possibly throw off the whole reasoning / creation of the DCnU since I thought DC was trying to revert back to the idea of Superman as the "first superhero" in this world. (Hence the exile of the JSA back to Earth-Two.)

    (Of course, they already had to fudge that and make Batman an "urban legend" operating a few years before Superman went public.)
    To my mind, the whole 'first superhero' thing simply refers to Superman being the first superhuman perceived as a 'superhero' by the public. Various writers have established that superhuman individuals DID exist LONG before Superman came on the scene. And of course, a character like Batman would hardly count as a 'superhero'; his affiliation with the Justice League notwithstanding.

  9. #9
    Elder Member MajorHoy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    here
    Posts
    18,952

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Auguste Dupin View Post
    First "Superman" and first superheroes aren't the same things, and it has already been established Superman wasn't the first metahuman (if you ever manage to read Frankenstein......good book really).
    Does Frankenstein qualify as a "metahuman"? Did he have any abilities before he died / was revived?
    (And, no, I'm not reading the book.)

    Quote Originally Posted by bat39 View Post
    To my mind, the whole 'first superhero' thing simply refers to Superman being the first superhuman perceived as a 'superhero' by the public. Various writers have established that superhuman individuals DID exist LONG before Superman came on the scene. And of course, a character like Batman would hardly count as a 'superhero'; his affiliation with the Justice League notwithstanding.
    When you say "Various writers have established that superhuman individuals DID exist LONG before Superman came on the scene", do you mean within the DCnU / since September? And there may have been some other-powered people, but I don't think they fit the role of "superhero". (And how many might be living human beings?)

    As pointed out, it may be a questionas to whether this "first Superman" was anything that might be called a "superhero".
    Last edited by MajorHoy; 04-15-2012 at 11:08 AM.

  10. #10
    Inf‚me et fier de l'Ítre Auguste Dupin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    5,096

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by MajorHoy View Post
    Does Frankenstein qualify as a "metahuman"? Did he have any abilities before he died / was revived?
    (And, no, I'm not reading the book.)



    When you say "Various writers have established that superhuman individuals DID exist LONG before Superman came on the scene", do you mean within the DCnU / since September? And there may have been some other-powered people, but I don't think they vfit the role of "superhero".
    I wasn't talking about Frankenstein. Only of the book. In issue 5 or 6, you have a Dr Manhattan expy that fought in Viet Nam, and Franky himself explains that metahumans existed long before Superman. An idea that was implied as soon as issue 1.
    "I'm going to paraphrase Nietzsche, when you judge a work, the work judges you."

  11. #11
    Elder Member MajorHoy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    here
    Posts
    18,952

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Auguste Dupin View Post
    I wasn't talking about Frankenstein. Only of the book. In issue 5 or 6, you have a Dr Manhattan expy that fought in Viet Nam, and Franky himself explains that metahumans existed long before Superman. An idea that was implied as soon as issue 1.
    Now, that stuff seems to negate the need to remove any superheroes that existed in this DCnU prior to Superman, which completely shoots down the reasons / explanations given for this "reboot-that's-kinda/sorta-a-reboot-but-we're-not-calling-it-that" that followed Flushpoint.

  12. #12
    Inf‚me et fier de l'Ítre Auguste Dupin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    5,096

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by MajorHoy View Post
    Now, that stuff seems to negate the need to remove any superheroes that existed in this DCnU prior to Superman, which completely shoots down the reasons / explanations given for this "reboot-that's-kinda/sorta-a-reboot-but-we're-not-calling-it-that" that followed Flushpoint.
    Who gives a sh.t? They weren't able to say if it was a reboot or not in the first place. You still listen to the nonsense they give in interviews?
    But the Dr Manhattan expy wasn't a superhero in the common sense of the word. He was a super weapon of mass destruction that had a mental breakdown when he realized he wasn't fighting a "good" war an ran away in the woods. He was super all right, but he was no hero. We aren't talking about Hourman here.
    "I'm going to paraphrase Nietzsche, when you judge a work, the work judges you."

  13. #13
    Senior Member Jody Garland's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    4,230

    Default

    I'd actually say leaving the war made Col. Quantum more of a hero than Frankenstein. He realized that Vietnam was a war fought for corrupt reasons and refused to fight anymore.

    But he's not a superhero in the traditional sense of the word. Neither is urban legend Batman. They aren't public nor unaffiliated with governments. Superman is the first superhero that operates in "traditional" rules.

  14. #14
    Inf‚me et fier de l'Ítre Auguste Dupin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    5,096

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Jody Garland View Post
    I'd actually say leaving the war made Col. Quantum more of a hero than Frankenstein. He realized that Vietnam was a war fought for corrupt reasons and refused to fight anymore.

    But he's not a superhero in the traditional sense of the word. Neither is urban legend Batman. They aren't public nor unaffiliated with governments. Superman is the first superhero that operates in "traditional" rules.
    Well, i'm certainly not blaiming him for deserting the Viet Nam war. But yes, tha'ts what I tried to say. Superman is the one who set up the rules of superheroism here, unlike pre Flashpoint where classic superheroes like Starman or Dr Midnite were already doing this the usual way. Before that, we have proto super heroes: spies, masked vigilantes, super weapons...... and this "earth's first Superman" whoever he ends up to be. They're stages leading to the "complete" version that is initiated by Superman.
    "I'm going to paraphrase Nietzsche, when you judge a work, the work judges you."

  15. #15
    Veteran Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    6,176

    Default

    How about Merlin? He seems to be quote a bit older than the earth, but he seems to have taken residence here long ago, and he is clearly superhuman--so, if they mean "earth's First superman" literally, he seems like a good candidate.

    Or Majestic?

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •