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  1. #211

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    I love that the book stands on its own and doesn't tie in with the rest of the New 52. I think it's a plus for storytelling when you don't have to worry about the shared universe all the time.
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  2. #212
    Needs more lesbian RandomFalls's Avatar
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    Issue 14 was down to 42,384 which isn't too bad, awesome that it's still above the 40K range.

    http://www.comichron.com/monthlycomi...2/2012-11.html

    I'm sad that Captain Marvel is out of the top 100.

  3. #213
    U dont need my user title brettc1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RandomFalls View Post
    Issue 14 was down to 42,384 which isn't too bad, awesome that it's still above the 40K range.

    http://www.comichron.com/monthlycomi...2/2012-11.html

    I'm sad that Captain Marvel is out of the top 100.
    I see Batgirl, Red She-Hulk and Captain Marvel are all in the low 20's. Just shows that if you are going to publish a book with a female lead, dont concentrate too much on the fact she is female.

    I'm enjoying Capt Marvel - hope it goes at least another 6 issues. I wont even bother catching up with my Batgirl reading now Gail is off the title.

    So the book dropped...what? About a thousand?

    Edit: about 1400.
    Last edited by brettc1; 12-10-2012 at 02:15 PM.
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  4. #214
    The Magnificent Bastard sberg1's Avatar
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    I think you're looking at the reprint for Batgirl #13.

    Batgirl #14 came at number 17 on the charts with 77,468 units sold (a big uptick due to the Death of the Family tie in most likely).

    I'm not very surprised that Captain Marvel has fallen out of the top 100 - it's a weak book with no clear direction or sense of story. I think it has potential with the right creative team but that's not being met by who they currently have on the book.
    Last edited by sberg1; 12-10-2012 at 03:55 PM.
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  5. #215
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    Quote Originally Posted by brettc1 View Post
    I see Batgirl, Red She-Hulk and Captain Marvel are all in the low 20's. Just shows that if you are going to publish a book with a female lead, dont concentrate too much on the fact she is female.
    I imagine that if Azz had been following that principle, he wouldn't have head issues 2-4, 7 and 0 put so much on Diana's origins in an all-female society, or have issue 6 feature Wonder Woman telling Lennox can be when they have nothing to lose, or have issues 8-10 be about a male god's attempt to take Diana as his wife.

    Anyway, while I appreciate RandomFalls' optimism, I thought this month's sales decrease was a little on the steep side. I hope having Orion on the cover next issue helps.

  6. #216
    U dont need my user title brettc1's Avatar
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    Does anybody have any idea why DC would dump Gail Simone off Batgirl when it seems she is reguarly outselling Azzarello on Wonder Woman?

    Have to agree with the analysis of the first arc for Captain Marvel. Too many books kicking off a supporting charcter into a lead role spend the first arc exploying 'why am i a hero?' Azz, on the other hand, just went with trashing the previous history and then getting into the heroics, however decompressed they might be.
    Last edited by brettc1; 12-11-2012 at 02:49 AM.
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  7. #217
    Senior Member wagthedog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brettc1 View Post
    Does anybody have any idea why DC would dump Gail Simone off Batgirl when it seems she is reguarly outselling Azzarello on Wonder Woman?

    Have to agree with the analysis of the first arc for Captain Marvel. Too many books kicking off a supporting charcter into a lead role spend the first arc exploying 'why am i a hero?' Azz, on the other hand, just went with trashing the previous history and then getting into the heroics, however decompressed they might be.
    I have a feeling it has to do with personality clashes. Gail has always been, for a better word, feisty, when it comes to areas like these message boards. If that translates somewhat the same outside of message boards, I can see why she would have conflicts down the road. Just my opinion.

  8. #218
    U dont need my user title brettc1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by slvn View Post
    I imagine that if Azz had been following that principle, he wouldn't have head issues 2-4, 7 and 0 put so much on Diana's origins in an all-female society, or have issue 6 feature Wonder Woman telling Lennox can be when they have nothing to lose, or have issues 8-10 be about a male god's attempt to take Diana as his wife.
    If you look at the first part arc from Captain Marvel, its very much concentrating on the idea that women can do anything men can do, or better. Even I found it a bit heavy handed. In comparison, Azzarello's WW just gets on with the mission and doenst spend a lot of time talking about gender stereotypes or the idea women being socially disadvantaged.

    Actually one might argue that rather than show the Amazons as survivors of persecution he portrays them as extrapolents of it. So there is no need for guys to feel bad reading the book - the Amazons are bad.
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  9. #219
    CBR Mod/WW Section Mom Gaelforce's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brettc1 View Post
    Does anybody have any idea why DC would dump Gail Simone off Batgirl when it seems she is reguarly outselling Azzarello on Wonder Woman?

    Have to agree with the analysis of the first arc for Captain Marvel. Too many books kicking off a supporting charcter into a lead role spend the first arc exploying 'why am i a hero?' Azz, on the other hand, just went with trashing the previous history and then getting into the heroics, however decompressed they might be.
    Not that it makes a difference in your point ('cause it's close enough), WW regularly outsells Batgirl by a very small margin. Batgirl only outsells WW during Batman crossovers (Court of Owls, Death of the Family)

    And as much as it bothers me as well, this isn't the place to debate and/or discuss it (see Bat forum a few doors up)

  10. #220
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    Quote Originally Posted by brettc1 View Post
    If you look at the first part arc from Captain Marvel, its very much concentrating on the idea that women can do anything men can do, or better. Even I found it a bit heavy handed. In comparison, Azzarello's WW just gets on with the mission and doenst spend a lot of time talking about gender stereotypes or the idea women being socially disadvantaged.
    Ah. Well, if "heavy-handed" sells less well than subtle (e.g., Wonder Woman simply performing an act of female solidarity by protecting "the girl in the middle of nowhere, without having to speechify about it) then maybe there's hope for the tastes of the comic-buying public yet.

    Actually one might argue that rather than show the Amazons as survivors of persecution he portrays them as extrapolents of it. So there is no need for guys to feel bad reading the book - the Amazons are bad.
    I don't know--do a lot of guys enjoy seeing themselves as helpless victims of powerful women? I would think sexist men might prefer to see women portrayed as innocent but helpless victims, or damsels in distress--though they would prefer to see the damsel in distress saved by a man, not by Wonder Woman. It's an interesting question to think about in Marstonian and feminist terms.

  11. #221
    Junior Member Inkink's Avatar
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    So far I love this title its been the highlight of the new 52 for me. With that being said does anyone here feel that this book could of been released without a huge reboot?

  12. #222
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    Quote Originally Posted by Inkink View Post
    So far I love this title its been the highlight of the new 52 for me. With that being said does anyone here feel that this book could of been released without a huge reboot?
    Well...the new birth story would have created inconsistencies within the old continuity--for example, the times she has been reverted to clay wouldn't make sense, and neither would some parts of Simone's run (especially The Circle), even though the old origin is still present as a cover story. Plus, I think some people wouldn't have liked the idea that the Wonder Woman they were reading along was secretly the daughter of Zeus; with the stories happening in a continuity of their own, it might be easier for people to feel that the old continuity remains untainted.

    I know some people would like to have the current story but with the original origin--but, when I look at, for instance, issues 2-4 and Wonder Woman's sibling relationship with Lennox and Siracca, I think it would have been an essentially different story without the origin change (and I have a hunch that this will be even more true by the time the run is over and all has been revealed).

    Plus, I think this feels like a younger Wonder Woman (as she is supposed to be), and it would seem strange to think that she'd had time for all that old continuity to have happened.

  13. #223
    Senior Member wagthedog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by slvn View Post
    Well...the new birth story would have created inconsistencies within the old continuity--for example, the times she has been reverted to clay wouldn't make sense, and neither would some parts of Simone's run (especially The Circle), even though the old origin is still present as a cover story. Plus, I think some people wouldn't have liked the idea that the Wonder Woman they were reading along was secretly the daughter of Zeus; with the stories happening in a continuity of their own, it might be easier for people to feel that the old continuity remains untainted.

    I know some people would like to have the current story but with the original origin--but, when I look at, for instance, issues 2-4 and Wonder Woman's sibling relationship with Lennox and Siracca, I think it would have been an essentially different story without the origin change (and I have a hunch that this will be even more true by the time the run is over and all has been revealed).

    Plus, I think this feels like a younger Wonder Woman (as she is supposed to be), and it would seem strange to think that she'd had time for all that old continuity to have happened.
    It might be a younger Wonder Woman, as you say, but Cliff Chiang draws her in a way that suggests she looks more mature than what her age should imply. I would guess late 20's, early 30's on his drawings. Jim Lee draws Wonder Woman younger in my opinion.

  14. #224
    U dont need my user title brettc1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by slvn View Post
    I don't know--do a lot of guys enjoy seeing themselves as helpless victims of powerful women? I would think sexist men might prefer to see women portrayed as innocent but helpless victims, or damsels in distress--though they would prefer to see the damsel in distress saved by a man, not by Wonder Woman. It's an interesting question to think about in Marstonian and feminist terms.
    I think sexist men, were they reading, might like the idea that the Amazons are revealed as man-hating savages who use sex to trick men and then murder them.

    From a meta-textual point of view it draws from the worst portrayal of militant feminism. As such, it's less confronting for male readers than most previous versions.
    Irene Adler: “I would have you right here on this desk until you begged for mercy twice.”
    Sherlock: “I’ve never begged for mercy in my life.”
    Irene: “Twice.”


  15. #225

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    Rankwise, I think the month of November can be considered a departure from the usual routine, given there are so many #1s from Marvel and the Death of the Family event is in full swing. There's no other way Suicide Squad could outsell Aquaman or Superman.

    Interesting to note that Uncanny Avengers dropped more than half its readers from 350k to around Justice League levels. All New X-Men, Iron Man, Thor and X-Men Legacy also dropped by a little less than half.

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