Here we talk Classic Superman. DCnU need not apply. (Sorry)

[Mat001]

[Mat001]

[Mat001]

[Mat001]

[OldSchoolfan]

Yes, one of the big mistakes of the New 52. The Kent's relationship with Clark is priceless and sets up world of storytelling possiblities/character development.

As far as Cary Bates goes....I am reading through the Bronze age Superman stuff and I am finding his contributions to be the weakest. There is an over reliance of disguises on the part of Clark and other characters, and at least one once Superman story was very poorly constructed. I believe it was issue 269, I just thought there were a whole lot of problems with that particular story.

[An Ear In The Fireplace]

I remember the story in 269 and it was kind of routine. I suspect it was one of those where the idea for the cover came first. I'm not saying that Cary Bates hit one out of the park every time. But his output was amazing--so it's to be expected that a lot of his stories were underwhelming. On the other hand, he wrote some of the greatest Superman stories ever--so I think that balances things out.

In terms of plot, editors were a lot more hands on in those days--so the editors had a lot of input in how a story was plotted. I think the 269 story is typical of a Schwartz-type plot.

What readers looked for in a story back then is not the same as now--so it really depends on what yardstick you're using for how you judge one of them stories.

[An Ear In The Fireplace]

Has this pic been posted yet?

[Lexrules]

Little Vampire Superman from The Superfriends Cartoon.;)

[It's Superman]

[brik-el]

[OldSchoolfan]

I remember the story in 269 and it was kind of routine. I suspect it was one of those where the idea for the cover came first. I'm not saying that Cary Bates hit one out of the park every time. But his output was amazing--so it's to be expected that a lot of his stories were underwhelming. On the other hand, he wrote some of the greatest Superman stories ever--so I think that balances things out.

In terms of plot, editors were a lot more hands on in those days--so the editors had a lot of input in how a story was plotted. I think the 269 story is typical of a Schwartz-type plot.

What readers looked for in a story back then is not the same as now--so it really depends on what yardstick you're using for how you judge one of them stories.

I have read three Bates stories that I thought were above average, at least in concept. I think it was Action 441, where he has to save Johnny Nevada across town before the bullet gets fired....but that story used the disguise device again and sort of ruined it for me.

I think it was Action 543, where the teams revamped Brainiac and Luthor. I liked those issues, it was my first exposure to Lexor.

The third one is one he co wrote with Maggin...Superman 296-299. I like to call it the Clark grows a pair story. That was a good story in my opinion.

I will keep reading, but to be honest, I haven't enjoyed his stories more than Wein's issues, who right now is probably my favorite Bronze age Superman writer. I liked Pasko's run too....but Wein's has a lot fewer rough edges.

As far as how you measure your stories, I agree with you, the writers used different measuring sticks and were trying to accomplish different things....but I still think you can evaluate their work technically and artistically (especially in the approach to the character).

[Sacred Knight]

I was trying to find a pic of an old poster I used to have as a kid, it was a Dan Jurgens piece, based off of the Hunter/Prey story I think, as it featured Superman (long hair), Cyborg Superman (second Apokolips-armor look) and Darkseid. Probably had Doomsday on there somewhere as well.

[It's Superman]

[brik-el]

[OldSchoolfan]

I was trying to find a pic of an old poster I used to have as a kid, it was a Dan Jurgens piece, based off of the Hunter/Prey story I think, as it featured Superman (long hair), Cyborg Superman (second Apokolips-armor look) and Darkseid. Probably had Doomsday on there somewhere as well.

Is this that cover? http://www.comics.org/issue/90210/cover/4/

It's Superman (vol. 2) 104, I loved the interiors.