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  1. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rosebunse View Post
    Explosion, or maybe the Super Lupus he had killed him.



    I think he planned it all so that they were all fairly close to the explosion. He knew they would be too worried about civilians to worry about him.

    I liked this as an ending. I mean, it was actually heart-breaking. He realizes how insignificant he is as a villain, how the superheroes make the normal people "special" because of their willingness to save them. It answers about 60 years of comic book discussion right freaking there! It tells us freaking why the villain is less than the normal people who get caught up in it, why the hero is so freaking beautiful when compared to the freaking villain who can't see just how insignificant they are.

    Plus, when he seems so distraught to realize that Donna isn't coming back for him, the ending, when he wishes that he could have left Wolverine with "nothing"...

    I don't know. It just seemed really sad. Like, he's "us", almost. We're running out of time, we're dying, but these superheroes aren't. Hell, they'll always be young and beautiful. I can see why he went nuts at the end.
    This is just brilliant

  2. #47
    Member MrMancha's Avatar
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    through all that dialogue he could have been lying to the audience like he did wolverine on the last page<.<

  3. #48
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    Daken is where Wolverine was as a character prior to Alpha Flight. A homicidal immoral monster. This final arc was him seeing the futility of it and putting an end cap on it. If and when he returns itll be the redemptive arc wolverine was in for 30 years of publishing.

    Wolverine HAS redeemed himself, that storys over. But we could see it again through Daken. Tho he needs another name besides 'Dark Wolverine'

  4. #49
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    Daken was a character who thought he was cooler then he really was. Nobody wanted him(and this transfered over to his terrible sales), and nobody cared. He's a boring, drug-addled murderous psychopath with daddy issues, flailing around for somebody, ANYBODY to care about him, but it never happen. He's got this big master plan that he wants to go out on, but it's an anticlimax.

    Daken: "Don't you want to know why I did all this?"

    Wolverine: "No"

    And that's really the whole character in a nutshell. No one wants to have anything to do with you, Daken. You're just not that interesting.

  5. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by NickFury90 View Post
    Daken was a character who thought he was cooler then he really was. Nobody wanted him(and this transfered over to his terrible sales), and nobody cared. He's a boring, drug-addled murderous psychopath with daddy issues, flailing around for somebody, ANYBODY to care about him, but it never happen. He's got this big master plan that he wants to go out on, but it's an anticlimax.

    Daken: "Don't you want to know why I did all this?"

    Wolverine: "No"

    And that's really the whole character in a nutshell. No one wants to have anything to do with you, Daken. You're just not that interesting.
    I wholeheartedly agree!

  6. #51
    Senior Member Meehl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NickFury90 View Post
    Daken was a character who thought he was cooler then he really was. Nobody wanted him(and this transfered over to his terrible sales), and nobody cared. He's a boring, drug-addled murderous psychopath with daddy issues, flailing around for somebody, ANYBODY to care about him, but it never happen. He's got this big master plan that he wants to go out on, but it's an anticlimax.

    Daken: "Don't you want to know why I did all this?"

    Wolverine: "No"

    And that's really the whole character in a nutshell. No one wants to have anything to do with you, Daken. You're just not that interesting.
    Comics are full of repetitive themes, and each time an idea is reevaluated and rewritten it has a chance to better than its predecessor. That something has been "done before" is not grounds for dismissal. If it were, there wouldn't be any comics worth reading anymore. There also wouldn't be any fiction published, either, in any format.

    X-23 was an attempt to reevaluate Logan's old "Am I a man or an animal" routine. Her book was well-written and character focused and explored X-23s desire to resist her murderous impulses and gain control. Daken was the other side of Wolverine's old routine, the "immature killer with a heart of a gold but full of selfish interests." Daken's book, unlike X-23's book, kind of meandered and stumbled along and became plot-focused. Daken vs Runaways. Daken vs Drugs. Daken vs. Mafia. These plot-driven stories don't sell because they're stupid and vacuous. The reader gains nothing and the character never develops. If you didn't think Daken was interesting, blame the writers. Don't blame the character.
    VIVA KUSASAN!!! Morrison On Magneto: I made him into a stupid old drug-addicted idiot. CC had done a lot of good work over the years to redeem the character. And I went in and sh*t on all of it.

  7. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by NickFury90 View Post
    Daken was a character who thought he was cooler then he really was. Nobody wanted him(and this transfered over to his terrible sales), and nobody cared. He's a boring, drug-addled murderous psychopath with daddy issues, flailing around for somebody, ANYBODY to care about him, but it never happen. He's got this big master plan that he wants to go out on, but it's an anticlimax.

    Daken: "Don't you want to know why I did all this?"

    Wolverine: "No"

    And that's really the whole character in a nutshell. No one wants to have anything to do with you, Daken. You're just not that interesting.
    But you do talk about it as if Daken is a real person, just someone you don't like. Which is different to a poorly written book where the characters and scenarios don't feel real.

  8. #53

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    Haaaatttee criiimmmee!

  9. #54

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    I still liked it.

    Like I said, the whole final book is about 60 years of comic book discussions settled into a few pages. We see what makes superheroes so special, what makes the villain so meaningless, what makes the normal people so damn important.

    At the end, Daken is just like everyone else-you, me, everyone-who wants to do something big before they go. However, he as a comic book character thought he had way more time. Then he realizes that his life is short, just like everyone else's, and he rallies against his imposed fate.

  10. #55
    Veteran Member Regino's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NickFury90 View Post
    Daken was a character who thought he was cooler then he really was. Nobody wanted him(and this transfered over to his terrible sales), and nobody cared. He's a boring, drug-addled murderous psychopath with daddy issues, flailing around for somebody, ANYBODY to care about him, but it never happen. He's got this big master plan that he wants to go out on, but it's an anticlimax.

    Daken: "Don't you want to know why I did all this?"

    Wolverine: "No"

    And that's really the whole character in a nutshell. No one wants to have anything to do with you, Daken. You're just not that interesting.
    Daken reminds me of this guy

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    Pot+Kettle - "This post went so full retard that it had to be quoted."

  11. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by NickFury90 View Post
    Daken was a character who thought he was cooler then he really was. Nobody wanted him(and this transfered over to his terrible sales), and nobody cared. He's a boring, drug-addled murderous psychopath with daddy issues, flailing around for somebody, ANYBODY to care about him, but it never happen. He's got this big master plan that he wants to go out on, but it's an anticlimax.

    Daken: "Don't you want to know why I did all this?"

    Wolverine: "No"

    And that's really the whole character in a nutshell. No one wants to have anything to do with you, Daken. You're just not that interesting.
    Daken's series lasted longer than most of Marvel's new series, especially when you add the Dark Wolverine series with it. I could not have been more anti-Daken when he first came out. When he joined Dark Avengers and took over Wolverine's title I gave him another shot. And it was because the writing was so good that I grew to love him. Is he anything new? No, but he his series was written well so who cares. It was enjoyable. When Liu abandoned the character the quality went down, sales weren't great, and Marvel was doing cut backs. The book was cancelled. You didn't like the character or premise; that fair - I don't for a lot of books too. But enough did for the him to have an almost 50 issue run in today's market. Let some of the rage go.
    My Canon > Your Canon

  12. #57
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    I actually really liked that the story ended here, because that's really the only way it could have went. He comes to terms with who he is, but it's too late to matter. He wants to go out as a great man, but he dies without anyone recognizing his supposed brilliance. He'll be remembered as a trivia question, a curio of the MU.

    Once Rob Williams came on board, and Marvel stop trying to sell him like he was the coolest motherfucker in the world, and started with the idea that he just thought he was, THAT'S an interesting idea. This, all of this, is the logical conclusion for Daken. It's really the best possible ending for the character.

  13. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by NickFury90 View Post
    I actually really liked that the story ended here, because that's really the only way it could have went. He comes to terms with who he is, but it's too late to matter. He wants to go out as a great man, but he dies without anyone recognizing his supposed brilliance. He'll be remembered as a trivia question, a curio of the MU.

    Once Rob Williams came on board, and Marvel stop trying to sell him like he was the coolest motherfucker in the world, and started with the idea that he just thought he was, THAT'S an interesting idea. This, all of this, is the logical conclusion for Daken. It's really the best possible ending for the character.
    Well Marvel's marketing has always been over done. But he is a comic book character; most of the them are advertised as the coolest motherfucker in the world.
    My Canon > Your Canon

  14. #59
    Elder Member wolvie616's Avatar
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    Wolvie616 is Mozambiquey

  15. #60

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    Quote Originally Posted by wolvie616 View Post
    We don't know if that's a flash-back or not.

    Quote Originally Posted by NickFury90 View Post
    I actually really liked that the story ended here, because that's really the only way it could have went. He comes to terms with who he is, but it's too late to matter. He wants to go out as a great man, but he dies without anyone recognizing his supposed brilliance. He'll be remembered as a trivia question, a curio of the MU.

    Once Rob Williams came on board, and Marvel stop trying to sell him like he was the coolest motherfucker in the world, and started with the idea that he just thought he was, THAT'S an interesting idea. This, all of this, is the logical conclusion for Daken. It's really the best possible ending for the character.
    Yeah, I think that was the best part of it! Ever since Williams came on board, he just deconstructed all Marvel had been trying to do to build up Daken. Looking back, I really wish he had gotten the chance to really take Daken to the next level, but I'll take this. My favorite thing was what he did with Donna and his complete failure to "claim" her. If this had been any other writer, or any other series, Daken would have gotten her, or she would have been sent to the fridge. But he lost her in the worst way a sociopath like him could: she just didn't want him.

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