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  1. #466

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    I don't think Marvel will ever bring the real Gwen back, but if they did, it wouldn't be to play second fiddle to Mary Jane. You can take that to the bank. I think the hardcore MJ fanboys are a little blind in that regard. It simply wouldn't be worth the effort.
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  2. #467
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chuckles View Post
    I don't think Marvel will ever bring the real Gwen back, but if they did, it wouldn't be to play second fiddle to Mary Jane. You can take that to the bank. I think the hardcore MJ fanboys are a little blind in that regard. It simply wouldn't be worth the effort.
    If the real Gwen comes back, she will either be a villain, or like Felicia and now Betty, be sent away from ASM after a couple of storylines post revival. Maybe to Scarlet Spider as a love interest for Kaine? Or maybe out of the Spidey titles altogether. To FF maybe as a potential girlfriend for Johnny or Ben? To Wolverine and the X-Men to date Bobby or Logan maybe? The thought of Gwen seeing Johnny or Bobby is so lulz.

    However, I highly doubt Gwen will be setup with PETER, especially at MJ's expense. Or at least not permanently. Heck, Marvel brought back Mockingbird of all people and now she's not even with Hawkeye anymore. So it is foolhardy to claim that if Gwen is brought back, she would have to upstage MJ. Not likely, especially considering that Mary Jane Watson is the only character capable of giving Lois Lane a run for her money when it comes to being the most iconic superhero love interest in all of comics.

  3. #468
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chuckles View Post
    I don't think Marvel will ever bring the real Gwen back, but if they did, it wouldn't be to play second fiddle to Mary Jane. You can take that to the bank. I think the hardcore MJ fanboys are a little blind in that regard. It simply wouldn't be worth the effort.
    Not that I think they're bringing Gwen back, but ultimately she would play second fiddle to MJ. That was why they killed her in the first place.
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  4. #469
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kevinroc View Post
    Not that I think they're bringing Gwen back, but ultimately she would play second fiddle to MJ. That was why they killed her in the first place.
    If the new movie franchise is popular enough, I could see Marvel trying to cash in on Gwen's new found popularity with the general public and bring her back (I pray not, though!). However, even then, I don't see much use for her in ASM other than rehashing mediocre plotlines past. It would be beneficial to deploy her to one of the other titles I mentioned. The idea of "Johnny Storm and Gwen Stacy" sounds kinda interesting, I have to admit.
    Last edited by Confuzzled Mutie; 04-08-2012 at 12:34 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Confuzzled Mutie View Post
    If the new franchise is popular enough, I could see Marvel trying to cash in on Gwen's new found popularity with the general public and bring her back (I pray not, though!). However, even then, I don't see much use for her in ASM other than rehashing mediocre plotlines past. It would be beneficial to deploy her to one of the other titles I mentioned. The idea of "Johnny Storm and Gwen Stacy" sounds kinda interesting, I have to admit.
    Marvel didn't even bring back Peggy Carter after the success of the Captain America movie and they own the rights to that movie.

    (Hell, they didn't even bring Thor and Jane Foster back together. And Jane isn't dead.)
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  6. #471
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kevinroc View Post
    Marvel didn't even bring back Peggy Carter after the success of the Captain America movie and they own the rights to that movie.

    (Hell, they didn't even bring Thor and Jane Foster back together. And Jane isn't dead.)
    You don't need Peggy when you have Sharon. Isn't that virtually the same thing?

    As for Jane, I dunno. I have a strong feeling she will figure more prominently in the near future. And Gwen and the Spider-Man franchise are more known than Jane and Thor.

    Either ways (regarding Gwen's revival), I don't care much. As long as I get my Peter/MJ.
    Last edited by Confuzzled Mutie; 04-08-2012 at 12:42 PM.

  7. #472
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    The big problem I see with OMD and bringing Gwen Stacy back is that they regress the story, when it should move forward instead. They end up being counterproductive actions when things are returned to a prior status quo.

  8. #473
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrV View Post
    The big problem I see with OMD and bringing Gwen Stacy back is that they regress the story, when it should move forward instead. They end up being counterproductive actions when things are returned to a prior status quo.
    Which is why I would prefer to have Gwen stay in the ground. And if she does come back, hopefully not as a love interest for Peter.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Confuzzled Mutie View Post
    You don't need Peggy when you have Sharon. Isn't that virtually the same thing?

    As for Jane, I dunno. I have a strong feeling she will figure more prominently in the near future. And Gwen and the Spider-Man franchise are more known than Jane and Thor.

    Either ways (regarding Gwen's revival), I don't care much. As long as I get my Peter/MJ.
    That's what I'm curious about regarding Cap and the Carters. How do you introduce Sharon without making it as "getting with my girlfriend's daughter/granddaughter" or what not? (Yes, I know their current status in continuity is Peggy is Sharon's great aunt.) Regardless, Peggy and Sharon are not identical copies of one another. And Sharon's big thing in her early days was the idea of "keep my career or get a man?" (Obviously this dichotomy was a product of its time and won't be an issue going forward.) Interestingly enough, Peggy was retconned into Cap's past (just as Baron Zemo was retconned into Cap's past). And Sharon was technically introduced before Peggy. (Aren't comics fun?)

    Of course Jane Foster will play a role going forward. But whatever happens between Thor and Jane will be a product of where the story goes. Not whatever the movies do. Just as Marvel didn't exactly rush Betty Ross back to life after Hulk or Incredible Hulk (Betty came back in 2010. Hulk opened in 2003 and Incredible Hulk in 2008.)
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  10. #475
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kevinroc View Post
    That's what I'm curious about regarding Cap and the Carters. How do you introduce Sharon without making it as "getting with my girlfriend's daughter/granddaughter" or what not? (Yes, I know their current status in continuity is Peggy is Sharon's great aunt.) Regardless, Peggy and Sharon are not identical copies of one another. And Sharon's big thing in her early days was the idea of "keep my career or get a man?" (Obviously this dichotomy was a product of its time and won't be an issue going forward.) Interestingly enough, Peggy was retconned into Cap's past (just as Baron Zemo was retconned into Cap's past). And Sharon was technically introduced before Peggy. (Aren't comics fun?)

    Of course Jane Foster will play a role going forward. But whatever happens between Thor and Jane will be a product of where the story goes. Not whatever the movies do. Just as Marvel didn't exactly rush Betty Ross back to life after Hulk or Incredible Hulk (Betty came back in 2010. Hulk opened in 2003 and Incredible Hulk in 2008.)
    Yeah, the relationship between Cap and the Carter women always seemed slightly skeevy!

    When it comes to Jane, I would say that her appearing in the movies (and being played by Natalie Portman, no less) and EMH cartoon does increase her probability of getting back with Thor in the comics. Even if it was bound to happen before naturally and eventually, this factor does help accelerate the possibility.

    The Gwen thing.. if Marvel were wise, they would let her remain dead in the 616 universe regardless of the reception of Emma Stone's performance. In my earlier post, I forgot all about Ultimate Gwen So Marvel could play a greater emphasis on her character in that universe and have her see Johnny or Bobby or whoever to increase her face time and have her be a crucial element in Miles' supporting cast, if Marvel so wishes. Don't have to compromise the main continuity for it.

  11. #476
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    Quote Originally Posted by Confuzzled Mutie View Post
    If the new movie franchise is popular enough, I could see Marvel trying to cash in on Gwen's new found popularity with the general public and bring her back (I pray not, though!). However, even then, I don't see much use for her in ASM other than rehashing mediocre plotlines past. It would be beneficial to deploy her to one of the other titles I mentioned. The idea of "Johnny Storm and Gwen Stacy" sounds kinda interesting, I have to admit.
    Batman was popular in 1989, how did that Vicki Vale thing work out?

    MJ was more popular than Gwenn because she was unique among the other characters at the time, Gwen is another generic love interest that had a death of storyline that was more important than the character as far as sales go.
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  12. #477
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kevinroc View Post
    That's what I'm curious about regarding Cap and the Carters. How do you introduce Sharon without making it as "getting with my girlfriend's daughter/granddaughter" or what not? (Yes, I know their current status in continuity is Peggy is Sharon's great aunt.) Regardless, Peggy and Sharon are not identical copies of one another. And Sharon's big thing in her early days was the idea of "keep my career or get a man?" (Obviously this dichotomy was a product of its time and won't be an issue going forward.) Interestingly enough, Peggy was retconned into Cap's past (just as Baron Zemo was retconned into Cap's past). And Sharon was technically introduced before Peggy. (Aren't comics fun?)

    Of course Jane Foster will play a role going forward. But whatever happens between Thor and Jane will be a product of where the story goes. Not whatever the movies do. Just as Marvel didn't exactly rush Betty Ross back to life after Hulk or Incredible Hulk (Betty came back in 2010. Hulk opened in 2003 and Incredible Hulk in 2008.)
    1) The first Hulk Movie was a critical flop, the second Hulk movie was a commercial flop. Flops don't have much influence, generally.
    2) There's no way to avoid that in re Cap. Cap did that. It's just..the way it is for him. In any case, I don't know why they NEED to avoid it anyway.
    3) Jane I'm not so sure wasn't the result of the movie on some level. But movie or no movie, it's one of those things where the love interest is going to come back as a by product of the way we (generally as a society) think about love. Betty Ross is Bruce Banner's woman. Eventually, she will always come back (she's been married AND dead before). I don't know if Jane Foster qualifies on the same level, but if she does, she'll always come back (My limited Thor knowledge suggests this one is a bit more difficult). But I wouldn't be surprised if the movie was the catalyst in this case.


    With those said, I don't expect Movie Gwen's success will lead to anything in the comics, and I am glad for that. She's dead. I'm sad about that. But it's no less true. In 616, Peter x Gwen is over by virtue of her being dead. That's part of Peter's long story, and removing it cheapens the tale.
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  13. #478
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xenon View Post
    1) The first Hulk Movie was a critical flop, the second Hulk movie was a commercial flop. Flops don't have much influence, generally.
    2) There's no way to avoid that in re Cap. Cap did that. It's just..the way it is for him. In any case, I don't know why they NEED to avoid it anyway.
    3) Jane I'm not so sure wasn't the result of the movie on some level. But movie or no movie, it's one of those things where the love interest is going to come back as a by product of the way we (generally as a society) think about love. Betty Ross is Bruce Banner's woman. Eventually, she will always come back (she's been married AND dead before). I don't know if Jane Foster qualifies on the same level, but if she does, she'll always come back (My limited Thor knowledge suggests this one is a bit more difficult). But I wouldn't be surprised if the movie was the catalyst in this case.


    With those said, I don't expect Movie Gwen's success will lead to anything in the comics, and I am glad for that. She's dead. I'm sad about that. But it's no less true. In 616, Peter x Gwen is over by virtue of her being dead. That's part of Peter's long story, and removing it cheapens the tale.
    1: Actually, Ang Lee's Hulk got a 62% on rotten tomatoes (based off of 224 reviews). That's enough to earn it a "fresh" from the site. So no, it wasn't a "critical flop."

    Incredible Hulk earned over $260 million in theaters. And if you count DVD sales, that number increases to over $300 million in total. Hardly a "commercial flop."

    (Clearly Marvel isn't benching The Hulk from outside media since he will have a role in Avengers, has a role in The Avengers Earth's Mightiest Heroes cartoon and will be getting yet another cartoon of his own and another live-action TV series.)

    2: It's still kinda weird that Cap hooks up with another Carter. Remember in The Simpsons where we met Mr. Burns' son? Who was the son of Burns' ex's daughter? Yeah... It could be creepy if handled incorrectly.

    3: They were really pushing for Thor and Sif in the comics as the movie focused on Thor and Jane.

    4: Regardless, I think most people view Mary Jane as Peter's girl. And if people do think about Gwen, her role is "the one who dies." That's pretty much all she's remembered for these days. (Gerry Conway succeeded beyond his wildest dreams on that front.)
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  14. #479
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kevinroc View Post

    4: Regardless, I think most people view Mary Jane as Peter's girl. And if people do think about Gwen, her role is "the one who dies." That's pretty much all she's remembered for these days. (Gerry Conway succeeded beyond his wildest dreams on that front.)
    I think you are correct now, but in another ten years, who knows. I don't know (letter pages sure make it sounds like people were not happy about the death, never looked to see if anyone complained about MJ though), but I be willing to bet dollars to dimes people were not happy with Gwen dying and MJ sliding into that role shortly after.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Schmed View Post
    I think you are correct now, but in another ten years, who knows. I don't know (letter pages sure make it sounds like people were not happy about the death, never looked to see if anyone complained about MJ though), but I be willing to bet dollars to dimes people were not happy with Gwen dying and MJ sliding into that role shortly after.
    How shortly is "shortly after?"

    Because Peter and MJ had their first kiss 22 issues after Gwen's death. And about two years isn't exactly "shortly after."

    But people were upset that they killed Gwen.

    http://spiderfan.org/comics/reviews/...azing/124.html

    The letters page had these gems.

    "To Whoever had the idea of killing off Gwen Stacy, You rattlesnake, you buzzard, you large red insect, you worm, you cockroach, you lizard, you skunk, you tapeworm in the digestive track of humanity... "

    "Marvel, how DARE you kill Gwendolyn Stacy!? You are a pack of soulless, mercenary sadists. I am no longer a True Believer."

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