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  1. #1141
    Elder Member BrotherUnitNo_4's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roland Gunner View Post
    Marvel either cancels or re-brands any series that drops below 20K sales so thats always going to be the case. It might not be the best choice from a sales standpoint but I appreciate DC's willingness to support lower selling books.
    I doubt they're supporting it out of any kind of altruism. It's much easier to build noise around multiple books relaunching at once than one book here or there. It also takes time to pull together the talent with the right concepts for enough books to make it worthwhile, and even that's not always guaranteed. Wave two at least had Earth Two and Morrison's Batman Inc, in addition to Mieville's Dial H which got a lot of posters here talking. Any of those would have been great fits for the first wave. I can't say the same for anything in Wave 3.

    It's just all funny to me because it sure seems like they've done a 180 on taking a harder stance to cancellations.
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  2. #1142
    Veteran Member glennsim's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BrotherUnitNo_4 View Post
    I doubt they're supporting it out of any kind of altruism. It's much easier to build noise around multiple books relaunching at once than one book here or there. It also takes time to pull together the talent with the right concepts for enough books to make it worthwhile, and even that's not always guaranteed. Wave two at least had Earth Two and Morrison's Batman Inc, in addition to Mieville's Dial H which got a lot of posters here talking. Any of those would have been great fits for the first wave. I can't say the same for anything in Wave 3.

    It's just all funny to me because it sure seems like they've done a 180 on taking a harder stance to cancellations.
    Perhaps it could be said that they have the intent of going ahead and cancelling things that need cancelling, BUT they also want to do the "waves" to get the publicity, so the two things are sorta cancelling each other out.

  3. #1143
    Veteran Member Ari Gold's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BrotherUnitNo_4 View Post
    That only could be wishful thinking guaranteed . . . I'd argue that DC's output is just as top heavy as Marvel's, which was pretty evident when you consider the books that are still selling above 70K and the books that have been cancelled already. DC's more diverse books aren't selling that well. I mean Animal Man and Swamp Thing are both very healthy but the others like Demon Knights or I Vampire aren't healthy sellers at all.....
    Marvel's Top 20 selling titles in July:
    - half of them were double-shipped titles (AvX, Uncanny X-Men, Wolverine & the X- Men, Amazing S-M, Uncanny X-Force)
    - 18 were of their Big 3 franchises - Avengers, Spider-Man, or X-Men
    - Only other 2 were Hit-Girl #2 and Captain Marvel #1
    Note: I'm not including solo titles of Avengers characters as "Avengers" books, just team books with Avengers in the title.

    DC's Top 20 selling titles in July:
    - None were double-shipped titles
    - 10 were from their Big 3 franchises - Batman, Superman, Green Lantern
    - Another 4 were Before Watchmen titles

  4. #1144
    The Hero of Canton TehJofus's Avatar
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    Top 300: http://www.newsarama.com/comics/july...es-charts.html

    Just thought I'd point this out...

    157 134 10.16 GI COMBAT #3[*] $3.99 DC

    GI Combat's the 3rd lowest placed title, above Captain Atom and Voodoo. I doubt we'll be getting another replacement war series after it's gone!
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  5. #1145

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    Hahaha, bam. That's harsh.

    On the other hand, it's abject failure certainly is a boon for other, better titles low on the list like Frankenstein, I, Vampire and Demon knights! Huzzah!

    Also nice to see that Dial H is once more higher than Ravagers.
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  6. #1146

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    That said, Demon Knights' downward trajectory is...disappointing. I, Vampire (which is an amazing title) has risen (hah) above it.

    Still, with Grifter, DC Comics Presents, GI Combat, Blue Beetle, Firestorm and Hawkman all lower on the totem pole, and with Franky tying into the upcoming crossover with Animal Man and Swamp Thing, I think most of my favorite titles will be safe for the next purge, especially if Ravagers continues to drop like a damn stone.
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  7. #1147
    The Hero of Canton TehJofus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Desaad View Post
    On the other hand, it's abject failure certainly is a boon for other, better titles low on the list like Frankenstein, I, Vampire and Demon knights! Huzzah!
    Huzzah indeed. If it means Frankenstein gets to stick around longer, then I'm happy with any title failing.
    Quote Originally Posted by Desaad View Post
    Also nice to see that Dial H is once more higher than Ravagers.
    I was so happy to see that. Honestly, I'm really surprised Dial H is still in the top 100! Hopefully it's levelling out quite quickly and will stick around there, which should keep it safe for a good while.
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  8. #1148
    ACTION! DANGER! ROMANCE! Paul Newell's Avatar
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    July update:


    DC Sales - Top 300 (Jan-Jul) 2012 - 16,455,769 estimated units.

    DC Sales - Top 300 (Jan-Jul) 2011 - 11,836,158 estimated units.


    And here are the figures for the previous ten years:

    2011 - 26,522,201 estimated units
    2010 - 23,528,000 estimated units
    2009 - 24,126,336 estimated units
    2008 - 25,760,378 estimated units
    2007 - 29,597,217 estimated units
    2006 - 30,243,575 estimated units
    2005 - 26,995,698 estimated units
    2004 - 23,895,322 estimated units
    2003 - 22,344,120 estimated units
    2002 - 20,687,488 estimated units


    And out of interest, here's the Marvel numbers:


    Marvel Sales - Top 300 (Jan-Jul) 2012 - 17,232,601 estimated units.

    Marvel Sales - Top 300 (Jan-Jul) 2011 - 16,454,512 estimated units.


    And here are the figures for the previous ten years:

    2011 - 26,897,277 estimated units
    2010 - 29,998,200 estimated units
    2009 - 34,167,744 estimated units
    2008 - 37,269,988 estimated units
    2007 - 38,132,744 estimated units
    2006 - 34,647,105 estimated units
    2005 - 32,461,832 estimated units
    2004 - 32,021,066 estimated units
    2003 - 28,974,336 estimated units
    2002 - 28,473,404 estimated units

  9. #1149
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    Quote Originally Posted by TehJofus View Post
    Top 300: http://www.newsarama.com/comics/july...es-charts.html

    Just thought I'd point this out...

    157 134 10.16 GI COMBAT #3[*] $3.99 DC

    GI Combat's the 3rd lowest placed title, above Captain Atom and Voodoo. I doubt we'll be getting another replacement war series after it's gone!
    The thing with the war series is that those should be mini series or one shots or be a Vertigo title. There really wasn't a demand for them and that $3.99 isn't going to cut it.

    Nice to see the Young Justice Line (outside of TT) still getting it's collective behind torched by Miles Morales.

    It might not be the best choice from a sales standpoint but I appreciate DC's willingness to support lower selling books.
    Static Shock fans will HIGHLY disagree with that statement. Maybe it's about time DC realizes that some of their failing books aren't failing because they aren't good-you have fans/store owners that want those titles gone (be it for race, gender, genre or whatever reasons) so someone in their mind can get a series.

    Maybe each line needs a slot reserved for a character from that line-example
    Young Justice Presents-Raven for a six issue run, next Static for 6, next Blue Beetle and so on. So no one can complain what blank gets a series over someone else.

  10. #1150
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    Quote Originally Posted by skyvolt2000 View Post
    Static Shock fans will HIGHLY disagree with that statement. Maybe it's about time DC realizes that some of their failing books aren't failing because they aren't good-you have fans/store owners that want those titles gone (be it for race, gender, genre or whatever reasons) so someone in their mind can get a series.
    The Static relaunch pretty much failed even creatively. Rozum got screwed over by Danger and McDaniels. The character still has potential, but they need to start from scratch on that one.

  11. #1151
    Veteran Member Flashpoint's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Desaad View Post

    Also nice to see that Dial H is once more higher than Ravagers.
    I completely agree--and that's coming from someone who doesn't like Dial H. Ravagers is just that bad.

    And I'd never thought I'd live to see the day that Animal Man outsold Wolverine and Swamp Thing is selling just as many copies as Captain America. Better still, that's after 12 whole months and both books continue selling in healthy numbers.

    Dreams do come true.

  12. #1152
    Porn Addict paulski's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TehJofus View Post
    Just thought I'd point this out...
    157 134 10.16 GI COMBAT #3[*] $3.99 DC

    GI Combat's the 3rd lowest placed title, above Captain Atom and Voodoo. I doubt we'll be getting another replacement war series after it's gone!
    Yeah, I don't think there'll be a 3rd attempt, especially at $3.99.

    Quote Originally Posted by TehJofus View Post
    I was so happy to see that. Honestly, I'm really surprised Dial H is still in the top 100! Hopefully it's levelling out quite quickly and will stick around there, which should keep it safe for a good while.
    That's a pretty reasonable effort, considering it's such a 'way-out' book. The next few months will tell the story, though - if it can level out and stop shedding sales, it should have a future beyond the 12 months mark.

    Quote Originally Posted by skyvolt2000 View Post
    The thing with the war series is that those should be mini series or one shots or be a Vertigo title. There really wasn't a demand for them and that $3.99 isn't going to cut it.
    $3.99 just doesn't work for these kinds of niche titles. Yes, it helps reduce the number of sales the book needs to break even or justify its existence, but it also turns a lot more readers off by having to pay the extra $1 for something they're not super keen about.

    It's one of the reasons why I think Sword & Sorcery is really going to struggle.

    Quote Originally Posted by Flashpoint View Post
    I completely agree--and that's coming from someone who doesn't like Dial H. Ravagers is just that bad.
    The stupid part is, I would probably still be buying it - lousy comic and all - if they hadn't pulled that 17 pages crap with #2. That was completely unacceptable, even for a good title (which Ravagers isn't), so I dropped it then and there. Dumb dumb dumb, DC.

  13. #1153
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    Quote Originally Posted by skyvolt2000 View Post
    Maybe it's about time DC realizes that some of their failing books aren't failing because they aren't good-you have fans/store owners that want those titles gone (be it for race, gender, genre or whatever reasons) so someone in their mind can get a series.
    With the exception of OMAC, I haven't really heard many people sing the praises of any of the cancelled titles. The same holds true for the 5 titles that fell below 15,000 this month. I enjoyed some, disliked others, but can't say I really miss any of them. Part of the issue with people "hoping" that titles fail is that DC has decided to stay with this 52 number for now. This means that in order to expect a new title an existing one has to end.

    Now look at the first cancelled titles/2nd wave. We lost Static Shock, Mister Terrific, Hawk and Dove, Blackhawks, OMAC and Men of War, all of which sold very poorly. In their place we got Batman Inc, Earth 2, and Worlds' Finest which has all gotten better sales and overall reviews. We also got Dial H which is getting good reviews, Ravagers which looks to be DOA and GI Combat which everyone thought was an odd choice to begin with (replace one failing war title with another war title. If I could have gotten Earth 2, Batman Inc and Worlds' Finest without cutting other titles fine, but since I can't I'll live with the better titles we got.

  14. #1154
    Senior Member PennyDreadful's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flashpoint View Post
    I completely agree--and that's coming from someone who doesn't like Dial H. Ravagers is just that bad.

    And I'd never thought I'd live to see the day that Animal Man outsold Wolverine and Swamp Thing is selling just as many copies as Captain America. Better still, that's after 12 whole months and both books continue selling in healthy numbers.

    Dreams do come true.
    Swamp Thing and Animal Man were both characters with acclaimed titles in previous years and fan followings. I can imagine they'll survive. If Demon Knights is underperforming, that's sad but expected. It didn't live up to the hype.

    But what if Marvel comes up with, say, Wolverine and the Fantastic Four? How will that fare against Animal Man?

    Right now, the Big 2 are about even, sales-wise. Expect dueling events, like Marvel Now, in the months to come.

  15. #1155
    Veteran Member Flashpoint's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PennyDreadful View Post
    Swamp Thing and Animal Man were both characters with acclaimed titles in previous years and fan followings. I can imagine they'll survive. If Demon Knights is underperforming, that's sad but expected. It didn't live up to the hype.

    But what if Marvel comes up with, say, Wolverine and the Fantastic Four? How will that fare against Animal Man?

    Right now, the Big 2 are about even, sales-wise. Expect dueling events, like Marvel Now, in the months to come.
    Only now, Marvel is suddenly finding itself playing the role on the Diamond charts once held by DC: 2 or 3 books in the Top Ten, maybe 1 of them at #1, but stuck struggling to retake the #1 slot in Unit Share and Dollar Share.

    And how galling it must be for them to have so many titles @ $3.99 and they still lost Dollar Share to DC? LOL, I love irony!

    We'll see how the next set of numbers are, but right now DC must be chuckling to themselves to be #1 in *both* categories while Marvel is in the midst of their own "Now 52" relaunch--and this is after a full year of the New 52. That's comedic gold!

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