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Thread: Invincible

  1. #616
    I am the law. PsychoGoatee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Legato View Post
    Same here. I find myself reading this more than anything concerning Marvel/DC because Kirkman knows how to handle the morally gray issue pretty well. Also the deaths are well written. They're not handled as some kind of cheap shock value like Marvel and DC handles it. That and Invincible show you can write a series where the characters are gray in morality but are still considered heroes.

    If there is one nitpick about the comic it's finding a strong female character. Eve is the closest to that, despite some drawbacks.
    Does strong have to mean stoic? And by strong do you literally mean strength or strength of character, or strong character as in how thorough their characterization is? I think Eve fits the bill in any category personally. I do agree with several letters that we could use more female villains though.
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  2. #617
    Best In The World Legato's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PsychoGoatee View Post
    Does strong have to mean stoic? And by strong do you literally mean strength or strength of character, or strong character as in how thorough their characterization is? I think Eve fits the bill in any category personally. I do agree with several letters that we could use more female villains though.
    I thought that female Viltrumite had potential to be a antagonist of Mark but alas. And to answer your question I was preferring the strength of character, which Eve definitely has. She's a distaff counterpart to Mark in that she's flawed and she makes mistakes like him.
    "It isn't jumping the shark if you never come back down." Chuck

  3. #618

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    Quote Originally Posted by Legato View Post
    Same here. I find myself reading this more than anything concerning Marvel/DC because Kirkman knows how to handle the morally gray issue pretty well.
    Better then most anything I have read from Marvel or DC, personally I get a a bit tired of how they write characters as either evil or so goody goody it becomes annoying along with cliche speech and ways of thinking that just blinds together.

  4. #619
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xiroteus View Post
    Better then most anything I have read from Marvel or DC, personally I get a a bit tired of how they write characters as either evil or so goody goody it becomes annoying along with cliche speech and ways of thinking that just blinds together.
    I see where you're coming from. I'm also tired of the typical cliché surrounding death in comics. A character dies but it comes off really cheap and meaningless when you and I both know they're just going to bring them back to life in one way or another. Here the character deaths actually are more meaningful and have a profound impact.
    "It isn't jumping the shark if you never come back down." Chuck

  5. #620
    Senior Member ascended's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Legato View Post
    I see where you're coming from. I'm also tired of the typical cliché surrounding death in comics. A character dies but it comes off really cheap and meaningless when you and I both know they're just going to bring them back to life in one way or another. Here the character deaths actually are more meaningful and have a profound impact.
    Hell, most everything has a more profound impact, its creator owned.

    With Marvel and DC, the parent companies have investments to protect. Warners cant allow Superman to become some dark anti-hero with a Frank Castle-like kill count. They wont even allow the characters to evolve or grow beyond a certain point because it would force a shift away from the recognizable and marketable status quo. So the only recourse left is to use the empty shock value gimmick. Kill off a character, even though that death is going to end up short lived, or change the power set/costume around temporarily, put someone else in the mask, or whatever. We all know its going to roll back to the familiar territory before long.

    Kirkman however, can do whatever the hell he wants with his book. Anything at all. And the man certainly knows what hes doing. That's the thing, not only does he have the freedom to tell his story his way, but he has to be one of the best people in the industry. I wonder if the big companies have ever approached him about doing some work for them? If they havent, they really should. If Kirkman put his name to a run of Iron Man or Superman or something, sales would see a nice solid jump and likely be of higher quality.

  6. #621
    Senior Member capuga's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ascended View Post
    Kirkman however, can do whatever the hell he wants with his book. Anything at all. And the man certainly knows what hes doing. That's the thing, not only does he have the freedom to tell his story his way, but he has to be one of the best people in the industry. I wonder if the big companies have ever approached him about doing some work for them? If they havent, they really should. If Kirkman put his name to a run of Iron Man or Superman or something, sales would see a nice solid jump and likely be of higher quality.
    Kirkman worked at Marvel for awhile. He wrote Marvel Team Up, Ant Man, Ultimate X-men, Marvel Zombies. His name wasn't nearly as big then. But he has no interest in work for hire (and no need for the money at this point we can probably assume). His willingness to drop everything but his Image creator owned books was the clinching item that allowed him to be named an Image partner.
    My comicartfans.com collection. Lots of Ryan Ottley:
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  7. #622
    voice of reason wiski's Avatar
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    I really like this What If... that Kirkamn did, partially because I'm also a fan of Oeming.

    What If Thor was the Herald of Galactus?

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  8. #623
    Old Member Jokebox's Avatar
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    I wish they would do three 33 issue digital omnibuses like they did with The Walking Dead. That's how I got caught up before issue 100 was released. I spent a ridiculous amount on comics since I started last summer. I'm interested in this, but there just seems to be too many issues to jump in.

  9. #624
    Senior Member capuga's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jokebox View Post
    I wish they would do three 33 issue digital omnibuses like they did with The Walking Dead. That's how I got caught up before issue 100 was released. I spent a ridiculous amount on comics since I started last summer. I'm interested in this, but there just seems to be too many issues to jump in.
    I used to have an offer going that I would ship my trade collection for free to anyone who wanted to try the series. Unfortunately, one of the people I sent them to did not send them back so I can't offer that to you. But here's some ways to get caught up, one of which is pretty cheap:

    There are currently 99 issues out plus an issue 0 and Invincible Returns 1 (both of which are included in the various collected editions. There are several ways to get these:

    - There are 3 huge Library editions. They each contain 2 Ultimate Collections worth of issues. These are extra oversized with a bunch of extras in the back. The 3 volumes will bring you through Invincible Returns 1, which is just before issue 71. They are pricey though, about $75 - $80 each on amazon. About $3.34 an issue.
    - There are 7 Ultimate Collections hardcovers. They each contain 2 trades worth of issues. These are oversized and I believe the best value for the money. They also have a bunch of extras in the back. The 7 volumes would get you through issue 78. These are about $25 each on amazon. About $2.19 an issue.
    - There is a Compendium edition. It contains the first 8 trades and goes through issue 48. It is not oversized and has no extras. It is a very good value and cheap way to get a chunk of issues. This is about #35 - $40 on amazon. About $.75 an issue.
    - There are 17 trades. These have a few extras in the back. These trades go through issue 96. They are about $10 - $14 each on amazon. About $2.10 an issue.

    These series is so much more enjoyable if you start from the beginning. Not only is it a great read, but there are plot threads and character development that will mean much more to you if you have the history with the book. But if catching up on all those issues is too much I would recommend the following (much cheaper) way to do it:

    - Track down a copy of issue #0. It was a jumping on point / recap issue that was released when the series was in the mid-#20's and gives an early history of the series.
    - Pick up a copy of Invincible Returns #1 (this should be much easier to find). This is another jumping on point / recap issue released just after issue #70 and gives some of the more recent history of the series.
    - This leads directly into the Viltrumite War which is one of the bigger events in the series and leads into current events. So I wouldn't skip it. I'd pick up trades 14 to 17 which get you up to issue 96.
    - Then the singles for 97 through 99 (the milestone issue 100 is coming out next week).

    You'd miss some good stuff this way (particularly the Conquest arc that happens just before the Invincible Returns issue) and the events won't have as much impact because you won't have built the attachment and history to the characters but it wouldn't be a bad way to get caught up for fairly cheap.

    Or just read the Wikipedia info and jump on with issue 100.
    My comicartfans.com collection. Lots of Ryan Ottley:
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    Invincible universe wiki (WIP):
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  10. #625
    Best In The World Legato's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ascended View Post
    Hell, most everything has a more profound impact, its creator owned.

    With Marvel and DC, the parent companies have investments to protect. Warners cant allow Superman to become some dark anti-hero with a Frank Castle-like kill count. They wont even allow the characters to evolve or grow beyond a certain point because it would force a shift away from the recognizable and marketable status quo. So the only recourse left is to use the empty shock value gimmick. Kill off a character, even though that death is going to end up short lived, or change the power set/costume around temporarily, put someone else in the mask, or whatever. We all know its going to roll back to the familiar territory before long.

    Kirkman however, can do whatever the hell he wants with his book. Anything at all. And the man certainly knows what hes doing. That's the thing, not only does he have the freedom to tell his story his way, but he has to be one of the best people in the industry. I wonder if the big companies have ever approached him about doing some work for them? If they havent, they really should. If Kirkman put his name to a run of Iron Man or Superman or something, sales would see a nice solid jump and likely be of higher quality.
    That depends on the character and the feedback. For instance if a character is insanely popular then chances are they'll bring the character back at some point. Especially if said character is apart of a live action adaptation so they'll bring the character back just to promote the movie. They brought back Captain America from the dead just in time to promote his movie and The Avengers movie.

    You're right that out of all the writers Kirkman is one of the few that actually knows how to tell a story. Take the situation between Invincible and Omni-Man for example. You'd think it was going to be the classic father vs son angle but Kirkman took that cliché and turned it around and made it much more than that.
    "It isn't jumping the shark if you never come back down." Chuck

  11. #626

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    Quote Originally Posted by capuga View Post
    Kirkman worked at Marvel for awhile. He wrote Marvel Team Up, Ant Man, Ultimate X-men, Marvel Zombies. His name wasn't nearly as big then. But he has no interest in work for hire (and no need for the money at this point we can probably assume). His willingness to drop everything but his Image creator owned books was the clinching item that allowed him to be named an Image partner.
    The Ultimate Team-up with Invincible was awesome though. And Marvel Zombies really went to hell once Kirkman left it.

  12. #627
    Senior Member capuga's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gooftastic View Post
    The Ultimate Team-up with Invincible was awesome though. And Marvel Zombies really went to hell once Kirkman left it.
    Yeah, Invincible's meeting with the Avengers cracked me up. Awesome that Marvel let him do that.
    My comicartfans.com collection. Lots of Ryan Ottley:
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    Invincible universe wiki (WIP):
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  13. #628
    voice of reason wiski's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jokebox View Post
    I wish they would do three 33 issue digital omnibuses like they did with The Walking Dead. That's how I got caught up before issue 100 was released. I spent a ridiculous amount on comics since I started last summer. I'm interested in this, but there just seems to be too many issues to jump in.
    For some reason you can gets the trades pretty cheap on E-Bay. I got 1-10 for $60 when I first started reading it, and much more recently I managed to pick up 1-14 for $50 shipped for my cousin.

    No idea why they sell so cheap, but they do.
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  14. #629
    Senior Member ascended's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Legato View Post
    That depends on the character and the feedback. For instance if a character is insanely popular then chances are they'll bring the character back at some point. Especially if said character is apart of a live action adaptation so they'll bring the character back just to promote the movie. They brought back Captain America from the dead just in time to promote his movie and The Avengers movie.
    This is true, but there was next to no fan outcry for the return of Barry Allen, and a generation after his death he is back. Now, there were some fans who complained about it online, but that was a very vocal, very small minority.

    There is absolutely NO demand for Vibe, but he's being brought back.

    Jason Todd. Bucky. Two sidekicks that were remembered only for dying. They're both back. No one asked for that.

    You're right though, and the examples I listed are largely story-driven or the work of creators with a soft spot for the character/s in question.

    Dont mind me. I dont get to the LCS until tomorrow, so I have to wait a day for Invinicible 100, and its making me cranky.

  15. #630
    Senior Member capuga's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ascended View Post
    Dont mind me. I dont get to the LCS until tomorrow, so I have to wait a day for Invinicible 100, and its making me cranky.
    Don't want to make you more cranky but...Invincible 100 doesn't come out until next week unfortunately.
    My comicartfans.com collection. Lots of Ryan Ottley:
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    Invincible universe wiki (WIP):
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