Black Panther Appreciation VII: "Return of the King"

[nj06]

[QUOTE=Shaoken;14487983][QUOTE=Mr MajestiK;14487665]The fact that both Tony Stark and Cyclops have been portrayed as self centered jerks with delusions of grandeur doesn't seem to have had an adverse effect on their ability to "lead" their respective camps.

Can you honestly say that either one of these characters commands the full trust or universal respect of their associates?

In a word; yes.

In the wall of text version; Cyclops is a dick. That is undisutable, anyone who knows him would agree with it. I wouldn't say he had delusions of grandeur, but he certainly is an asshole and on a personal level can be difficult to get along with. But when it comes to the fighting you can always trust on him fighting for the same thing you are, which as an X-Men is a better future for mutantkind where they can live in piece with humanity.

As for Stark, he's a dick as well, but let's use Civil War as an example of this; he could only lead the people who shared his beliefs on the Registration act. As he put it to Captain America even if he abandoned the Pro-Reg side and joined him, there were plenty of heroes who would still be on that side. Compare with Captain America (who, like Superman, is really the prime example of what a Great leader is), whose mere presence was enough to get 95% of the anti-reg side to fight with him (as pointed out by Stark, with the exception of Cage and a few others, the majority of those guys were fighting with ihm because it was Captan America). And after the Civil War through The Initiative and Secret Invasion a lot of heroes didn't trust Tony Stark personally. They trust him now because the registration act is gone.

But with T'Challa, Wakanda is always going to exist (unless some writer decides to Genosha it, but hopefully that never happens) so Wakanda is always going to be his first prority. With Cyclopes you knew that he was always going to do what he thought was the best thing for human-mutant relations, protecting the world that hates and fears them. With Stark, you knew he was trying to do what was best for all superheroes, although that did cause friction between him and the other heroes.




Oh no, don't get me wrong. He had valid motivations for doing so, he did it for all the right reasons, I'm just citing it as an example of how there will never be a 100% trust going on between him and the other heroes.




My arguement basically is boiling down to priorities; as King T'Challa will always put Wakanda first (which I will stress is the right thing for him to do), wereas with those heroes if you were on their team you agreed with their #1 priority.




I should have made that clearer; yes it should be his top priority. It is the right thing for him to have it as his top priority.



It just showed how T'Challa viewed things. He was willing to put the entire global economy in danger to stop Killmonger from taking over Wakanda. Yes it helped him achieve that and yes he did fix the economy afterwards, but still when was the last time you saw Captain America put the livelyhoods of Europe in danger to stop the Red Skull? From another heroes perspective; Wakanda itself was in no real immediate danger. Sure Killmonger could have taken over the country through the economy, but T'Challa could have let it happen and then erode his support and prove him to be a horrible king before taking the crown back. He chose the fastest solution to stop Killmonger, but it was also the one that would have had the worst results for everyone but Wakanda if he had failed (and to illustrate the point; he came close to failing).

It was a brillant plan, but if you were a hero who had experienced the hardships that came with seeing a loved one lose their job and experience unemployment in a bad job market, that might cause some resentment issues if this guy became leader of you team. It would illustrate just what T'Challa is willing to risk for Wakanda.




I'm not arguing that, I'm just trying to illustrate a point (which clearly I am failing missirably to do here). He had a brilliant plan, and he did fix the problem, but he came incredibly close to dying there which he did not plan on. Let's say that instead of rendering him comatose Killmonger actually killed him while he was distracted, who would have fixed the world's economy then? He took a gamble with the wellbeing of 8 billion people and almost lost.




They have, but they share similar #1 prorities with the people they lead. As for T'Challa, he has been called out on it in the past, but as of late he has not.




That actually hurts.

I don't think he'd make a good leader (althogth I will amend my previous assertain; he won't be a good leader of a team that is not made up of people he does not have a long and healthy relationship with, such as the FF, Cage,Falcon, Fist, Cap, etc.), but that doesn't mean I don't think he'd make a good and valuable member of a team. I'm honestly suprised nobody thought to include him in the Forever Foundation (they can just ignore Doomwar so he can get along with Doom). He'd fit so perfectly in there it makes no sense that he's not.




Or is earned and given to the Worthy. And T'Challa has earned his fair share of respect and in turn respects others even if he doesn't fully trust him (case in point; he respected Justice enough to trust him to help rescue a plan from Hydroman soley because Justice was an Avenger, that's just how much he respects the team).



Nothing. That is perfectly valid. I can respect such a monarch. On the flip side, I would be hesitant to trust him 100% to help better him own country, since I know that if it came down to Wakanda or Australia he will (and rightly so) put Wakanda ahead.

And christ, this thread moves too damn fast now. It locked by the time I finished this.

How is Cyclops' feelings for mutantkind any different than T'Challa's feelings for Wakanda? BP putting Wakanda before everything is no different than Cyke putting mutants before everything. Cyclops wants to improve human-mutant relations? Then he should let Storm lead, as she and BP are the perfect example of Human & Mutants working together for a better world!

[Moose100]

[Umbra]

How is Cyclops' feelings for mutantkind any different than T'Challa's feelings for Wakanda? BP putting Wakanda before everything is no different than Cyke putting mutants before everything. Cyclops wants to improve human-mutant relations? Then he should let Storm lead, as she and BP are the perfect example of Human & Mutants working together for a better world!

Try not to make to much sense there.

[Umbra]

Kill Them All.

[Moose100]

Kill Them All.

His art almost has a Mcdaniel vibe to it...

[Umbra]

And what a great page it is. My favorite line in that story is when the fighter amalgamation skrull says to T'Challa, "I have trained my entire life to face you." and T'Challa answers, "Then you have already lost. For I have trained my entire life to face the unknown."

Now the unknown is what is going to happen to this character in the coming year?

Will he get another ongoing?

Will Marvel keep he and Storm together with the Avengers vs the X-Men coming up and there are so many fans who want them apart.

Hopefully we will have "The Return of the King" story we BP fans really want. Oh I still want a year one type story. I believe T'Challa deserves one and it could be very interesting since he is such a complicated character. I just want to see the formation of Marvel's one true heroic polymath.

I want Jason Aaron to write Black Panther, either on the Avengers if he gets the book, or a solo, or team up book with Storm. Something.



Yes, T'challa is one of the greatest fighters on earth!

[Shaoken]

How is Cyclops' feelings for mutantkind any different than T'Challa's feelings for Wakanda? BP putting Wakanda before everything is no different than Cyke putting mutants before everything. Cyclops wants to improve human-mutant relations? Then he should let Storm lead, as she and BP are the perfect example of Human & Mutants working together for a better world!

They're not. Just that all the X-Men share the same #1 proirity, but T'Challa is the only Wakandian superhero besides Shuri. And sometimes, having Wakana as your #1 prority can clash with some of the mainstream 616 heroes #1 prorities.

As for letting Storm lead, I don't think she wants it atm. If she ever does want it, she can take it easily. Maybe this time she'd blindfold herself to make things fair for Scott *nods*. But putting Storm in charge might not be a great PR move with Wakandian/international relations what they are at the moment.

[Moose100]

I want Jason Aaron to write Black Panther, either on the Avengers if he gets the book, or a solo, or team up book with Storm. Something.



Yes, T'challa is one of the greatest fighters on earth!

Yes Aaron was being a tease when he left lol

[Shaoken]

Kill Them All.

Didn't T'Challa have a thing against killing people? Or do Skrulls not count for conciences (that's actually what bugged me about Secret Invasion; all the heroes had no qualms killing Skrulls at all, even if they had similar resevations about killing humans).

[Umbra]

They're not. Just that all the X-Men share the same #1 proirity, but T'Challa is the only Wakandian superhero besides Shuri. And sometimes, having Wakana as your #1 prority can clash with some of the mainstream 616 heroes #1 prorities.

As for letting Storm lead, I don't think she wants it atm. If she ever does want it, she can take it easily. Maybe this time she'd blindfold herself to make things fair for Scott *nods*. But putting Storm in charge might not be a great PR move with Wakandian/international relations what they are at the moment.

That's still a excuse though and he has lead teams before, and he has also been on teams before. That Wakanda excuse nearly always lead to limbo. So please, it's not a good argument on your part.

[Umbra]

Didn't T'Challa have a thing against killing people? Or do Skrulls not count for conciences (that's actually what bugged me about Secret Invasion; all the heroes had no qualms killing Skrulls at all, even if they had similar resevations about killing humans).

No he doesn't have a thing against Killing people. He has before.

[Moose100]

[Moose100]

The fact that we're debating Tchalla's leaadership is a good reason for Marvel to do it from a story telling perspective. I mean no one ever expected Cage to lead right?(Or alot of other heroes for that matter.)

[nj06]

Didn't T'Challa have a thing against killing people? Or do Skrulls not count for conciences (that's actually what bugged me about Secret Invasion; all the heroes had no qualms killing Skrulls at all, even if they had similar resevations about killing humans).

T'Challa does kill, but almost always as a last resort.

The Skrull invasion was different. When it comes to war, T'Challa will kill. Especially since the Skrulls were going to kill him and Storm and then enslave his people to mine the vibranium.

[Moose100]

If BP was to lead what team would or should he lead? And who?

I think the NA is a GREAT fit for him he knows all of them. On the other side Id like to see him on SA.