Naruto Manga/Anime Discussion IV

[Hazard]

Okay so new episode, in which we learn communication is a good thing.

Seriously if you had a plan why didn't you tell your subordinate about it? Hell, why did you go out of your way to look like a cowardly ass?

Under the circumstances Omoi was more than justified to act like he did, so don't even pretend this is remotely his fault.

On the plus side, I liked the conversation Omoi had with the Swordsmen at the end and the passing of the blades. Nice.

Also, that was a girl!

[Dark Soul # 7]

It'll never happen. They're so below this fight's level that I doubt they'd even be noticed before getting squashed into paste.

Hell, the only reason Naruto's on this fight's level is because the manga's named after him, and he's currently got a plot device up his backside so entrenched that a dozen enemas and a team of proctologists couldn't remove it.

They will probably show up and try to help but fail. But the willingness to fight impossible odds for Naruto will push said titular character beyond the few physical limits he has left as he thinks about how happy he is that he has friends now. Because we can't ever get it hammered in enough that Naruto didn't use to have friends but he has friends now. Then he'll beat Madara with the power of friendship and mountain-busting inner demon energy.

Everybody else cheerleads him on.

Yeays.

[Guy1]

They will probably show up and try to help but fail. But the willingness to fight impossible odds for Naruto will push said titular character beyond the few physical limits he has left as he thinks about how happy he is that he has friends now. Because we can't ever get it hammered in enough that Naruto didn't use to have friends but he has friends now. Then he'll beat Madara with the power of friendship and mountain-busting inner demon energy.

Everybody else cheerleads him on.

Yeays.

And then....

Madara: LOL genjutsu!

[Siriel]

Don't be silly. Genjutsu was Itachi's schtick.

Madara will toss it back with his fan.

[Hazard]

You know, I wouldn't actually mind that. Much as I like power of friendship thing, Saint Seiya Omega has shown me there is something special about the villain no selling it because 'Hey, I'm still freaking strong'.

[The Dog]

Don't be silly. Genjutsu was Itachi's schtick.

Madara will toss it back with his fan.

Then Naruto suddenly summons the Rikudou Sennin to battle Madara. Why? Because at this point, he's the only guy who can actually defeat Madara.

Let's face it, Naruto's combat moves are "kage bunshin" (which Madara can do), "rasengan" and it's variations (most of which consist of making more rasengans or bigger ones which are useless against Madara), Rasen-shuriken (which Madara can tank), and Kyuubi chakra monster (which Madara can absorb and restrain easily with trees).

So, unless the bijuudama can take out Madara, then Naruto's only hope is summoning someone more broken than Madara.

[Eternal Torment]

I have this odd feeling that I want Naruto to do that explosive kunai kancho on Madara and beat him that way.

[Kamina]

All out ignoring the fact that last issue we see Madara get hit with a giant attack, one that full out showed him and his susanoo being knocked from the attack, then not connecting that act to the scene here were we see Madara knocked down. I mean, why is he knocked down? I know last issue a strong character used one of his most powerful attacks on Madara....

I didn't remember the Daytime Tiger being there. And in the scan I saw, it was "HIRU DORA!", and I didn't acknowledge that as the Japanese jutsu title. But that's trivial. That all stemmed from me forgetting (and not finding until moments ago) where Gai used DT.

http://postimage.org/image/7z9qjcfp3/

[Rafha]

Madara is like the most relaxed villain ever.

"Oh well, guess I have to start my master plan now that the giant monster is awake..."

Whats is that Madara pose in last page, lol.

[The Dog]

Whats is that Madara pose in last page, lol.

I like to think that pose is his 'I've already healed from your attack, but I'm gonna sit for a moment and let you think you did something. You know, let you feel good about yourself for a precious few seconds before your parting. I think I'll leave part of you here, part of you over there, and part of you WAY over there, staining those boulders' pose.

[Robotech Master]

I like to think that pose is his 'I've already healed from your attack, but I'm gonna sit for a moment and let you think you did something. You know, let you feel good about yourself for a precious few seconds before your parting. I think I'll leave part of you here, part of you over there, and part of you WAY over there, staining those boulders' pose.

So Madara is ripping off my Shen Quote? That Dick...

[flashdisk]

I got you covered dog...er....Hazmat.




Here, read this.

An interesting explanation. But it really isn't enough for me. I still remember from recent chapters that this was the Obito who would take the time to help an elderly lady cross the road, and I thought it showed a strong sense of compassion for others. And though I do think that Obito had a breaking point, I don't really feel the weight of his experience was enough to overcome that. I am not blind to how much he had trained for the one goal of protecting his friends only to see that squashed. But I don't feel that it was enough to merit his recent actions. And that's why I would still want it expanded upon.

In my opinion, the manga should be able to make the readers feel why the characters are doing what they're doing. I don't feel the manga has done enough of that in regards to Obito's fall. That's just how I feel about it.


Maybe if there was something more to Rin's death. Maybe if it hid some sort of greater betrayal.

Although, I usually forget about motivations when the character is kicking people's butts.





But anyway, the most recent chapter is interesting in that the Juubi has finally appeared. This makes me wonder how the 10 tails will react. For example, I want to know if the other tailed beasts still have some influence on its actions. How can we even be so sure that the 10 tails would be on Madara's side? Also I think it would be interesting to see what Madara has planned for the world. I want to see Naruto lose this battle, actually. I don't see how Naruto can beat Madara, unless the 10 tails takes his side. Then Naruto can go on an adventure to save the world from Madara's genjutsu.

[Hazard]

am not blind to how much he had trained for the one goal of protecting his friends only to see that squashed. But I don't feel that it was enough to merit his recent actions.

Ah..

No. Forget it.

Going through this argument so many times is just so damn depressing.

[The Transient Guest]

Now before I start in I want to say:

An interesting explanation. But it really isn't enough for me.

That y'all can't empathize with or understand the motivations of others is fun to argue with. It occurs to me that all this stems from "well that's not what I would do so I don't understand it."
Intellectual and factual arguments are fun, but showing someone they are are doing it wrong on an emotional level.....that's just entertaining.

Here's the part where everyone can quit reading if they are done with this discussion.

I still remember from recent chapters that this was the Obito who would take the time to help an elderly lady cross the road, and I thought it showed a strong sense of compassion for others

.
He did care about others, he did want to help, he had a metric fuck ton of compassion for the world and wanted to make it a better place where his friends and the same people you just mentioned would not only be safe, but happy.

And though I do think that Obito had a breaking point, I don't really feel the weight of his experience was enough to overcome that.

You right, the weight of betrayal from your best friend. Of losing your bestest friend ( to your best friend ). Of having everything you've done since coming a hairs breadth from dying means nothing.

You know that outlook of compassion you mentioned. All that compassion is useless. It's pointless. What good is compassion in a world where a friend kills another? What good is caring about others when all that care amounts to a lightning fist through someone's major organs?

I am not blind to how much he had trained for the one goal of protecting his friends only to see that squashed. But I don't feel that it was enough to merit his recent actions. And that's why I would still want it expanded upon.

Hey, if you put your entire world and everything you have into something that turns out to be meaningless I'm sure you would decide that the most mature way to handle it would be to go get a job at the ramen shop.

In my opinion, the manga should be able to make the readers feel why the characters are doing what they're doing. I don't feel the manga has done enough of that in regards to Obito's fall. That's just how I feel about it.

I'm gonna let someone else answer this one, one sec.

See... it's stuff like this that makes me feel like you aren't actually reading the manga properly. Because these are not the facts of what happened.

I mean, I feel kind of bad for Kishimoto because he's taken the trouble to write a pretty convincing character transition from hero to monster through sadness and apathy for Obito and people are just outright ignoring it...

Thank Ya Nik.

Saw this, had to share it: http://www.lolbrary.com/content/497/...bate-30497.gif

[flashdisk]

Now before I start in I want to say:


That y'all can't empathize with or understand the motivations of others is fun to argue with. It occurs to me that all this stems from "well that's not what I would do so I don't understand it."
Intellectual and factual arguments are fun, but showing someone they are are doing it wrong on an emotional level.....that's just entertaining.

Actually, I find that that's not accurate. Understanding someone and being able to relate to someone doesn't mean that there will be an agreement. But even then as a reader I am still left wanting at the understanding and relating stage. It's basically the story of Obito suffering the loss of Rin; that's a big loss. On paper it sounds good, but on an emotional level it feels lacking.

And I think emotions do play a big part in how we feel about the manga; its themes and conflicts.

I think there are characters that are supposed to be unrelatable. Those who are supposed to be cut and dry evil and beyond understanding. But I don't think Obito is one of those characters, that all changed when they took off his mask.

Now before I start in I want to say:


.
He did care about others, he did want to help, he had a metric fuck ton of compassion for the world and wanted to make it a better place where his friends and the same people you just mentioned would not only be safe, but happy.

There is a big difference between experiencing the pain from the world and losing one's idealism and taking part in making it worse. And that's what Obito just did.

You right, the weight of betrayal from your best friend. Of losing your bestest friend ( to your best friend ). Of having everything you've done since coming a hairs breadth from dying means nothing.

You know that outlook of compassion you mentioned. All that compassion is useless. It's pointless. What good is compassion in a world where a friend kills another? What good is caring about others when all that care amounts to a lightning fist through someone's major organs?

And the very fact that Obito was willing to die for his ideals that this strikes me as wrong. The same goes for the difficulties he went through to become a ninja. The way I see it, Obito had already gone through many difficulties for his hopes and dreams and invested so much into it that I find it hard to believe that even Rin's death could have sent all of that crashing to the ground.

For someone who was expressing such strong convictions during Kakashi gaiden, its awkward to see him be the first to lose it.

Hey, if you put your entire world and everything you have into something that turns out to be meaningless I'm sure you would decide that the most mature way to handle it would be to go get a job at the ramen shop.

They do what makes them happy.

I'm gonna let someone else answer this one, one sec.
Thank Ya Nik.

How convincing it is is, depends on who's reading.

And that's why I repeat what I stated before. I think the manga needs to expand on Obito's motivations; particularly on his relationship with Rin. From what I've seen, she barely even noticed Obito. So I want to know if there was something more.