NBA 2011-12 Season Thread

**kalorama** · 04-25-2012, 12:23 PM

Even with Nash, the Nets would have zero chance to compete for a title with that cast. They'd be lucky to make the playoffs. Agree about Orlando. They're going to regret not trading Howard for Bynum when they had the chance. Atlanta is perpetually overrated, but Nash might make them barely good enough to get to the conference Finals. But they'd still lose to the Bulls or the Heat.

**Cavemold** · 04-25-2012, 12:27 PM

Is harden going be out for the playoffs?

**frankiedetroit** · 04-25-2012, 02:23 PM

Originally Posted by BYC

7 games is a lot for any one suspension. But the problem is that there's no good way to gauge how to issue suspensions in general.

What's the baseline for an action that prevents a player from playing?
Should it be based on how long the opposing player is out? What if the opposing player ends up having problems with this injury after the suspension?
Should repeat offenders get more games?
Should it be increased because it was a headshot?
Should it be increased because it was a star player?
Is the goal to punish the offending player? Or is the goal a warning to future offenders?

It is very difficult to quantify any of these things.

I would go with a high starting number, but then people start picking apart the reasons and compare and contrast penalty lengths. Because this is Metta World Peace, and he has a history, 7 games is probably too few.

I believe: Repeaters should absolutely get longer penalties; the crippling effect on the victim should have some role in the suspension; and the goal is to warn future offenders—see how no one has gone into the stands since that 86-game suspension. The 'star' ness of any player involved is tricky. You don't want anyone knocked out, but having Durant or LBJ or Kobe knocked out is bad for the fans, ratings, etc.

A buddy of mine said Harden instigated it. He did run into Artest, but I certainly wouldn't say there was any malice in that. Artest knew what he was doing when he threw that elbow—that someone had bumped him and he was getting him off of him. I believe he did not mean to knock the guy out, but when you swing an elbow past your head, you have to imagine it will hit someone else's head.

**Hiromi** · 04-25-2012, 05:35 PM

The "Harden instigated it" argument is retarded, he was clearly getting into position to take the inbound pass or escort it when World Peace backed into him.

**Cavemold** · 04-25-2012, 06:10 PM

I don't know about that . He stepped in Ron artest way

**StoneGold** · 04-25-2012, 06:33 PM

Originally Posted by frankiedetroit

I believe: Repeaters should absolutely get longer penalties;

Undoubtedly. But it has been forever since he was a repeat offender.

That said, I wouldn't be saying crap if the suspension was for five days. Funny what two days will do. Somehow, seven, in the playoffs, puts it at somewhat excessive.

**Hiromi** · 04-25-2012, 06:41 PM

Originally Posted by Cavemold

I don't know about that . He stepped in Ron artest way

Which just happened to be where the players who receive or escort the inbound usually stand? Yeah not buying it for an instant, he was where he was supposed to be. Maybe he expected Artest to actually look where he was going, but I see nothing saying he intentionally stepped into him, for one he was already done moving when Artest bumped into him.

**kalorama** · 04-25-2012, 10:32 PM

And even if Harden did intentionally bump him . . . SFW? Players bump each other all the time on the court. There's a way to respond to that, and it's not elbowing a guy in the head.

**Aubergine~!** · 04-25-2012, 10:37 PM

Originally Posted by kalorama

Not only is it not in Nash's best interests to re-sign, it's not in the Suns' best interest to re-sign him. Yeah, it'll help ticket sales, but that's a short term gain. At some point they need to start rebuilding the team for a competitive future. The longer they put off getting it started, the longer it'll take for them to finish it.

Yeah, kinda sucks, but Nash's time in Phoenix really should be done now. Time for him to start ring chasing.

Originally Posted by kalorama

The problem for Nash is that all of the legit contenders already have top flight starting PGs, so they won't need him. Unless he wants to be a backup, his best shot may be to go to a middling playoff team like Atlanta or Orlando and hope that his addition can help put them over the top.

This is all Jeremy Lin's fault.

Thing about Nash is that he's suspect on defense and he really only plays in a certain way. Teams have to build around him to an extent, and it's harder for him to slot into already good teams, as there will have to be huge adjustments, which may not be worth it for an aging guard.

That said, something like Nash to Miami would be hella fun.

**Kasper Cole** · 04-25-2012, 10:49 PM

For those that don't know Artest DID receive a harsher punishment because of his past misbehavior. He got seven games (6 of which will be playoff games), usually an elbow to the head results in a 1 or 2 game suspension.

Also Harden missed two games, and that was mostly due to the fact that he had to pass league mandated tests before he could be allowed to play. Harden felt he was ready to play shortly after he got hurt.

The excuse that Harden instigated the incident is bullshit and I say that as a life long Lakers fans. Ron Artest took a cheap shot and he deserved to get punished for it.

I do think people are blowing the whole thing out of proportion though because it's Ron Artest and it was a nationally televised game.

**jesse_custer** · 04-26-2012, 07:11 AM

I think Harden was subtlely disrupting Artest's celebration. Watching the replay, I just can't see any reason for Harden to bump into him - it doesn't look accidental at all. Still, that doesn't justify the elbow.

I believe Artest's suspension is just right. More than likely, he's going to sit out the first round of the playoffs. If people think his past should be considered, that means the league has to consider his improvement over the last three years. He gave up his ring for charity and even won an award last year.

**Kasper Cole** · 04-26-2012, 07:33 AM

Originally Posted by jesse_custer

I think Harden was subtlely disrupting Artest's celebration. Watching the replay, I just can't see any reason for Harden to bump into him - it doesn't look accidental at all. Still, that doesn't justify the elbow.

I believe Artest's suspension is just right. More than likely, he's going to sit out the first round of the playoffs. If people think his past should be considered, that means the league has to consider his improvement over the last three years. He gave up his ring for charity and even won an award last year.

Yeah, he won the NBA citizenship award last year. As I said people are blowing it out of proportion because it's Ron Artest, if it had been another player it wouldn't be NEARLY as big of a deal. It's especially laughable to hear Bruce Bowen try and lecture someone about dirty plays.

I do think Harden was slightly getting in Artest's way, but that's hardly instigating what happened.

**BYC** · 04-26-2012, 08:14 AM

Nash to Miami would be interesting, but he just can't fit into their defensive system because he can't guard anybody. But it would be hilarious to see Nash there as the old white guy and trying to do flying chest bumps with LeBron and Wade.