Minorities and Other Issues in Comics Thread/Community III

[wyokid]

Casting TI as ANY black hero is called flavor of the moment casting. You want whoever is popular to a certain demographic while hoping the rest of us will watch the film.

Sadly that is never a successful deal. When you have them in big roles.

We saw that with Steel (Shaq), Lottery Ticket (Bow Wow), Catwoman (Halle Berry) and will see that with Kim Kardashian in Tyler Perry's upcoming filming this fall.

If he is cast as the Falcon or any black hero. Marvel is just trying to get extra coverage from Vibe, BET and other black media outlets that normally ignore them.

That's why is has been so hard to cast a black hero in a film.

You put Arlen Escapeta, Arjay Smith, Lee Thompson Young, James Tyler Williams and Donald Glover. A lot of the black media and community will tune that film out. Because these guys have manage to do something that not many can do-appeal to people outside their race. They have made decent careers without doing Tyler Perry films or "degrading" black films or going in and out of the jail house. 4 of these guys have television shows either on now, airing in the summer or in the fall. They have 2 black cast films among them.

I think casting TI would damage the film because who outside of his fans would want to see a 7 time felon on the big screen?

When has Marvel Studios EVER hype-casted?

[DattaBoy]

First off, do you have a source for your second paragraph?
.

http://splashpage.mtv.com/2012/04/13...arvel-sequels/

[7thangel]

You put Arlen Escapeta, Arjay Smith, Lee Thompson Young, James Tyler Williams and Donald Glover. A lot of the black media and community will tune that film out. Because these guys have manage to do something that not many can do-appeal to people outside their race. They have made decent careers without doing Tyler Perry films or "degrading" black films or going in and out of the jail house. 4 of these guys have television shows either on now, airing in the summer or in the fall. They have 2 black cast films among them.

according to who (other than yourself)? seeing how i've seen websites dedicated to entertainment and trying to get more exposure for black stars point to obscure movies, tv shows, appearances, and web series, i think you're wrong. i see this type of pigeon-holing black folks as a monolith that isn't open to anything but tyler perry way too much

[Froggy]

In fairness, Dum Dum is also a different character type than Sam. Just because Dum Dum is taller, doesn't mean Sam should be.

still I had forgotten about it and you brought it up

the fairness thing though is all good, but we'll see what happens with the casting. I like talking to you anyways so don't sweat it

[StoneGold]

still I had forgotten about it and you brought it up

the fairness thing though is all good, but we'll see what happens with the casting. I like talking to you anyways so don't sweat it

I wasn't, just wanted to point out that Sam and Dum Dum, two different kinds of characters. Dum Dum's height doesn't outshine Cap because he's a swaggering meathead. Same thing like if you cast, say, Michael Clark Duncan in anything. It's hard to take him seriously as a lead, because he's Michael Clark Duncan. But Falcon is a different character, operates under different mechanisms.

Although I did have a realization -- Falcon may be difficult to pull off, if only because he kind of becomes the exact same character as War Machine. Who would be the first minority superhero in a Marvel Films movie, because it got brought up earlier. Anyone else would be the second one. But he might be a little too close to the same character structure. At least, I could foresee problems, at least if you're trying to have him be more of a superhero role, as opposed to Agent Falcon of SHIELD.


Or not, but it's going to require more of a deft touch from the screenwriters.

[StoneGold]

You put Arlen Escapeta, Arjay Smith, Lee Thompson Young, James Tyler Williams and Donald Glover. A lot of the black media and community will tune that film out. Because these guys have manage to do something that not many can do-appeal to people outside their race. They have made decent careers without doing Tyler Perry films or "degrading" black films or going in and out of the jail house. 4 of these guys have television shows either on now, airing in the summer or in the fall. They have 2 black cast films among them.

Donald Glover would not work as any of the characters we've been talking about. Not that he's not awesome, but I've met him, and I tower over him. Basically, the same way you don't want Tobey Maguire to play Captain America, if Glover could have potentially played a black Spider-Man, he shouldn't be playing Falcon. I don't know who any of the rest of them are. Wait, I just googled Jason Williams, he's Chris Rock? Oh, I'm sorry, no. No unless you're going for a totally different vibe for any of the characters we were talking about previously than ever seen in the comics, no.

[wyokid]

I wasn't, just wanted to point out that Sam and Dum Dum, two different kinds of characters. Dum Dum's height doesn't outshine Cap because he's a swaggering meathead. Same thing like if you cast, say, Michael Clark Duncan in anything. It's hard to take him seriously as a lead, because he's Michael Clark Duncan. But Falcon is a different character, operates under different mechanisms.

Although I did have a realization -- Falcon may be difficult to pull off, if only because he kind of becomes the exact same character as War Machine. Who would be the first minority superhero in a Marvel Films movie, because it got brought up earlier. Anyone else would be the second one. But he might be a little too close to the same character structure. At least, I could foresee problems, at least if you're trying to have him be more of a superhero role, as opposed to Agent Falcon of SHIELD.


Or not, but it's going to require more of a deft touch from the screenwriters.

Well, Captain America 2 has the same screenwriters as the first and IMO Cap was the second best film of them all (topped by, of course, The Avengers), so I'm sure they can pull it off.

[StoneGold]

Well, Captain America 2 has the same screenwriters as the first and IMO Cap was the second best film of them all (topped by, of course, The Avengers), so I'm sure they can pull it off.

Hey, I've met them. Twice. Nice guys. I'm just realizing, the more you superhero Sam up, the closer his arc potentially gets to War Machine's. The question starts to become, how many black sidekicks can Marvel movies throw together?

[Froggy]

I wasn't, just wanted to point out that Sam and Dum Dum, two different kinds of characters. Dum Dum's height doesn't outshine Cap because he's a swaggering meathead. Same thing like if you cast, say, Michael Clark Duncan in anything. It's hard to take him seriously as a lead, because he's Michael Clark Duncan. But Falcon is a different character, operates under different mechanisms.

Although I did have a realization -- Falcon may be difficult to pull off, if only because he kind of becomes the exact same character as War Machine. Who would be the first minority superhero in a Marvel Films movie, because it got brought up earlier. Anyone else would be the second one. But he might be a little too close to the same character structure. At least, I could foresee problems, at least if you're trying to have him be more of a superhero role, as opposed to Agent Falcon of SHIELD.


Or not, but it's going to require more of a deft touch from the screenwriters.

what I highlighted right there makes me want to ask if you think they will just make like an "Agent Sam Wilson" in a future movie or something as a nod?

[T'Jai]

go heavy on the Ultimate Falcon which emphasizes his Partner as opposed to side-kick status, make him a potential contemporary for Natasha and Clint that couldn't break away from what he was doing to get involved in the Loki thing...

[StoneGold]

go heavy on the Ultimate Falcon which emphasizes his Partner as opposed to side-kick status, make him a potential contemporary for Natasha and Clint that couldn't break away from what he was doing to get involved in the Loki thing...

Yeah, they did that in the book all the time. Really, read the old Captain America and the Falcon book, every third sentence out of either Cap or Falcon's mouths were "Partner, not sidekick," but Falcon still ends up being the sidekick, just by the fact that Cap is Cap, and damn near anyone ends up being his sidekick. Look, by the same token, War Machine isn't technically Iron Man's sidekick. Except the name of the movie is Iron Man 2, the movie was all about Iron Man, so War Machine becomes his sidekick just because he's a secondary character in the movie. Unless somehow the Cap sequel becomes a buddy movie where Falcon's character gets an equal character arc -- the Lethal Weapon of superhero movies -- Falcon is going to be the sidekick. Same as the Howling Commandos were all Cap's sidekicks in the first movie.

[StoneGold]

what I highlighted right there makes me want to ask if you think they will just make like an "Agent Sam Wilson" in a future movie or something as a nod?

Like I was saying earlier, something along the lines of Agent Falcon of SHIELD. Falcon is his code name. At least, that would seem to be the easiest way to do it, better than Cap meeting a falcon trainer on the Isle of the Exiles and inspiring him to help the indigenous people rise up against their ex-Nazi tormentors.

[wyokid]

Yeah, they did that in the book all the time. Really, read the old Captain America and the Falcon book, every third sentence out of either Cap or Falcon's mouths were "Partner, not sidekick," but Falcon still ends up being the sidekick, just by the fact that Cap is Cap, and damn near anyone ends up being his sidekick. Look, by the same token, War Machine isn't technically Iron Man's sidekick. Except the name of the movie is Iron Man 2, the movie was all about Iron Man, so War Machine becomes his sidekick just because he's a secondary character in the movie. Unless somehow the Cap sequel becomes a buddy movie where Falcon's character gets an equal character arc -- the Lethal Weapon of superhero movies -- Falcon is going to be the sidekick. Same as the Howling Commandos were all Cap's sidekicks in the first movie.

I never saw War Machine as a sidekick in Iron Man 2 :\

[StoneGold]

I never saw War Machine as a sidekick in Iron Man 2 :\

Defining sidekick as a secondary character who exists mostly as a support mechanism for the main character.


You can pull Rhodey out of Iron Man 2 without too many problems. You can't pull out Tony. Whereas, you can pull out neither Riggs nor Murtaugh out of any Lethal Weapon film. Well, maybe both of them out of 4, but that's for other reasons.

[Froggy]

Like I was saying earlier, something along the lines of Agent Falcon of SHIELD. Falcon is his code name. At least, that would seem to be the easiest way to do it, better than Cap meeting a falcon trainer on the Isle of the Exiles and inspiring him to help the indigenous people rise up against their ex-Nazi tormentors.

yeah I like that

still would like to see Luke Cage before falcon though cause I remember John Singleton being interested in him and I want to see what he could do