Thoughts on Devin Grayson's Batfam work...?

[greenthings]

So, I'm writing a series of literary reviews which will each spotlight a particular/notable comic books writer. Combine the one-two punch of reading Gotham Knights and discovering that Inheritance is a real thing, and I've settled on Devin Grayson, as the first subject.

All the threads on this (and I've read several) seem to be old and expired, so I'm fishing for new thoughts and impressions. I am not looking for thoughts on her, or speculation on why she writes certain things (outside of her own words), or "I hate that she did X to X" with no further elaboration. Just her writing.

First, here's her bibliography, for anyone who needs the refresher.

The works of hers I'm focusing on are her run on the 1999 The Titans (#1-20), on Batman: Gotham Knights (#1-11, 14-18, 20-32), and on Nightwing (#52, 71-100, 107-116), in particular.

Some questions:
-- as with any distinctive writer/artist, opinions usually fall between "dislike/avoid all of their works", "like some and dislike others", and "like/love all of their works" to varying degrees. Where do you fall, and more importantly-- why?

-- what's the "best of"/"worst of" her work, in your opinion? Who (what kind of reader) would you recommend or not recommend a title to, and why?

-- how do your feelings toward her work reflect, if at all, your feelings about "what superhero comics should be" or about the limits (in any) on interpreting/re-imagining an "iconic" character (who "belongs" to popular culture, as it were)?

Any feedback appreciated-- the more thoughtful, the better. I'm working the women-writers-in-comics angle into this article, so if you'd like to comment on that as well, please do. I'd really like to get two sides, to this one, too.

[Brack360]

-- as with any distinctive writer/artist, opinions usually fall between "dislike/avoid all of their works", "like some and dislike others", and "like/love all of their works" to varying degrees. Where do you fall, and more importantly-- why?

I strongly liked the majority of her Batman work, particularly Gotham Knights and NML. She told great psychological, character-driven, and original Batman stories. Her work was not a repetitive rehash of what came before, like so many other writers. In the GK arc "Transference," she did what Grant Morrison would do nearly a decade later in "Batman RIP" with much greater notice.

-- what's the "best of"/"worst of" her work, in your opinion? Who (what kind of reader) would you recommend or not recommend a title to, and why?

Her best is the aforementioned "Transference," though "Spiritual Currency" and "Fear of Faith" are not too far behind.

Her worst would be the later issues of her Nightwing run (after #93 and especially after #107), as well as Ra's al Ghul: Year One. The latter was at least her fourth Batman story about zombies.

-- how do your feelings toward her work reflect, if at all, your feelings about "what superhero comics should be" or about the limits (in any) on interpreting/re-imagining an "iconic" character (who "belongs" to popular culture, as it were)?

Her GK run is a great example for any writer to follow.

[Death Itself]

I am not looking for thoughts on her, or speculation on why she writes certain things (outside of her own words), or "I hate that she did X to X" with no further elaboration. Just her writing.

Fine. Her writing on Nightwing sucks. I won't fault her for the Daredevil-esque set up on Nightwing, because honestly Dixon did that, but copying Daredevil's "Born Again" storyline almost to the letter but missing a) unlike Matt Murdock, Dick Grayson has a support system that he utilizes so he'd never be in that situation and b) even Daredevil rose again triumphantly, not swim around on the bottom in the dark.

And it's hard not to bring other factors into it when her better writing corresponds directly to her relationship with Mark Waid, lending credence to the rumors he was actually doing it or at the very least helping her out. Also she spoke openly of sexual abuse in her past then had the character she took her pen name from be the victim of a sexual crime. You can't discuss that without discussing why. It's like saying you can't discuss John Lennon's murder when reviewing the Yoko Ono song she recorded after his death that opens with gunshots. Or discuss Kurt Cobain's suicide when discussing the Courtney Love video where she has a small boy dressed just like Kurt Cobain after his death. For better or worse, creators put themselves into their work and there's simply no separating them.

[Beacon]

She’s one of those writers where I never understood fandom’s hostility (be it DC or Marvel).

She wrote the last Titans run that I actually enjoyed. (And some really underrated Arsenal solo stuff).

She wrote some fantastic NML stuff.

I’d only read the collected portions of her Nightwing run so I haven’t read the infamous rape issue. However I read the tail end of it and its worth noting that she was doing the “hero has envious breakdown” thing years before Bendis and co did with Daredevil.

[Death Itself]

I’d only read the collected portions of her Nightwing run so I haven’t read the infamous rape issue. However I read the tail end of it and its worth noting that she was doing the “hero has envious breakdown” thing years before Bendis and co did with Daredevil.

Actually, it's a direct rip off of Frank Miller's Daredevil from 20 years earlier so no points for her in that regard.

[carabas]

Actually, it's a direct rip off of Frank Miller's Daredevil from 20 years earlier so no points for her in that regard.

With the big difference being that nobody told Miller to scrap the 3rd act and do this, this and this instead, because we're killing Daredevil off anyway in Secret Wars 2.

[Death Itself]

With the big difference being that nobody told Miller to scrap the 3rd act and do this, this and this instead, because we're killing Daredevil off anyway in Secret Wars 2.

Well, if he'd dragged it out over years rather than telling the whole story in seven issues they might have.

[DLH1970]

Fine. Her writing on Nightwing sucks. I won't fault her for the Daredevil-esque set up on Nightwing, because honestly Dixon did that, but copying Daredevil's "Born Again" storyline almost to the letter but missing a) unlike Matt Murdock, Dick Grayson has a support system that he utilizes so he'd never be in that situation and b) even Daredevil rose again triumphantly, not swim around on the bottom in the dark.

This. She simply did not get the Dick Grayson character. She ignored decades of established characteristics to force her on views on him. It was like hammering a square peg into a round hole. Of course, she fully admits that her first exposure to Dick Grayson was from watching Batman: The Animated series, so she probably never read many comics featuring him.

Well, if he'd dragged it out over years rather than telling the whole story in seven issues they might have.

This is also true.

[Beacon]

Actually, it's a direct rip off of Frank Miller's Daredevil from 20 years earlier so no points for her in that regard.

Yeah, my favorite part of Born Again was when Matt joined the enemy so he could take them down from the inside and ended up in over his head.

Oh wait, that didn’t happen in Born Again.

[kalorama]

Her early work was actually pretty good, when it was mostly contained in backups and shorts (for the various showcase and anthology books DC published in the 90s, like Batman Chronicles, 80-Page Giants, Secret Files), one-shots, and minis. She had a pretty good ear for dialogue and character and her stories were generally entertaining. But when she started doing open ended, ongoing runs, her weaknesses were laid bare. Her stuff just kind of meandered in no particular direction with no real dramatic energy driving it forward. It seemed like she wasn't really able to conceptualize a story very well outside the limited constraints of a close-ended page count.

[Jabare]

Her horrendous run on Nightwing outweighs the rest of her positive accomplishments. Some of her previous works were okay, but people are exaggerating a little bit here they weren't phenomenal or anything. Nowhere near Morrison or noteworthy Bat writters.


Her run on Nightwing started of Well but by issue 93 it became utter garbage. And Devin Grayson is known for the greatest character castration in all of comicdom, BAR NONE.

She is essentially the Bill Buckner of the comic industry, the only difference being Bill Buckner was actually a great player baring that one error that cost the Red Sox the world series, even though thats all he is remembered for. Devin Grayson is mediocre at best, with a lot of her story lines bordering on unoriginal

[carabas]

Well, if he'd dragged it out over years rather than telling the whole story in seven issues they might have.

It went down in the period that 'writing for the trade' was in the worst stage, and DC did greenlight it all.

[Winghead]

Her Nightwing run is what got me in to comics. I preferred the gritty realism over some of Dixon's more cartoony stuff. I never found the "rape" scene to be such a huge issue, and felt like it went with the catharsis of what had happened in Dick's life. Granted crossovers and "one year later" got in the way of her obvious desire to redeem the character, and maybe she dragged it on a bit long, but I enjoyed the ride and was really dissapointed when it ended.

[Jeff Brady]

She was the first writer to really show Batman strain under the conflicting goals of his mission against crime, and Leslie's wish that he not use violence (an issue of Batman Chronicles during NML). She handled the exploration of the relationships these characters had amongst each other with subtlety and grand gestures. Grayson's run on Titans made this stand out the most. Friends who have known each other for most of their lives were full of jovial banter and mock-sibling rivalry. And when Superman made an appearance in the second issue, she reinforced the friendship between him and Nightwing.

Devin Grayson's writing gave all of the characters a clear voice, defined relationships that showed how each character cared for the others around him/her, but rarely lost sight that the superhero genre is for action, not melodrama.

[Mia]

Her Nightwing run is what got me in to comics. I preferred the gritty realism over some of Dixon's more cartoony stuff. I never found the "rape" scene to be such a huge issue, and felt like it went with the catharsis of what had happened in Dick's life. Granted crossovers and "one year later" got in the way of her obvious desire to redeem the character, and maybe she dragged it on a bit long, but I enjoyed the ride and was really dissapointed when it ended.

Gritty realism? You mean her fan fic. Where NW was a doormat so that she could show case her pet Mary Sue Tarantula?