Between Barack and a Hard Place: Ultimate US Elections 2012 Thread

[Paul McEnery]

Entirely documented is a bit of an understatement.

Quite. It's massively documented with multiple sources.

Considering that the Republican politician with the most power is John Boehner

Is he?

who is far from the realm of "fanatical stupidity".

No he isn't.

I assume by that phrase you mean the Tea Party. Which wasn't around at the time the country got into it's current predicament.

Those same people were, with the same fanatical agenda.

Do some politicians have to play to them. Sure. Do they have a the party in a chokehold? Hell no.

They represent 30% of the electorate, and therefore 60% of the Republican Party. How much more of a chokehold do you want?

Not that they're an autonomous group. Rather, they've been deliberately nurtured by Rupert Murdoch etc., and financed by people like the Koch brothers.

The country got into this situation because of slot of poor policy decisions made over the last 25 years. Hint: not all of them were Republican moves. And I would't say the current president us proving to be any better.

In the first place, with the exception of two years of the Clinton presidency, and two years of the Obama presidency, the Republicans have had the whip hand in America for 31 years.

And I'd be hard-pressed to find a way in which the policies Obama advances are worse than his predecessor; or indeed deserve to be obstructed by the Republicans, who consistently demonstrate a contempt for democracy.

[Serik]

A tad melodramatic....

Perhaps, but I'm planning anyway -- the whole plans are useless, planning is priceless mantra.

More to the point, you can dismiss the current GOP antics as pandering during primary season, but let's not forget that George W. Bush was reelected by a wide margin. I've never been more disappointed with my country, and I won't forget it, either, especially when people say, "Oh, so-and-so could never be elected."

@Lancer: You're correct that the U.S. has made a tremendous number of terrible policy decisions over the past few decades (see my signature) and that it's largely been a nonpartisan endeavor. My concern is that the current crop of leaders are more mediocre and damaging than usual.

---

Perhaps the greatest problem with centralizing political and economic power in Washington is that it allows a rather small group of incompetent, immoral, and/or corrupt individuals to effectively fuck the entire republic, from sea to shining sea, with minimal obstacles*. If a state, say Alabama, fucks up, oh well, sucks to be in Alabama. If D.C. fucks up, we're all boned, ya know? With so much bound-up in the Federal Executive and Congress, it's never been more essential to have competent leadership. There are, for example, more people alive today who depend on federal welfare programs (Social Security, Medicare, etc.) for their survival than there were American citizens during George Washington's presidency. And today's commander-in-chief presides over a nuclear arsenal that could end civilization in less than a day.

*As I mentioned in another thread, increasing the number of reps in the House, and giving the People greater representation in Washington, would, I think, greatly alleviate this problem, as would campaign finance reform.

[Nick Soapdish]

Entirely documented is a bit of an understatement. Considering that the Republican politician with the most power is John Boehner who is far from the realm of "fanatical stupidity". I assume by that phrase you mean the Tea Party. Which wasn't around at the time the country got into it's current predicament. Do some politicians have to play to them. Sure. Do they have a the party in a chokehold? Hell no.

The country got into this situation because of slot of poor policy decisions made over the last 25 years. Hint: not all of them were Republican moves. And I would't say the current president us proving to be any better.

Boehner has had his hand slapped down by the Tea Party twice and had to reverse course because they didn't approve of him. So it sorta looks like the only reason that they don't have him in a chokehold is because they release their grip so he can get enough air to continue working for him. If he has the most power, he's beating out Cantor by a hair and there are several others that are almost as close. One of the biggest problems with the current Republican party is that they don't have a leader. If you asked who the current leader of the Republican party is a year ago, you would've gotten a dozen different answers including Gingrich and Palin, but the highest vote getter (after "nobody") is Rush Limbaugh.

And no, the current meltdown isn't entirely due to the Tea Party and Republican Party. However, they're substantially to blame for the inability of Congress and Obama to do anything about it. The Democrats are also to blame because they compromised too much of the stimulus bill away (which should've been called a jobs bill) when economists like Krugman were saying that it was much too small. Sure, it's big numbers, but about 40% was going to tax breaks and another quarter to simply replacing the budget cuts of state and local governments which means that quarter was only stopping the blood loss (temporarily). But hindsight is 20/20. Heck, I ignored those as well because the numbers were so big. And Obama needed to keep some political capital in order to pass a health care bill.

And getting back to the Tea Party, their message has changed a bit since they first came on the scene and since they got co-opted by FreedomWorks and the Koch brothers. Now, they're just the neo-cons of the Bush administration, but with more of an anti-government bent and a facade of fiscal conservatism. Not that the Republicans were even that subtle about it back then. Jeb Bush claimed to be trying to empty out all the government buildings in Tallahassee.

[Aubergine~!]

Hey, it was well known that Glen Rice was great at nailing three's!

Right.

This thread probably has a long way to go, but no one, and I mean no one is topping this post.

[Monty_Cristo]

If Ms Palin decides to run after all... Would this help with winning some black voters?

she looks a little like that Rebecca Black girl.

[mikekerrIII]

Then how do you explain the conservative posters whose viewpoints get treated with respect?

on the American political spectrum we have almost no Conservative regular posters here except for a couple of loons.loons are not treated with respect at all,nor do they deserve much respect.

[mikekerrIII]

Disappointed Democrats who consider sitting the next election out should consider three points:

1. the Supreme Court
2. the Supreme Court
3. the Supreme Court

Scalia and Kenned are both 75 years old. At the end of the next presidential term, they will be 80.

Ruth Bader Ginsburg is three years older still. Would you really like to see her replaced with a GOP pick?

That depends on wether you think that Obama has the Balls to nominate anyone to the left of center to the court and fight it though.

[mikekerrIII]

Supposedly, Will Rogers said words to this effect about Dwight Eisenhower in 1952: "I do like Ike. I like Micky Mouse, too. I'm not voting for him either."

If so that would have been a very very strange thing for Will to say, since when will died Ike was a Lt Col and not even slightly a public figure, When Ike was running for office the first time Will had been dead for over 15 years

[Nick Soapdish]

That depends on wether you think that Obama has the Balls to nominate anyone to the left of center to the court and fight it though.

I think that he'd nominate somebody further to the left than Perry, Romney or any of the Republican candidates. They might even be slightly to the left of center (by American standards).

[RolandJP]

I've seen that pic before in a chain e-mail, complete with the same joke except replace "the Bushes" with "Obama."

I winced.

And e-mailed blocked. I hope.

[Tages]

And e-mailed blocked. I hope.

Reflexively.

[7thangel]

That depends on wether you think that Obama has the Balls to nominate anyone to the left of center to the court and fight it though.

i see conservatives aren't the only ones obsessed with balls

[KiFF86]

I hate to spoil this for everyone, but according to my second season of Madden 12, which would take place after the election. Obama wins. Because you get a cheesy scene where your team visits the president.

[Iangould]

If so that would have been a very very strange thing for Will to say, since when will died Ike was a Lt Col and not even slightly a public figure, When Ike was running for office the first time Will had been dead for over 15 years

Well, somebody said it.

And if they didn't they should had.

[the4thpip]

It'll be the first celebrity sex tape released on Betamax...

But will it be aired on FoxNews or ESPN first?