Polaris Appreciation III

[Skaddix]

I'm certainly not echoing the negativity. I'm happy about Lorna's inclusion in the book, it wouldn't be the book I would've chosen for her, but it's still a good choice.
Another positive thing is that Lorna's one of the "biggest names" in that book, so hypothetically...won't she be receiving more panel time that most of the cast? lol

not hard current are madrox monet and rahne

[infernohara]

I'm just glad Polaris is being used somewhere. Whether its on any of the X-teams, its better than what we're getting now. So the more Polaris the better.

Anyone ready to see Longshot totally hit on her? Should be pretty interesting. I could also see a friendship with shatterstar and her as well.

[The_Greatest_Username]

not hard current are madrox monet and rahne

Yep, that's what I meant. She'll most likely be receiving more panel time in this book than she would've in most other books.

[Justin K.]

EDIT: Wrong thread!

[.LuckyStar.]

Yep, that's what I meant. She'll most likely be receiving more panel time in this book than she would've in most other books.

I agree. This is why I think X-Factor is the best place for Polaris. Look at Psylocke in X-Force. Being in a satellite book did wonders for her. She's been getting more attention and characterization than she would if she were in a main X-Book having a few lines here and there and being completely overshadowed by the more popular X-Men.

[JeanGreyForever]

No offense to the X-Factor fans but the majority of the team are B-List characters (that doesn't mean they aren't great characters though). That's why I'm glad for her inclusion in that book because she will be one of the more known characters.

[jmc247]

I agree. This is why I think X-Factor is the best place for Polaris. Look at Psylocke in X-Force. Being in a satellite book did wonders for her. She's been getting more attention and characterization than she would if she were in a main X-Book having a few lines here and there and being completely overshadowed by the more popular X-Men.

I don't know of anyone on the thread arguing X-Factor isn't a good enough book for Lorna. It's her relationship with a certain blond haired mutant and her inability to think and make major life decisions other then what he wants that is the biggest devisive issue. Even many fans of the relationship will say Lorna should be allowed to individuate more and make decisions more outside of what Alex wants.

She just spent five and a half years in space (our time) because let's face it that is what Alex wanted her to do and it's been the same story thoughout the vast majority of her history as a character. I am certainly willing to give the book a chance, but it's no surprise to any regular here that I was hoping they would be on separate titles.

[Justin K.]

She just spent five and a half years in space (our time) because let's face it that is what Alex wanted her to do and it's been the same story thoughout the vast majority of her history as a character.

They kinda remind me of Rogue and Gambit. They're both great characters apart from each other but together, not so much.
Peter David did a good job of portraying the two together the first time he wrote them, perhaps he could fix the slump both of them are in.

[jmc247]

They kinda remind me of Rogue and Gambit. They're both great characters apart from each other but together, not so much.
Peter David did a good job of portraying the two together the first time he wrote them, perhaps he could fix the slump both of them are in.

But, if you recall how much time did they actually spent together during that time? Not alot. They were allowed to interact with other characters and develop other friendships so the relationship came off well compared to them when they are usually together when it becomes all about them and their relationship.

Also Lorna talked to others about things other then Alex. Like focusing on her body image issues and her mental anguish at being mind controlled. Having them together and it not being all about their romance was how he did well with it.

The problem was after PAD left writers thought they could recreate what PAD did and they simply failed, some worse then others. I thought next to PAD JM Dematteis did the best of the bunch and he wrote a much more militant, powerful and ruthless Lorna as well.

[Mikeyb1424]

Time for a new costume!!!!! (sorry I had to say it!)

[salarta]

The game medium is one where game makers and players have a really bad habit of seeing characters as interesting or not by looking at their powers and seeing if the are unique or not.

It's a little bit more complex than that.

The reason dismiss Lorna as just the same as Magneto and skip her when it comes to a presence in video games isn't really whether or not their powers are unique. If that's all we had to go with, X-23 and She-Hulk would never have found a place in Marvel vs. Capcom 3. It's all about a mix of how popular a character is and how badly the company wants to promote that character, and the former is first and foremost based on the image the company puts out of the character.

If the company puts an image out of the character as nothing but another character's girlfriend, that's how people will see her, and emphasis goes to giving the character she's a girlfriend of the opportunities she could have. If the company only focuses on her powers, the average person will say "why bother with her, Magneto has the same powers but he's more popular and more powerful."

This is echoed well in other video game series. For Bayonetta, another character, Jeanne, has all the same powers as the title character, yet when the game comes up on sites I go to, most people say they'd want a sequel to star Jeanne and not Bayonetta. For Mortal Kombat, in-game Mileena was created as a flawed clone of Kitana, but most people consider Mileena the better character for being "unique" for having nasty teeth and acting a mix of crazy and slutty (their words), but look down on Kitana for being a "cliched" damsel-in-distress warrior princess. They use different weapons and have different skills, but because players look at Kitana as a cliche and Mileena as avoiding cliches (even though Mileena DOES follow one, it's just not openly presented as such), they love Mileena and ignore Kitana.

So, in the end it's not really about the powers. Like most things, it's all about presentation. If you put all the emphasis on the powers, that's what people will focus on. If you put it on the fact she's her boyfriend's girlfriend, people will focus on that instead. But if you put it on the character for her own merits, make good use of her potential beyond having Magneto's powers or being Havok's girlfriend, she'll gather a huge following.

Well maybe that was unfair. But for a fan appreciation thread there does seem to be a lot of negativity surrounding Polaris.

At least with the way I'm interpreting your post, you're making it sound like a lot of people posting in this thread for Polaris are posting hatred toward the character. Negativity toward how a character is going to be used, and negativity toward the character herself as a whole, are entirely different things, and I feel it's a really important distinction.

I already said that thus far, I'll still check out the book, and I hope Peter David changes my mind about everything through amazing writing that uses her better than I expected. That doesn't change how I feel. I'm still giving it the chance you want me to by planning to pick it up in spite of my misgivings, but I can't force myself to like a premise I hate. If I could, it would mean any interest I have in the character is fake because I could just will myself to like her and anything that happens to her regardless of how good or bad it is.

If Peter David can change my mind about her on X-Factor through his writing, then excellent. As I said, I'll apologize for jumping to conclusions about how he would write her based on how Marvel chose to handle the first image of her return to the X-books. He can add that to his list of triumphs as a writer, assuming he even knows who I am or would care. :P But until then, there's not much you or I can do about how I feel. If changing how a person feels was as simple as telling the person they should feel differently, life would be easy.

[jmc247]

Time for a new costume!!!!! (sorry I had to say it!)

Lorna has historically gotten new outfits when one era in the characters history ends and another begins and this would certainly qualify.

[Mitteloss]

Personaly I am very pleased about her inclusion in X-Factor and I am cautiously optimistic about PAD's depiction of her, he writes all his characters well.

I assume PAD has read WoK and hope takes a leaf out of DnA's depiction of her (without her scenes towards the end of the series). DnA's Lorna had glimmers of her X-Factor era personality, but meshed it well with the smarter, more knowledgable, more confident Lorna we've seen since 2000.

I'm beginning to think a dark purple costume could work for Lorna.... but I would be happy with a modified version of her current green costume.

[Ebon Phantom]

Well I like X-Factor, so Lorna joining the team would be pretty nice. Hopefully she'll be given the chance to grow like the other characters, beyond Havok and her past.

[salarta]

You know, this morning I find myself thinking a lot about how many people around here talk about how "bad" it would be for Lorna to be on a more popular book alongside characters like Emma Frost or Wolverine. They're going under the idea that by simply being around more popular characters, she'll be overshadowed and unused. On another site, this is also a justification I saw someone make for her staying in space.

I disagree with this assertion, and I view it as a lack of faith in the character and her potential being good and worth attention. It implies that no matter how she's written, no matter what the writer focuses on, it's impossible for her to garner interest by readers on her own merits. Such thinking, I believe, demolishes opportunities for her. It bars her from taking part in events where she'd be a perfect fit, or taking on a role or relationship where she'd add a hell of a lot to the table, solely because Marvel hasn't given her any chances to become popular like they did with many other women.

I also hate this thinking because I see it in almost everything when it comes to underappreciated characters. Every time a character comes up that's at the time only a minor/support character, any suggestion that the character become a major and important character is met with negativity or even downright hatred. BUT, in every single case I've seen, as soon as the company in control of the character actually braves that extra step to make that character major and important, the majority attitude becomes the exact opposite of how it looked before. People that used to talk about how "bad" it would be for the character to become popular and important suddenly start talking about how the character always deserved that opportunity from the very start, and they act like they always felt that way about the character.

A good example of this is Makoto from the Blazblue video game series (and don't worry, I'm aware many/most of the people here probably don't know or care about it, it's just a good example :P ). When the first Blazblue game came out, Makoto was a minor NPC. Suggestions that she become playable and more important to the story were met with endless pessimism. "We already have two female characters that came from the same place," or "We already have a character that's part animal, we don't need more," or "we've never seen any indication she can fight, what weapon would she even use?" Then the development team made Makoto into downloadable content for the second Blazblue game, using tonfas and in a whole new costume. Now, Makoto gets the second highest amount of fanart drawn of her, and almost every discussion about Blazblue heavily involves how "awesome" she is. I've even seen threads about Blazblue derailed to being solely about Makoto.

But if the Blazblue development team followed the same logic of people who think Lorna shouldn't be on a big name title with popular characters, Makoto would still be a relatively unknown minor NPC that only gets one piece of fanart every six months.

So no, I don't think Lorna "has" to be on a book with characters that are lower on the totem pole than she currently is, or that she "has" to be around Alex to garner interest. I think what she really needs is to be around the A-list characters but written often and well enough that she stands out of her own accord. Lorna was fighting alongside the likes of Wolverine earlier this decade. Despite the dislike some people have toward that run, people remember her presence. If she was on a different book that whole time, I guarantee she would not have garnered as much attention. Some forum users probably wouldn't be here, either.