Wrestling: Postmania XIII: I've been in the danger zone! OH yeah!

**Holacik** · 07-04-2011, 08:43 PM

Originally Posted by syxxpakk

I don't know, man. Austin turning heel at WM17 is almost universally accepted as the beginning of the downward spiral for WWE. With PPV buyrates where they are, if they turn their main draw heel, I think that could be really disastrous.

That didn't kill the business or even close to it.

Originally Posted by syxxpakk

It could work out, of course, but I don't think it would. I think of Cena as the tourniquet on the wound. They're still bleeding pretty badly, but without him I think they'd come pretty close to death. And granted, some of it is their fault (a lot I would put on John Laurinitus).

Er...I think that could make anyone into what Cena is now. The problem has become that they are okay with the status quo, and refuse to take any real risks anymore.

**SUPERECWFAN1** · 07-04-2011, 08:43 PM

Originally Posted by syxxpakk

I don't think Cena's no-selling is no better or worse than Shawn Michaels, The Rock, Hulk Hogan, or Steve Austin honestly.

Its pretty bad. Cena during one RAW match took abuse an entire match and all. So suddenly once the finish began , he shook off the work done on his bad knee and no sold the rest of the way. Actin like he had magically healed up during a match.

**master of read** · 07-04-2011, 08:44 PM

Originally Posted by syxxpakk

I think you could really feel a lot of Vince's frustration with workers in the past who have left him. I think he was really channeling that and I think that came through as real emotion.

I don't think Cena's no-selling is no better or worse than Shawn Michaels, The Rock, Hulk Hogan, or Steve Austin honestly.

i felt his emotion, true enough. if it was at punk personally, it would be better.

and out of those people you named, only one of them no sells as bad as cena and that's hogan.

shawn, rock and austin have had incredible matches without no selling like nothing happened. cena? not so much. prime example: cena/miz "i quit" match. probably the best example of how bad super cena is.

**Holacik** · 07-04-2011, 08:45 PM

Originally Posted by JCAll

Last Friday?

I see what you did there.

**syxxpakk** · 07-04-2011, 08:45 PM

Originally Posted by Holacik

That didn't kill the business or even close to it.

As I've mentioned ad nauseum, a lot of people point to that as the beginning of WWE's downward spiral from the big business boom of the late 90s/2000. Guys like Meltzer, Steve Austin, Jim Ross, etc. If you choose to disagree, that's fine. They say it, and I tend to agree with them.

Er...I think that could make anyone into what Cena is now. The problem has become that they are okay with the status quo, and refuse to take any real risks anymore.

I don't think anyone on the roster could do what Cena does, honestly. Just don't see it.

**syxxpakk** · 07-04-2011, 08:46 PM

Originally Posted by SUPERECWFAN1

Its pretty bad. Cena during one RAW match took abuse an entire match and all. So suddenly once the finish began , he shook off the work done on his bad knee and no sold the rest of the way. Actin like he had magically healed up during a match.

I really don't see that as any different than Jericho working over Michaels' leg for 15 or so minutes and then Michaels doing the damn kip-up at WM19.

**master of read** · 07-04-2011, 08:46 PM

Originally Posted by SUPERECWFAN1

Its pretty bad. Cena during one RAW match took abuse an entire match and all. So suddenly once the finish began , he shook off the work done on his bad knee and no sold the rest of the way. Actin like he had magically healed up during a match.

and there's his last match with the miz. him and riley tortured the guy for 30 minutes and then at the end, he shrugged it all off and beat miz in about 3 minutes.

**syxxpakk** · 07-04-2011, 08:47 PM

Originally Posted by master of read

i felt his emotion, true enough. if it was at punk personally, it would be better.

and out of those people you named, only one of them no sells as bad as cena and that's hogan.

shawn, rock and austin have had incredible matches without no selling like nothing happened. cena? not so much. prime example: cena/miz "i quit" match. probably the best example of how bad super cena is.

Rock used to be notorious for taking a beating and then coming back like nothing happened. Same with Austin. In fact, back in the lates 90 the Rock/Austin hate was pretty high. (My fave example is Summerslam '99. Believe it or not - once was a time when the IWC was up in arms because Steve Austin refused to put over Triple H!)

Shawn, though, is horrible about no selling the leg. He could have cinder blocks dropped on his knee and still do that damn kip up.

**Holacik** · 07-04-2011, 08:48 PM

Originally Posted by MagSeven

I can't stop reading your posts in Cass' voice.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=feK2pA8h7aw

**syxxpakk** · 07-04-2011, 08:48 PM

I bet you guys hate puroresu

**MagSeven** · 07-04-2011, 08:49 PM

Originally Posted by SUPERECWFAN1

Its pretty bad. Cena during one RAW match took abuse an entire match and all. So suddenly once the finish began , he shook off the work done on his bad knee and no sold the rest of the way. Actin like he had magically healed up during a match.

Or during his I quit match with Miz. Miz tortured the man, beating him with kendo sticks, chairs and steps for 20 minutes. Then boom Cena energized and that was that. I've always thought Shawn Michaels was a great seller. Austin sold well, but did have that finisher that could come out of nowhere like Orton has now, making it seem like no matter what happens his opponent could lose at any given moment. Hogan seemed like the prototype for the Cena finish and Rock was a bit in that vein although his matches were a lot of fun to watch.

**SUPERECWFAN1** · 07-04-2011, 08:49 PM

Austin turning heel in 2001 didn't kill the business. What killed the business nearly was losing ECW and WCW in that year. Thats what nearly killed the business.

Plus Vince booked everyone in the ECW/WCW Alliance like morons except for RVD. Who got so over , so huge that people basically demanded he push him . Vince likely had he kept going with Rob and pushed him as a main event star by the next WM may have created his next crossover superstar.

But he fucked up .

**Holacik** · 07-04-2011, 08:50 PM

Originally Posted by syxxpakk

As I've mentioned ad nauseum, a lot of people point to that as the beginning of WWE's downward spiral from the big business boom of the late 90s/2000. Guys like Meltzer, Steve Austin, Jim Ross, etc. If you choose to disagree, that's fine. They say it, and I tend to agree with them.

It wasn't because Austin turned heel, they also we're starting to lose the Rock.

**syxxpakk** · 07-04-2011, 08:50 PM

Originally Posted by SUPERECWFAN1

Austin turning heel in 2001 didn't kill the business. What killed the business nearly was losing ECW and WCW in that year. Thats what nearly killed the business.

Plus Vince booked everyone in the ECW/WCW Alliance like morons except for RVD. Who got so over , so huge that people basically demanded he push him . Vince likely had he kept going with Rob and pushed him as a main event star by the next WM may have created his next crossover superstar.

But he fucked up .

A lot of people disagree with you on this.