All-purpose news and politics thread

[Charles RB]

There was a recent discussion of this on Radio 4 chaired by Clive Anderson, featuring a liberal judge, a conservative judge, a socialist barrister, and a New Labour spin monster. Of the four of them (five of them, I suppose), only the New Labour spin monster was enthusiastic about scrapping the law as it stands. I find that telling.

I find it telling that you're happy to dismiss British journalists' views as being biased but not the judges & barrister as being biased. They're hardly looking from a neutral standpoint.

Of course I also find it telling you're going "parroting the Tory party line" and not "parroting the Guardian's line" or "parroting Private Eye's line". That's incredibly telling.

[Paul McEnery]

I find it telling that you're happy to dismiss British journalists' views as being biased but not the judges & barrister as being biased. They're hardly looking from a neutral standpoint.

I recommend you listen to the show to which I directed you. But, you know, heaven forfend we listen to someone who knows what they're talking about.

Of course I also find it telling you're going "parroting the Tory party line" and not "parroting the Guardian's line" or "parroting Private Eye's line". That's incredibly telling.

That's because, if you follow the link, you'll find what you're saying is word for word what Ken Clarke said in March.

[Charles RB]

Miliband is talking about Labour policies, proving there are some. Some are quite interesting:

Among the ideas Mr Miliband will talk about are tax incentives for companies that make a contribution to the economy through training and long-term investment.

And he will draw a distinction between genuine wealth creators - who should be championed and encouraged - and "asset-stripping predators".

...

he will argue for a "something for something" culture in schools and call for a new effort to get children from poor backgrounds to university.

And some are quite dodgy:

He will also float the idea - already being piloted by two Labour councils, Manchester and Newham - that people who make a contribution the local community will be allowed to jump housing queues

I dunno who gets to make the judgement about whether you've contributed or not, and it seems bloody unfair on people who are, say, incredibly busy and struggling and don't have much free time. (And people who have the time but would rather go to the pub still need to live somewhere)

[Iangould]

Will this be conventional natural gas exploration or will "fracking" be involved?

Conventional offshore gas.

There's not a lof of fracking goes on here.

We've got so much coal-seam gas that's accessible without hydro-fracking that it's hardly ever worthwhile.

[the4thpip]

European stock exchanges and bank shares went up today, on the same day that everyone heard that Greece will likely have 50% of its debts written off.

And today looks like another strong recovery day for the markets.

[Iangould]

Speaking of Greece.

You need to fiddle with that interactive chart a bit but set the time axis to 5 years and select linear rather than log.

The Greek stock market has lost roughly 80% of its value since early 2008 and has halved in value in the past year.

[Captain Clarkie]

Interestingly candid interview with a trader here - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kpg76VjTa58

[the4thpip]

Speaking of Greece.

You need to fiddle with that interactive chart a bit but set the time axis to 5 years and select linear rather than log.

The Greek stock market has lost roughly 80% of its value since early 2008 and has halved in value in the past year.

Sadly, in their case, the term "correction" might be fitting for an 80% drop.

[Charles RB]

And today looks like another strong recovery day for the markets.

The European markets are still on the up today, the Dax and Cac 40 by 4.38% each. Asian stocks went up too. So we seem to be out of the stockpocalypse.

Interestingly candid interview with a trader here - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kpg76VjTa58

I like how he's masturbating on-screen about how there will be a crash and how the "big institutions" are all cynics about Europe, all while there's a little graphic showing the FTSE 100 going up.

[Iangould]

Sadly, in their case, the term "correction" might be fitting for an 80% drop.

In their case the word "catastrophe" might be fitting.

Edited to add: Remember back when the Republicans were threatening to block any increase in the debt ceiling leading to a possible US default on its sovereign debt and I got down-right apocalyptic about the possible consequences? Greece hasn't technically defaulted but it's come close and has effectively imposed a partial default on its commercial lenders.

Had the Republicans caused an actual default in the US, you'd be looking at an economic situation as bad as or worse than what's currently facing Greece.

[king mob]

Is breaking a celebrity's privacy ever in the public interest?

It depends what they're doing and frankly they shouldn't be able to buy their privacy. There's the problem.

And can you name a multinational that has actually bought privacy in such a way that didn't harm them in the (not terribly) long term?

Considering we don't know what multinationals have superinjunctions outstanding in the UK and what for, it's a pretty empty question.

I'm still waiting to hear a single grown-up proposal as to how the laws ought to change.

And frankly, I'm amazed in the current climate to hear people speaking as though the power of the press should be strengthened.

Whoa hang on. The power of the press is fine, it's the abuse of that power which is the issue.

I strongly disagree. I think that the libel reform campaign is utterly self-interested nonsense.

The real problem with libel law is the same as with rape laws: the judiciary.

Then you're happy with massive discrepancies in the various countries of the UK and you're happy with libel tourism?

[king mob]

The only way they'd be invisible is if there were superinjunctions (which we all agree should go as a first order of business -- and remains as a warning about interfering with the law as it stands). Otherwise, we have no reason to believe they exist. And I have very strong doubts that Private Eye is unbiased in this matter.

Are you actually suggesting these don't exist and the likes of PE are making things up?

Remarkable.

Why are you defending something which infringes upon our actual freedom of speech?

[king mob]

And this search on the Guardian's media site shows that the conversation in England is about more and better regulation of the press as a consequence:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/search?q=P...&section=media

And BBC Director General Mark Thompson weighs in, too.

The conversation in 'England' is about a whole load of things in regards to this Paul and there's a very large number of people incredibly concerned about any government using the hacking scandal to impose more restrictions upon the press when there's existing laws for the abuses the Murdoch press have done.

Yes, the PCC needs complete reform and replaced with something possibly like Ofcom, but it's very concerning to see this used as an excuse to impose regulations that aren't needed.

[king mob]

Miliband is talking about Labour policies, proving there are some. Some are quite interesting:



And some are quite dodgy:



I dunno who gets to make the judgement about whether you've contributed or not, and it seems bloody unfair on people who are, say, incredibly busy and struggling and don't have much free time. (And people who have the time but would rather go to the pub still need to live somewhere)

It's depressing bollocks but it's the sort of depressing bollocks Milliband and Labour think will win them votes.

Of course don't ask for any actual policies as to how they'll do all these ideas as they seem to be following what Cameron did and avoid real policies til they've got their feet under the desk at Number 10.

[king mob]

Interestingly candid interview with a trader here - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kpg76VjTa58

The word is that this was a hoax by the Yes Men, but sadly this is bloody real.