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  1. #8686
    Member Ship's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paradox View Post
    Well, yes, those are a lot of circles and squares. I don't doubt them, but I have no idea what laypeople are supposed to be seeing there.
    An article I read about it said that the analysts noticed that there were differences between the supposedly identical missiles (seams and rivets on one, but missing from the same place on another) which indicates that they were kit-bashed together instead of manufactured in a factory somewhere.
    Smoke me a kipper, skipper.

  2. #8687
    Hardcover addict dupont2005's Avatar
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    McCain slams Obama for using Osama in cheap political campaign attack on Romney
    http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/ticket/m...232157971.html

    Almost as cheap as spreading rumors about Obama's religion and birthplace while constantly emphasizing his middle name during a campaign, huh?
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  3. #8688
    Elder Member mikekerrIII's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ship View Post
    An article I read about it said that the analysts noticed that there were differences between the supposedly identical missiles (seams and rivets on one, but missing from the same place on another) which indicates that they were kit-bashed together instead of manufactured in a factory somewhere.
    Not everyone has the German fetish for precision. Have you ever seem a Mig in a museum? good airplanes but they look like they were put together in shop class.
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  4. #8689
    They call me Mr. Pip! the4thpip's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ship View Post
    An article I read about it said that the analysts noticed that there were differences between the supposedly identical missiles (seams and rivets on one, but missing from the same place on another) which indicates that they were kit-bashed together instead of manufactured in a factory somewhere.
    Also, they don't fit the sizes of their launch pads or whatever the things at the ends are called.

    And the metal is wavy.

    English language media now picked it up:

    Each of the six missiles, designated KN-08 by Western analysts, was slightly different and did not fit the big new eight-axle mobile launchers they were carried on, Schiller and Schmucker wrote.

    Small boxes or retro rockets on one missile were missing on others, they said. Each of the missiles showed slightly different cable duct positions and covers that were either in horizontal or vertical positions.

    Several photos show the warhead's surface was undulated, suggesting it is only a metal sheet fixed to a frame, the analysts wrote.

    "MOCKUPS OF LOW QUALITY"

    "It is therefore clear that the presented missiles are only mockups of low quality," they said, adding that there was no evidence that North Korea had a working intercontinental ballistic missile.
    http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/s...,3667742.story
    Last edited by the4thpip; 04-27-2012 at 11:48 PM.
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  5. #8690
    Elder Member king mob's Avatar
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    How Jeremy Hunt is in a job still is a mystery.
    Lord Justice Leveson has rebuffed the government by making clear it was not his inquiry's role to rule if the culture secretary, Jeremy Hunt, has breached the ministerial code by his handling of the News Corp bid for BSkyB.

    The firm refusal from the Leveson inquiry is embarrassing to David Cameron, who claimed on Wednesday that the inquiry was the best forum to determine whether Hunt, as well as his special adviser Adam Smith, had handled the bid in a partisan manner. Instead, Hunt may now have to face a separate, and potentially more painful, investigation by an independent watchdog set up to police the behaviour of ministers.

    Leveson's spokesman also denied claims by the deputy prime minister, Nick Clegg, that he was going to bring forward the date of Hunt's appearance at the inquiry so his case could be fast-tracked. Clegg said: "I think we've already got an agreement Jeremy Hunt will go to the Leveson pretty quick." Leveson's spokesman said that Hunt's request to bring his evidence session forward had been turned down "in the interests of fairness to all".

    Leveson's stance underlines that Cameron has not ordered an inquiry by the independent watchdog into the breaches of the code, but may now come under irresistible pressure to do so.

    Ed Miliband had earlier accused Cameron of a cover-up. The Labour leader said the proper course would be to refer Hunt's case to Sir Alex Allan, the prime minister's independent adviser on the ministerial code. Sir Alex, who is paid £30,000 a year, has so far been excluded from the process on Cameron's instructions. His office was also bypassed by the prime minister over the conduct of Liam Fox, the former defence secretary.

    Both the Lib Dem deputy leader, Simon Hughes, and Lorely Burt, who chairs the Lib Dem parliamentary party, called for Hunt to be referred immediately to Allan.

    But Clegg, their party leader, said: "Unless anyone has got a better idea I think having a judge where a cabinet minister needs to give evidence under oath is about the best context to really get down to find out what happened or what didn't happen."

    He added that after Hunt had given his evidence it might be possible to look at breaches of the code. Clegg, who denied that the coalition was sleazy, claimed there was a danger of crossed wires if Allan also looked at breaches of the code, such as ministerial responsibility for the conduct of a special adviser.

    Leveson himself said on Wednesday after a telephone discussion with Sir Jeremy Heywood, the cabinet secretary: "Although I have seen requests for other inquiries and other investigations, it seems to me that the better course is to allow this inquiry to proceed."

    But it is understood the Leveson inquiry is now concerned that it is being asked to examine issues of ministerial conduct in relation to the code well beyond its original terms of reference.

    The inquiry believes that Lord Justice Leveson is not the arbiter of the ministerial code, because that falls to Allen.

    Leveson sources were clearly anxious not to get locked into a row with Downing Street, but felt it necessary to assert their role.

    Hunt said he would be handing to the Leveson inquiry all the texts and emails between himself and his special adviser over the bid, adding he was confident that they would show he had behaved with total integrity.

    Cameron's plans to rely on Leveson's cross-examination of Hunt came under question from Sir Christopher Kelly, the chairman of the committee on standards in publiclLife. He said Allan was the obvious person to conduct an inquiry. If the issue were to be left to Leveson, Downing Street must make clear that the judge had the power to look into ministerial conduct – something that Cameron's official spokesman has repeatedly confirmed is a matter for the prime minister.

    There was "no doubt" that the allegations needed to be properly investigated, said Kelly. "It is important for public confidence in the integrity of government and also in fairness to the individuals concerned that this is done – and done reasonably quickly. One obvious way to do it is by asking the independent adviser on ministerial interests to look at them. If it is to be done instead by Lord Justice Leveson as part of his inquiry then it needs to be clear that all the standards issues, including those relating to the ministerial code, are regarded as being within his remit and will indeed be looked at. It would be helpful to have that put beyond doubt."

    A poll published on Friday night revealed that the public believes by a margin of five to one that Hunt should resign.

    The ComRes poll for the Independent found that 63% of those polled believe Hunt should resign, 12% disagree and 24% don't know. The poll also gives Labour a five-point lead on 39%, the Tories 34%; the Lib Dems 10% and others 17%.

    By a 2-1 margin, people think the government is incompetent. Only 27 per cent agree that it is proving competent. By a margin of 67 to 21 per cent, the public believe that David Cameron and George Osborne are out of touch with ordinary people.

    Miliband, criticised by some in Labour for focusing too much on News International, kept up the pressure. He said: "Every day, David Cameron looks more like a prime minister organising a cover-up rather than standing up for the public.

    "First he refuses to sack Jeremy Hunt despite the weight of evidence against him. Now despite all-party calls to do so, he refuses even to ask the independent adviser on ministerial interests to examine whether Mr Hunt broke the ministerial code.

    "As Downing Street admits, it is not Lord Justice Leveson's job to adjudicate on whether Jeremy Hunt has broken the code.

    "Just as last July, the prime minister dragged his feet on a judicial inquiry, defended Rebekah Brooks and clung to the BSkyB bid, so we see the same pattern again."

    Harriet Harman, the shadow culture secretary, also wrote to the former cabinet secretary Lord O'Donnell to ask whether he would have cleared Hunt to act as the cabinet minister ruling on the BSkyB bid, had he known what has now been revealed about the conduct of Hunt's office.

    Lord O'Donnell is expected to state his views when he appears in front of the inquiry himself.
    http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2012...not-my-problem

  6. #8691

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    A year after the death of Bin Laden, US officials claim "core" Al Qaida is "essentially gone".

    I guess that means The Patriot Act is no longer needed, right?


    Right?
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  7. #8692
    Pickled by life o1pickleboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iangould View Post
    A year after the death of Bin Laden, US officials claim "core" Al Qaida is "essentially gone".

    I guess that means The Patriot Act is no longer needed, right?


    Right?
    Why? do you want them to come back? Don't you know that is the only thing stopping the terrorists
    I'm not liberal, liberals have beliefs. I'm a democrat, the only belief I have is that republicans are wrong.

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  8. #8693
    Elder Member mikekerrIII's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by the4thpip View Post
    Also, they don't fit the sizes of their launch pads or whatever the things at the ends are called.

    And the metal is wavy.

    English language media now picked it up:



    http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/s...,3667742.story
    The person commenting about the wavy metal has never seen a B-52, those old ladies look like Grandmothers

    Liquid filled boosters are very thin shells that without fuel sag like hell since they are essential balloons
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  9. #8694
    Observer Vibranium's Avatar
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  10. #8695
    Pickled by life o1pickleboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vibranium View Post
    shit no wonder Paradox hasn't been on-line.
    I'm not liberal, liberals have beliefs. I'm a democrat, the only belief I have is that republicans are wrong.

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  11. #8696
    Observer Vibranium's Avatar
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    Zing.....I know these guys mean well, but it is a matter of time before one of these guys really gets hurt or in trouble with the actual law
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  12. #8697
    Nyah! Paradox's Avatar
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    o1pickleboy gets buzzy:

    shit no wonder Paradox hasn't been on-line.
    You don't understand. I wasn't in there with them, they were in there with ME!

    Hrm.
    'Dox out.

    "But I think the difference is, when Democrats go crazy, they get shown the door. When Republicans go crazy they get appointed to the Science committee. " - Shawn Hopkins

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  13. #8698
    2x Postmania Champion Gryphon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paradox View Post
    You don't understand. I wasn't in there with them, they were in there with ME!

    Hrm.
    Im actually watching watchmen right now and that scene just came on.
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  14. #8699
    They call me Mr. Pip! the4thpip's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikekerrIII View Post
    The person commenting about the wavy metal has never seen a B-52, those old ladies look like Grandmothers

    Liquid filled boosters are very thin shells that without fuel sag like hell since they are essential balloons
    Yes, I am sure a scientist who has advised NATO on missiles in the past has never seen a B-52.
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  15. #8700
    Elder Member king mob's Avatar
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    Jeremy Hunt is still in a job and hasn't been sacked or quit.

    When Tony Blair was in trouble and an inquiry was needed, the key, so the joke went among the party's fixers, was to "find the right judge". The events at Lord Justice Leveson's inquiry suggest his successor but one hasn't learned that particular lesson.

    On Friday evening Leveson made it clear that he simply wasn't going to do David Cameron's bidding on the issue of the future of the culture secretary, Jeremy Hunt. He wasn't going to be the arbiter of whether the cache of emails and texts between Hunt's office and News Corp during their attempted takeover of BSkyB was a breach of the ministerial code, as the prime minister had suggested in parliament. He wasn't even going to bring forward Hunt's appearance at the inquiry, as the deputy prime minister Nick Clegg had said had been agreed.

    Leveson was going to do it his way and if that undermined the prime minister's refusal to refer the whole matter to his adviser on the ministerial code, it simply wasn't his problem. With Leveson proving more independent minded than perhaps had been hoped, the prime minister has been left with a lame duck culture secretary and no swift way out to limit the damage. And few people, anywhere in the Commons are happy about it.

    The government's failure to respond, in particular, to evidence that a statement to the Commons was leaked by Hunt's office to News Corp is now causing unrest across all three main political parties.

    Among the emails and texts between Hunt's special adviser, Adam Smith, and News Corp's lobbyist, Frédéric Michel, revealed to the Leveson inquiry last week, one message contained what was described as "absolutely illegal" details on a future Hunt statement on BSkyB. If Hunt knew about it, he would have to go. If he didn't, he currently can't prove it because his prime minister has vowed that the issue will be dealt by Leveson and it has been decreed that no one should talk out of shop. As one senior Liberal Democrat said: "This just looks terrible."

    Peter Bone, Tory MP for Wellinborough, believes the unhappy situation needs to be solved – and rapidly. "The one thing that Jeremy had to answer to parliament is this leaked statement – the rest of it can be dealt with by Leveson," he said. "If the statement was leaked it would be a breach of the ministerial code. It appears that it has been leaked but that needs to be investigated and pretty rapidly.

    "It is up to the prime minister to set things in motion and refer it to the cabinet secretary or the adviser on the code. It may have nothing to do with Jeremy, it may just be his special adviser, but we need to know and the sooner the better."

    It is an opinion that many of those who describe themselves as supporters of the culture secretary can agree with. Nadine Dorries, the MP for mid-Bedfordshire, who last week accused the prime minister and chancellor of being "arrogant posh boys", believes in Hunt's innocence and is despairing that he can't prove it. "There are obviously things that Jeremy Hunt wants to say and show to clear his name and I think he should be given the opportunity do this as soon as possible," she said.

    Ben Bradshaw, the former culture secretary, is not so convinced of the cabinet minister's innocence but he agrees that the current position cannot stand. "The position is unacceptable and unsustainable," he said. "It is clear that David Cameron is trying to prevent disclosure which would leave him exposed. That's completely obvious to everyone including many Tory and Lib Dem MPs, political commentators and the public."

    Harriet Harman, the shadow culture, media and sport secretary, added: "David Cameron is delaying the decision he knows he should make and is ducking his responsibility." Labour leader Ed Miliband said: "We've had Conservatives calling for that, we've had Liberal Democrats calling for that, we've got Labour calling for it – this is now an all-party issue."

    A Downing Street spokesman insisted the prime minister was merely concerned to avoid cutting across the Leveson inquiry. He added: "We have always been clear that the prime minister and not the Leveson inquiry is the arbiter of the ministerial code.

    "Jeremy Hunt will be appearing before the inquiry under oath and has made clear he will be providing all necessary evidence for consideration.

    "It does not make sense to cut across a judicial inquiry with a parallel process that would risk pre-empting, duplicating or contradicting it. Once Jeremy Hunt's evidence is made public and he is questioned, if there is anything that suggests there has been a breach of the code the prime minister would of course act." But it is going to be a difficult few weeks if this line holds – and also if it doesn't.

    Many senior figures in the government believe Hunt is "a goner" and the prime minister needs to accept it and move on. But should the prime minister decide to do a U-turn and remove Hunt it may just be the start of his troubles with months more of this inquiry to come.

    The Observer understands that five other cabinet ministers have been called to appear in front of Leveson: Clegg, justice secretary Ken Clarke, business secretary Vince Cable, education secretary Michael Gove and home secretary Theresa May. Who knows what might come out next?
    http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2...kyb?intcmp=239

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