So on Bucky Barnes... *Spoilers*

[Gabe De Los Muertos]

As some of you may or may have not noticed, I've been absent from this forum and in general comics for a while. Life has it's ups and downs. Anyway, I finally begin coming back to comics to find three alarming and disheartening pieces of news 1) DC Comics has either bravely reinvigorated it's universe or stupidly destroyed it... 2) Marvel Comics is possibly killing the character that got me into comics in the first place (Ultimate Spidey)... And 3) Marvel and Matt Fraction killed off the coolest character they had and possibly the best and most well-received successor to take a mantle previously held by another well-loved character ever in comics. Bucky's entire story of resurgence, his path to the shield, and subsequently deserving it... Was amazing. Bucky became to Brubaker what Wolverine was to Claremont, what Daredevil was to Bendis. So to see him die in a merely okay event at the pen of Matt Fraction... Is a blow to the chest. At the very least. Brubaker should have wrote his death and he should have died in the pages of CAPTAIN AMERICA like his story started. He still had so much story-telling potential, and would have been interesting to read just as the Winter Soldier.

But there is also a fair point that at least now his character cannot be destroyed to the point of the Runaways and he went out on a popular peak.

So Bucky's death - Stupid or smart move on Marvel's part?

[Metal Sphere]

I'd rather a writer tell the tale they intend for a character and be done with them than drag them out. In various forms of media, one of the worst things to see is a character or show slowly spiraling the drain.

BTW, have you read the interview with Brubaker, Fraction and Brevoort over at Newsarama? It touches on a few of the points you made here.

http://www.newsarama.com/comics/faci...-3-110602.html

[Abdulabulbul_Amir]

What does Winicked mean?

[NYAvenger15]

Didn't like the death, but dont like the only two options you gave us.

[agirlyman]

Holy Crap! I just glanced through the last two weeks of comics, I saw what happen, but I didn't read it, no way I thought he was dead. I can't believe they bring Bucky back to have him die already.

[Kaim]

Not so happy about the death, and not really buying the "He has to be dead!" line either.

[Hrist]

Well, I doubt if he's really 100% gone. My suspicion is this is a thing that will move him from his Captain America role to a more permanent identity, and the death thing is a temporary freak-out to get Steve back into the costume. (See also: releasing a book in July with copy reading "What is Bucky's future?? Can he find his place in the Marvel Universe??")

But no, I don't believe Bucky has to die, and I don't believe it's ever a good thing to kill a character off so they might not be "ruined" by other writers. It is a shared universe, and I don't believe the good characters can be ruined. (Though, Elektra might be a compelling case otherwise.) Especially because killing a character doesn't mean no one will ruin them later. Bucky is popular enough that his resurrection is practically guaranteed, if not as part of this storyline at the hands of Brubaker, then somewhere down the line when someone thinks, "Oh hey what was a time when Captain America was selling tons and critically acclaimed? When Bucky was in it!!" and have him come back for that reason. It's no longer a sacred dead-means-dead death. There is no longer the concept of Bucky-dead.

Which I do want to say, because some people seem to think that Brubaker needed to put all toys back in the box before leaving the title, to end his run the same status-quoish place in which he began. No, Steve doesn't need Bucky dead to be Captain America, and he doesn't need Bucky dead to be guilty about what happened to Bucky. What happened to Bucky is a fate worse than death; it's something Bucky will never get over, it's something Steve will never quite forgive himself for, though none of it is his fault.

That was one of the many brilliances of the Winter Soldier storyline, but the chief among them is this: it re-introduced a character no one thought viable and made him interesting and popular. Bringing Bucky back reinvigorated the Captain America franchise. It's on its way to becoming one of those iconic Captain America stories— they're teasing it on the Avengers show, they are thinking about using it for the movie sequels. But more importantly, there's only one Bucky is dead story. There are many possible stories where Bucky isn't dead. That, I suspect, has always been the case, but it took an awful long time to get to the point where we could see it. And it was handled incredibly well, well enough that I don't think it could have been handled better. Bucky is/was a win in all columns, a critical and commercial success, in a market where even long-established characters struggle to stay relevant and move books.

Anyway, if he does stay dead in the longish term, I'll look on "well at least now he won't be ruined by other writers" as a bright side. But no, I don't think it's a smart move. Bucky is Brubaker's greatest status-quo shakeup, the exact kind of thing we should be sad about losing when the corporate narratives set themselves again back to default.

Also, yeah, Dupin, the first post I saw from you in a while was the "f—— Matt Fraction" one. I saw it and thought "Welcome back!!"

[Prince Of Orphans]

I don't believe he's dead, at least not until the end of the event confirms it, and I don't agree with the point that it would be smart to kill him before writers start to drag out his story.

Fans of the character shouldn't be punished by having the character killed off just because there's a potential for future writers to make him uninteresting. Every character runs that risk.

[Tikal]

remember the end of avengers #11 just a few months ago where thanos reappeared and everyone was all up in arms... lets just wait till next issue (or even the end of the series) before we start saying what a mistake marvel did

god i can only imagine the uproar that would have happened if there was internet during the infinity gauntlet affair

"WHAT THEY KILLED THE FANTASTIC FOUR!?!?! "
"They whiped almost all of the x men and avengers?!?!!"
"I hate marvel!!! they are so dumb!!!"
"they are writing death so out of character!!!!"
"mephisto would never do that!!!"
"GALACACTUS JOBBING AGAIN OOOH NOOOOESSSS"

[Hrist]

remember the end of avengers #11 just a few months ago where thanos reappeared and everyone was all up in arms... lets just wait till next issue (or even the end of the series) before we start saying what a mistake marvel did

god i can only imagine the uproar that would have happened if there was internet during the infinity gauntlet affair

"WHAT THEY KILLED THE FANTASTIC FOUR!?!?! "
"They whiped almost all of the x men and avengers?!?!!"
"I hate marvel!!! they are so dumb!!!"
"they are writing death so out of character!!!!"
"mephisto would never do that!!!"
"GALACACTUS JOBBING AGAIN OOOH NOOOOESSSS"

Yes, obviously, we can't judge the total impact of a story when a story hasn't finished.

At the same time, they killed him hoping to elicit a reaction from readers, no? I think they'd rather have people gasping or in tears than reading the comic and cynically (if correctly) predicting the whole thing is pointless because soon he'll come back.

[Will.S]

I didn't think his "death" was badly executed within Fear Itself but I do agree that it wasn't really necessary either.

I think it's a given that he's coming back so I don't know why they couldn't just knock him out and achieve the same effect without having to resurrect him. But the story's not over so it seems a little premature to discuss his fate in the bigger picture.

[SomeBodyAtCBR]

I voted smart move, only because I'm in the camp that sees that Bucky's story is over. He would have had to die at some point, because the longer he's alive you either continue to create new threats to keep him from having a "successful" life or you need to sacrifice the very story character connection between Bucky and Steve, and how he will always be the failure that keeps Steve pushing on.

This isn't to say that I thought the death, if this is that, was even a decent way to kill him. It was very out-of-the-blue and not so built up as I would have liked. I would have also preferred to have Steve unintentionally be the reason for Bucky's death again, serving some kind of poetic justice that no matter what, Bucky is Steve's failure.

However, I'm very happy that they could send Bucky (back) off on such a high-note and a great revitalization that (historically) had no right to be as good as it was. I know, and have experienced, running characters and plots into the ground, in various forms of media (cough TRANSFORMERS MOVIES cough) and am very happy that there will be very little tarnishing to Bucky's character, and the years he was brought back added a very good layer of likability to his character. Bucky made it. He's leaving on top, and what's more he's not that stupid little kid sidekick that was a joke anymore. There's nothing to be ashamed of with losing Bucky now and I enjoyed all the stories Brubaker has (and will) bring into Bucky's mythos. I won't be sad to see him go as much as I will be happy with the decision that they aren't going to water-down his character much like they have with the Hood or the Sentry.

[Prince Of Orphans]

However, I'm very happy that they could send Bucky (back) off on such a high-note and a great revitalization that (historically) had no right to be as good as it was. I know, and have experienced, running characters and plots into the ground, in various forms of media (cough TRANSFORMERS MOVIES cough) and am very happy that there will be very little tarnishing to Bucky's character, and the years he was brought back added a very good layer of likability to his character. Bucky made it. He's leaving on top, and what's more he's not that stupid little kid sidekick that was a joke anymore. There's nothing to be ashamed of with losing Bucky now and I enjoyed all the stories Brubaker has (and will) bring into Bucky's mythos. I won't be sad to see him go as much as I will be happy with the decision that they aren't going to water-down his character much like they have with the Hood or the Sentry.

I agree with this to an extent. Although i have an issue with one thing. The whole time he was brought back, he never once "won" if you get what i mean. He was constantly the underdog and constantly being defeated an/or captured. I'd like to have seen one major point in the win column before he went out. Fans of the character have been rooting for him since he was brought back, he's Marvel's official underdog, whose luck blatantly sucks. We never got to see him win before he died.It's a downer...


I would've loved it if he put up much more of a fight than he did against Sin, despite being nowhere near her power level. It would stay true to the mythos of Captain America, kind of reference instances where Steve was the underdog, but valiantly fought on no matter what. Should've given him a Boromir (Lord of the Rings) style death.

I say this under the assumption that he is dead, not that i believe it.

[Hrist]

I agree with this to an extent. Although i have an issue with one thing. The whole time he was brought back, he never once "won" if you get what i mean. He was constantly the underdog and constantly being defeated an/or captured.

Captain America #42? Captain America #50?

[Prince Of Orphans]

Captain America #42? Captain America #50?

In #42: That was a pretty big win, his only big one really, not enough to ride on the coat tails until now. Not long after that the public began to hate him again.

In #50: Beat some generic villains in robot suits. A one-shot kinda thing. A great story and I loved it, but i want something major.

Overall, he died with everybody thinking he was a bad guy, despite being found not guilty by American courts. He died the OJ Simpson of the superhero community.