Did Evil Win with Mattie Franklin's Death?

[Probably_not_a_Nurgling]

I only know about Mattie from Spider-Man: The Ultimate Guide but I was positively shocked to learn she was dead, and, what's more, that she had been literally traded for Grim Hunter, of all characters. I mean, really, Grim Hunter? Does anyone actually like Grim Hunter? Mattie probably has ten times Grim Hunter's fanbase! Which is still probably only about twenty fans, but you get the picture.

[Toosie25]

which is why i think her death was an injustice even though some people think she was an expendable character at least, i think she was not expendable and her role in grim even though not really pivotal to the grim hunt arc as her death was uncalled for, in which as a result of her demise brought back the grim hunter who dies as well. i am thinking if they bring her back which i hope they do. i am wonder will jonah ever know in the long run....

[Mister Mets]

On a more cynical note, I think Mattie was killed off to add racial diversity to the line. Racial diversity that forced a non spider girl character into the role of spider girl because Anya, while a good character, couldn't carry a book without being linked to spider girl which she couldn't then either.

The problem with this is it was a rush job no matter how you slice it. What moron in their right mind thought they could spin off a character with practically 0 history in the pages of spider-man without grim hunt. Also I was a little miffed screwball was a jobber, i get her being a comic relief jobber in spidey but a just downright mean non comic relief jobber fora powerless Anya?

What happened to the days when we could character diversity from character developments and not cheap switcheroos, actually, did those ever exist?

I think it was subtraction rather than substitution.

They wanted to reduce the number of people with spider powers in the Marvel Universe. Arana could have been Spider-Girl regardless of whether Mattie survived.

They also used the story to kill off Madame Web and replace her with Julie Carpenter.

[Toosie25]

I think it was subtraction rather than substitution.

They wanted to reduce the number of people with spider powers in the Marvel Universe. Arana could have been Spider-Girl regardless of whether Mattie survived.

They also used the story to kill off Madame Web and replace her with Julie Carpenter.

hey you forgot the part abt kaine. even though i agree with you that it was a substraction both sides suffered losses. But both sides have people that have got back from the dead after grim hunt while kraven is back we also saw the return of kaine.

And also Arana said she doesn't want to be known as spidergirl. I hope u are right that arans could have been spiderwhen if mattie was around...

[Spider-Dragon]

Speaking of Kaine and his resurrection in Grim Hunt...

Isn't he connected to Kraven in some form now?

Kraven can only be killed by Spider-Man if I recall correctly, but can Kaine be killed as long as Kraven remains alive?

Wasn't he resurrected because Kraven was resurrected and lived?

[mugiwara]

I don't know if they wanted to kill her "one way or another". Limbo works just as well. She was probably just the most expendable for what they had planned.

Not really, since she was related to important Spider Man characters.
When Marvel don't want to deal with the obvious ramifications of a character's death, they shouldn't kill this character.
They could have just killed Madame Web and get over with it.

[Toosie25]

wait a minute can someone humour me on this, even though madame got the gift of immortality from the gathering of the five arc how can she be dead in the first place? And the same goes with mattie franklin when she got the gift of power how could she be dead as well?

[CMBMOOL]

The story would only have made sense shortly after Grim Hunt. There's less of a point to it now that Marla Madison's been killed off, too.

Which makes me wonder if Mattie was also one of Peter's reason of taking up the "NO One dies" promise or if Johan ever looked at a picture of Mattie and Marla together and realizes just how much he lost in the past year.

[matthewaos]

wait a minute can someone humour me on this, even though madame got the gift of immortality from the gathering of the five arc how can she be dead in the first place? And the same goes with mattie franklin when she got the gift of power how could she be dead as well?

You are right on this, if I remember right. Though I try not to think of this story at all.

[CyberHubbs]

wait a minute can someone humour me on this, even though madame got the gift of immortality from the gathering of the five arc how can she be dead in the first place? And the same goes with mattie franklin when she got the gift of power how could she be dead as well?

Magic lightning-knife.

[Mister Mets]

Which makes me wonder if Mattie was also one of Peter's reason of taking up the "NO One dies" promise or if Johan ever looked at a picture of Mattie and Marla together and realizes just how much he lost in the past year.

Mattie did appear in the dream with all the others who died during Spider-Man's adventures.

Jonah may have those wistful moments off-panel, but there isn't a point to showing that unless it's relevant to a story.

[Toosie25]

i think she must be in a place in the marvel universe in a similar situation like wasp....

[Toosie25]

Mattie did appear in the dream with all the others who died during Spider-Man's adventures.

Jonah may have those wistful moments off-panel, but there isn't a point to showing that unless it's relevant to a story.

i think i saw that as well. pity jonah didn't see that and only parker could...

[stewart48]

I think it was subtraction rather than substitution.

They wanted to reduce the number of people with spider powers in the Marvel Universe. Arana could have been Spider-Girl regardless of whether Mattie survived.

They also used the story to kill off Madame Web and replace her with Julie Carpenter.

Araña was such a better character before spider girl, she even had a better name.

Killing Mattie was there to set up her up as spider-girl. Marvel knows it gives them a check ark on the spiderman diversity side. Marvel is trying to be more diverse and that's a good thing, but to me this situation came at the expense of both characters.

Marvel knew no one would ever consider Anya a spider character without her taking Mattie's place, white people are more likely to buy spider-girl than Araña if they don't know the character.

In hindsight a book with Spider-girl and Araña could have worked because then marvel doesn't have to hide the fact there is a Latino Spider-girl and she gets to keep what I thought was a cool name.

My big issue with Mattie's death wasn't a bad story issue overall, it just never felt like spidey even before she died. She was for here'd for I don't know how long, but in readers time it felt like months and then she I'd stabbed in the chest and quickly discarded. It wasn't marvels intent but that's life as an ancillary female character anyway

[Toosie25]

wait a mintue even kaine was in the No One dies dream as well as mattie and yet he returned which stunned me a bit...