Did Evil Win with Mattie Franklin's Death?

[CyberHubbs]

I don't think evil triumphs more often than not in the 'real' world. But even if I did buy into that philosophy, I tend to think that fiction is about the world we can create, not necessarily the one we've got. So I don't see the need to overwhelm readers with death and destruction at every corner.

I think the Marvel Universe is a place where bad things often happen to good people, but heroism tends to prevail. You look at say, Flash Thompson or Matt Murdock, and they've lived hellish lives. But I also feel pretty inspired by their persistence in the face of overwhelming odds. When you're Flash Thompson, getting out of bad and taking another shot at it is a triumph over evil!

I'm cool with a nice balance. There's no reason that the heroes should get it so good when their supporting casts get routinely decimated to prop the main guy or gal up. No one feels bad for Gwen, but oh no please don't hurt Spider-Man. Heck with that noise.

[Mister Mets]

I don't think evil triumphs more often than not in the 'real' world. But even if I did buy into that philosophy, I tend to think that fiction is about the world we can create, not necessarily the one we've got. So I don't see the need to overwhelm readers with death and destruction at every corner.

I think the Marvel Universe is a place where bad things often happen to good people, but heroism tends to prevail. You look at say, Flash Thompson or Matt Murdock, and they've lived hellish lives. But I also feel pretty inspired by their persistence in the face of overwhelming odds. When you're Flash Thompson, getting out of bad and taking another shot at it is a triumph over evil!

But sometimes good people did horribly and unnecessarily in ways that are devoid of meaning. If writers never show that within the Marvel Universe, they're creating a misleading picture of the world.

[Mister Mets]

Although I guess from matties viewpoint evil did pretty well.

That would be true of any story in which a good person was murdered.

[David Walton]

But sometimes good people did horribly and unnecessarily in ways that are devoid of meaning. If writers never show that within the Marvel Universe, they're creating a misleading picture of the world.

Yeah, but if you look at my post, I never argued against that point. And personally, I'm not that concerned about Mattie's death one way or the other. I just think that on the whole, good prevails in the Marvel Universe. It's not like the Kraven's pulled a real victory out of Mattie's death, after all. Kraven doesn't even want to be alive!

[David Walton]

I'm cool with a nice balance. There's no reason that the heroes should get it so good when their supporting casts get routinely decimated to prop the main guy or gal up. No one feels bad for Gwen, but oh no please don't hurt Spider-Man. Heck with that noise.

In what world td the Marvel Universe hereos 'get it so good'? They're not typically going to die meaningless deaths when they support their own book. But you can't really say Matt Murdock or Steve Rogers or Peter Parker or pretty much anyone you can point at have gotten off light.

[One More Day]

I don't think evil triumphs more often than not in the 'real' world. But even if I did buy into that philosophy, I tend to think that fiction is about the world we can create, not necessarily the one we've got. So I don't see the need to overwhelm readers with death and destruction at every corner.

I think the Marvel Universe is a place where bad things often happen to good people, but heroism tends to prevail. You look at say, Flash Thompson or Matt Murdock, and they've lived hellish lives. But I also feel pretty inspired by their persistence in the face of overwhelming odds. When you're Flash Thompson, getting out of bad and taking another shot at it is a triumph over evil!

Really? "Hellish" lives? Flash Thompson has lived a great life. He was a high school bmoc, star qb. He was a military vet and got nominated for the medal of honor. He's now a g-man version of his favorite hero and is an Avenger working alongside Captain America, plus he's flirting with an Asgardian Goddess. Oh and he saved the world from Hell on Earth (literally)

On the other hand, Matt Murdock is a successful lawyer and superhero who has saved countless lives and dated and slept with many beautiful women. And he's a celebrity and the talk of gossip columns.

[CyberHubbs]

In what world td the Marvel Universe hereos 'get it so good'? They're not typically going to die meaningless deaths when they support their own book. But you can't really say Matt Murdock or Steve Rogers or Peter Parker or pretty much anyone you can point at have gotten off light.

They're still alive and generally happy.

[One More Day]

They're still alive and generally happy.

Agreed. And Peter Parker can't shut up about how great his job is.

[Mister Mets]

Really? "Hellish" lives? Flash Thompson has lived a great life. He was a high school bmoc, star qb. He was a military vet and got nominated for the medal of honor. He's now a g-man version of his favorite hero and is an Avenger working alongside Captain America, plus he's flirting with an Asgardian Goddess. Oh and he saved the world from Hell on Earth (literally)

On the other hand, Matt Murdock is a successful lawyer and superhero who has saved countless lives and dated and slept with many beautiful women. And he's a celebrity and the talk of gossip columns.

On the flip side, Flash spent years of his life as a hasbeen whose glory days were in high school and college football. He became an alcoholic, and lost his legs.

Following the suicide of a girlfriend, Matt Murdoch spent a few years as a legal pariah, when he was framed and his reputation was destroyed. The love of his life was murdered in front of him. He had a nervous breakdown when his secret identity was exposed to the world. And an enemy of his poisoned his wife, resulting in irrevocable brain damage.

[CyberHubbs]

On the flip side, Flash spent years of his life as a hasbeen whose glory days were in high school and college football. He became an alcoholic, and lost his legs.

Following the suicide of a girlfriend, Matt Murdoch spent a few years as a legal pariah, when he was framed and his reputation was destroyed. The love of his life was murdered in front of him. He had a nervous breakdown when his secret identity was exposed to the world. And an enemy of his poisoned his wife, resulting in irrevocable brain damage.

Gonna say their loved ones still got it worse.

[David Walton]

On the flip side, Flash spent years of his life as a hasbeen whose glory days were in high school and college football. He became an alcoholic, and lost his legs.

Following the suicide of a girlfriend, Matt Murdoch spent a few years as a legal pariah, when he was framed and his reputation was destroyed. The love of his life was murdered in front of him. He had a nervous breakdown when his secret identity was exposed to the world. And an enemy of his poisoned his wife, resulting in irrevocable brain damage.

Yeah...and now Flash has bonded with a symbiote and is hiding that from the Secret Avengers. And Matt Murdock is probably on deck for another round of hell, as things are heating up again with "The Omega Effect" and who knows what the fallout will be.

I hardly look at Flash and Matt and go, "Living the dream..."

But it's all built on the Stan Lee foundation that being a hero comes at a price.

[David Walton]

Gonna say their loved ones still got it worse.

Depends on your perspective. Their loved ones are at peace, while they're still battling their demons.

But really, I'm not sure what you want here 'hubbs. Are you saying you want Peter Parker to be thrown from a bridge and have his neck snapped by webbing? You want Matt Murdock to get AIDs and be slaughtered by Bullseye? This just isn't going to happen because they're the ones carrying their books.

[CyberHubbs]

Depends on your perspective. Their loved ones are at peace, while they're still battling their demons.

I don't think being murdered by a guy in a garish costume is exactly being at peace. But that's just me.

But really, I'm not sure what you want here 'hubbs. Are you saying you want Peter Parker to be thrown from a bridge and have his neck snapped by webbing? You want Matt Murdock to get AIDs and be slaughtered by Bullseye? This just isn't going to happen because they're the ones carrying their books.

I know it won't happen. I don't want a horrible ending every time. Despite what folks think, I can fully appreciate a happy ending. I loved Old Yeller.

I just don't like when that becomes the expectation because we think they've earned it.

[Spider-Dragon]

Evil will always win because good is dumb.

Says the one wearing the Dark Helmet.

Space Balls: The Movie.

[BrotherUnitNo_4]

I see the answer is no.