Jean Grey Appreciation III

[joshtylen]

yup know what answers you are going to get when asking your questions. When fighting a dragon be careful you don't become one yourself.

[Phoenix Egg]

I think his posts are more about changing continuity to fit AvX than anything else.

[MarvelMaster616]

I think his posts are more about changing continuity to fit AvX than anything else.

Whatever you call it, it's still pretty freakin' dishonest when you consider that Jean Grey's on official bio on Marvel says "the Phoenix flew to Earth and forcefully resurrected Jean Grey. Jean ultimately merged with the Phoenix Force, once again becoming the White Phoenix, and returned to the White Hot Room to find its missing pieces." And that's not a wiki mind you. I don't know how anyone can read Endsong and still use the "dead is dead" argument.

[The_Greatest_Username]

Changing continuity is nothing new for Marvel.

It's best if we stop feeding fuel to the fire. I'm sure the less we annoy Marvel the more likely we are to get Jean back. If they think we're "gone" they might try and get us back. Remember (I'm stealing this one from another Jean fan), they need us we don't need them.

[krisis]

Whatever you call it, it's still pretty freakin' dishonest when you consider that Jean Grey's on official bio on Marvel says "the Phoenix flew to Earth and forcefully resurrected Jean Grey. Jean ultimately merged with the Phoenix Force, once again becoming the White Phoenix, and returned to the White Hot Room to find its missing pieces." And that's not a wiki mind you. I don't know how anyone can read Endsong and still use the "dead is dead" argument.

I agree. Most if not all of my distaste for AvX has to do with how badly they have mangled not only the deeper history of Jean/Phoenix, but also all of the newer plot threads that have been established to hint at a continuing mythology.

Brevoort clearly has a specific and defendable editorial read on it, but it's not the only read and X-Men fans are pretty specific when it comes to continuity.

Because of that, I don't really find the Jean fan questions to be rude. This is different than arguing about who can pick up Thor's hammer. Jean fans have been sold books and a certain story for years and now are being told that is invalid. It is a microcosm of DC's New 52 and another great example of how Marvel fans really don't like reboots, whether they be soft or hard.

[joshtylen]

Avengers Alliance team ups gets you additional points for completing missions.

Teams with Jean
X-Men members = X-Force (50 points)
Heroes with a flying ability = Aviary (50 points)
Cyclops/Phoenix = X-Force, X-lovers (100 points)
Phoenix/Human Torch = Aviary, Hotstuff (100 points)
Phoenix/Ms. Marvel = Marvelous, Aviary (100 points)
Phoenix/Storm = X-Force, Aviary (100 points)

[PwrdOff]

Honestly, Jean fans should keep annoying Brevoort about her. The questions seem to be getting more civil, and he comes off as more of an arrogant ass with each response. He's really starting to stretch his logic with that bit about Jean being a zombie in Endsong, especially given that the only reason it sold as well as it did was because we were supposed to believe that it was really Jean in there. I doubt that even he believes that whatever new continuity introduced in AvX won't get immediately tossed aside when it comes time to tell the next Phoenix story. Plus, it's not like they're going to reward the fans' "good behavior" with a return story, and the more she gets brought up the more it reminds them that the fans haven't forgotten about her and that there's still a market for comics featuring her.

Also, I got X-men Season One today and it was great, Jean seemed like a much more fun character than in her original 60s personality. She looked a bit too much like Hope and sounded too much like Kitty at times, but that part of her history needed an update anyway.

[Kerukun878]

Honestly, Jean fans should keep annoying Brevoort about her. The questions seem to be getting more civil, and he comes off as more of an arrogant ass with each response. He's really starting to stretch his logic with that bit about Jean being a zombie in Endsong, especially given that the only reason it sold as well as it did was because we were supposed to believe that it was really Jean in there. I doubt that even he believes that whatever new continuity introduced in AvX won't get immediately tossed aside when it comes time to tell the next Phoenix story. Plus, it's not like they're going to reward the fans' "good behavior" with a return story, and the more she gets brought up the more it reminds them that the fans haven't forgotten about her and that there's still a market for comics featuring her.

Also, I got X-men Season One today and it was great, Jean seemed like a much more fun character than in her original 60s personality. She looked a bit too much like Hope and sounded too much like Kitty at times, but that part of her history needed an update anyway.

Well, Hope and Jean have their differences but it was by the same artist, so.

I also wouldn't say that she sounded too much like Kitty-- she sounded much more like an amalgamation of Ultimate Universe Jean, and what Jean would realistically act like in current times.

[krisis]

I try to give Brevoort the benefit of the doubt, but this is effing moronic and proves he simply does not know the continuity of Jean / Phoenix / X-Men at all.

Q: The fact the Scott and Emma relationship exist is proof that Jean is alive and with the Phoenix. How can you argue otherwise?

A: I think the Scott and Emma relationship is proof that Jean is dead. There's no way that Scott would move on with his life and be devoted to anybody else if that wasn't the case--his long history is certainly proof of that.

What? I mean... what? I just... I can't even. This could not be more wrong. I don't even have to list all of the reasons considering what thread I am posting this to, right?

EDIT: I think this is most upsetting not because I am a moderate Jean fan, but because it means the people in charge of putting together the stories we care about don't actually care about the stories. While I like Brevoort's approach to a lot of things, it just makes me sad how little the caretakers of the Marvel Universe care about the continuity they exist within. I'm not saying every issue and answer has to be full of references to old material, but when you do specifically reference older material at least take the time to get it right. Don't just rely on the Remenders and Gillens of the world to do it for you.

(Also: I sometimes forget that comic creators are not infallible. Even the best creators can read things incorrectly and make poor decisions because of it. Just because they hold those jobs does not mean they are the best at them, or any good at them at all. It just means they are making Disney a profit.)

[KurtW95]

What? I mean... what? I just... I can't even. This could not be more wrong. I don't even have to list all of the reasons considering what thread I am posting this to, right?

It seems Brevoort's reason of existence is to troll Jean fans.

[PwrdOff]

Brevoort and all the other Marvel staff are all former fanboys themselves, not publishing industry people who happen to be working in the comics medium. They are just doing what any other fan would do if they suddenly had creative control - push the characters that they like, bury the ones they don't, and publish stories that they personally want to see. This doesn't mean I'm longing for the days that the publishers were run by suits with no investment in the actual content at all, but it does make him sound hypocritical when he takes shots at fans for worrying about the minutiae of continuity or being overly attached to certain characters. After all, it's not like it's any crazier for fans to be so devoted to a character that they refuse to read comics without her in them, than for creators to dislike her so much that they refuse to ever put her in stories.

I almost want to say that Marvel's people shouldn't have such big heads and remember where they came from, but considering the state of the industry, can they even call themselves successful with a straight face? It's probably more fitting just to remind them that they are caretakers of a legacy someone else created, and that they don't own it any more than the fans do. It's best that they treat it with respect or else the next set of writers and editors who come from this generation of fans will just undo everything again and set it back to the way it was when they were growing up, and everybody loses.

[ZNOP]

Fantastic site with loads of Jean Grey art... Click Here

[joshtylen]

They seem okay with Ultimate Jean or any other alternate world Jean

Ultimate Jean is currently “undercover” in the Twin Cities of Tian, but Brian Wood has some pretty huge stuff planned with her after “Divided We Fall.” Stay tuned.
http://www.comicbookresources.com/?p...ticle&id=38518

[aries27]

I miss ultimate scott and jean. She had no problem getting in his head to find out what he wanted to do in bed, if only 616 Jean had done the same...
I was so glad when magneto finally got rid of wolverine.
But then pietro shoot scott in the head, to much death in ultimate they shoold have keep angel, dazzler, emma frost, beast and psylock.

[afropolo]

Hope should not exist. She was a mistake from her inception up to this date. Bring Jean back and let her take the damn school from Logan, and leave Scott in Emma's (she is still my girl though!!) prosthetic bosom. She outgrew the one-eyed monster YEARS ago. And Logan is NO UPGRADE!! She needs to take Ororo and Piotr away from Utopia and have the X-men be clear cut heroes again. Scott can do his Mussolini gig on his own time. Jean/Ororo/Rogue for life babaaay!!!! I am a die hard Storm fan, but Jean is the only person I would NOT mind leading Ororo. Their friendship has always been true and HONEST.