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  1. #16
    True heavyweight wrassler Jeremy A. Patterson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 90'sCartoonMan View Post
    Those last seasons did suck, and I'm sure Ferguson knew, but why show up for those handful of episodes? Was it a contract thing? Or was he worried about his career (since I believe this happened before he got a late night show)?
    He did indeed worry!

    J.A.P.

  2. #17
    Eat your tomatoes! Alex Scott's Avatar
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    I kind of like how Genshiken handles this. It's a manga about a college geek club, which means that it's part of its very nature to rotate characters in and out. Geshiken embraces this, and makes introductions and departures a regular occurrence. At the start of the series, the club is virtually all-male; new members drift in, they get more women. Now the original cast has graduated; the club is run by Chika Ogiue, introduced halfway through the original series, and dominated by yaoi-obsessed girls. The original cast still puts in appearances--characters who are dating members of the current cast, or are still friends, or who still live and work in the area. It all stays perfectly plausible, given how university life works.

    The one exception I can think of is the original president, who graduated a few volumes in and has never been seen since.

  3. #18
    Scary lady Chris Lang's Avatar
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    Power Rangers had this problem with Bulk and Skull, the bumbling comic relief duo. As the show progressed into its Zeo, Turbo, and 'In Space' phases, it seemed the writers were strugging to find things for them to do. There were times where they just faded into the background and didn't appear for a while.

    When 'Power Rangers: Lost Galaxy' began, the actor who played Skull moved on to other things, but Bulk stayed around. Deprived of his partner in comic relief, Bulk was instead paired with a professor and only ended up appearing in a few episodes of 'Lost Galaxy' in which he didn't really contribute much.

    Not that I was a big Power Rangers fan. I basically learned all this from Linkara's 'History of Power Rangers' videos.

  4. #19
    True heavyweight wrassler Jeremy A. Patterson's Avatar
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    Red face

    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Lang View Post
    Power Rangers had this problem with Bulk and Skull, the bumbling comic relief duo. As the show progressed into its Zeo, Turbo, and 'In Space' phases, it seemed the writers were strugging to find things for them to do. There were times where they just faded into the background and didn't appear for a while.

    When 'Power Rangers: Lost Galaxy' began, the actor who played Skull moved on to other things, but Bulk stayed around. Deprived of his partner in comic relief, Bulk was instead paired with a professor and only ended up appearing in a few episodes of 'Lost Galaxy' in which he didn't really contribute much.

    Not that I was a big Power Rangers fan. I basically learned all this from Linkara's 'History of Power Rangers' videos.
    The Professor character actually first appeared in 'In Space'.

    Jeremy Aron Patterson.

  5. #20
    True heavyweight wrassler Jeremy A. Patterson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by vernon9800 View Post
    When House got his "new" team during season four of the show, the former team members still stayed on-- Omar Epps, Jesse Spencer and Jennifer Morrison. Epps was quickly added back into the group, but Spencer and Morrison remained in the background for a good long while-- it was here that Dr. Chase became a super-surgeon. Eventually Kal Penn left so Chase was folded back in and Morrison's character was written out entirely.
    [IMG]http://www.****************/liuying1.jpg[/IMG]
    [IMG]http://www.****************/liuying2.jpg[/IMG]
    [IMG]http://www.****************/liuying3.jpg[/IMG]
    Very odd!

    Jeremy.

  6. #21
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    Potsie is a great example... but from the same show, you also had Ritchie's girlfriend, Laurie-Beth. They kept her on the show, even though she had no real attachment to any other character... often given bit parts like reading a letter from Ritchie. They tried to give her stuff to do, including a wedding to Ritchie wherein Fonz stood in as the proxy groom (Ron Howard didn't even appear for the wedding episode!) and later, she even had Ritchie's baby. Sh later disappeared from the canvas entirely.

    Laverne & Shirley faced a similar problem when Cindy Williams left the show in the last season, making it very odd for Laverne -- but most notably leaving Carmine with little to do, since his main role was as Shirley's boyfriend.

    Another good example is Cindy Snow from Three's Company. Jenny Lee Harrison was quickly hired to replace Suzanna Somers after a nasty contract dispute -- and they needed to preserve the name of the show! She lasted one season as a roommate (the show always saw her as a temporary replacement) -- and then they brought in Priscilla Barnes as Terri. BUT they kept Cindy around for that season, with a "storyline" she had registered at UCLA and was living on campus. Cindy would show up for small scenes here and there, but it was painfully obvious the show had NO place for her with Terri in place. And she was gone the following season.

    Another good example is One Day At A Time. Macenzie Phillips had substance abuse problems and was forced off the show... but her character, Julie, was married to a man named Max (Michael Lembeck), who they kept on the show. It was odd, because it gave Max very little to do as a character.
    Last edited by n8twing; 12-16-2011 at 10:04 PM.
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  7. #22
    14 Time Rita's Champion SUPERECWFAN1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by n8twing View Post
    Potsie is a great example... but from the same show, you also had Ritchie's girlfriend, Laurie-Beth. They kept her on the show, even though she had no real attachment to any other character... often given bit parts like reading a letter from Ritchie. They tried to give her stuff to do, including a wedding to Ritchie wherein Fonz stood in as the proxy groom (Ron Howard didn't even appear for the wedding episode!) and later, she even had Ritchie's baby. Sh later disappeared from the canvas entirely.
    With Laurie Beth they were trying to hold some connection to Ritchie onm the show. Because I'm sure producers thought Ron Howard may return at some point and they can continue where things left off. But by the 2nd season (1981-1982) I'm sure they realized it wasn't gonna happen and they really had nothing left for her.

    If we remember the show seemed to go through a big shakeup direction wise when Howard and Most left. They were trying to think of a new direction for Fonzie as a character in this time. He became a teacher with Roger Phillips . That lasted like a season , then they decided ...hey lets have Fonze try and settle down with a divorced single mom. That too didn't last long.

    It was a show that for 7 years had a direction once Fonze and Ritchie clicked as a friendship. Then it went to shit as they struggled to find ways for it to work after they left.


    Laverne & Shirley faced a similar problem when Cindy Williams left the show in the last season, making it very odd for Laverne -- but most notably leaving Carmine with little to do, since his main role was as Shirley's boyfriend.
    Yeah I agree here...it was a very odd shakeup move to do. They really didn't have that other cast member to help handle the load with Laverne. To be that partner like Shirley was.

    Of course the fact Williams basically told them she was leaving seemed to be a quick solution they had. She married a guy in the army and moved within an episode. Carmine , the guy who was always her on again/off again boyfriend was left .

    On wiki its claimed the producers were trying to get a tv series focused around Carmine moving to Brooklyn where his family is and him trying to make it on Broadway. The show had a backdoor pilot that aired that final season (I believe it was actually the final episode of Laverne and Shirley) and it wasn't picked up.

    So I can see the producers saw that Carmine really didn't have a role on that show anymore , so lets do a spinoff with him.
    "Heads up-- If Havok's position in UA #5 really upset you, it's time to drown yourself hobo piss. Seriously, do it. It's the only solution." - Rick Remender

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  8. #23
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    @SUPERCWFAN,

    Yup, you're correct with Laurie-Beth and Happy Days on a whole. The show changed so many times... the first two seasons were inspired by "American Graffiti" and centered on Ritchie's coming of age, along with Potsie and Ralph. But in the third season, when the show was taped in front of a studio audience, they saw the wild reactions Fonz got, and the show shifted to Ritchie/Fonz/Cunninghams.

    The show shifted again after Ritchie left, leaving Fonz to anchor it... along with budding hearth-throb Chachi and Joannie. Then, it seemed like directions shifted every season.... Fonz and the divorced mom for one season, Joannie & Chachi left for their own spin-off leaving Jenny Picaclo and cousin KC to pick up the teen-storyline slack. And Roger was a sorta-replacement for Ritchie, but not.

    Mork & Mindy was another one.... four seasons, and every season gave us a brand-new supporting cast shift, with Mork & Mindy at the center.

    With Laverne & Shirley, stars Penny Marshall and Cindy Williams were feuding on-set constantly. Since Penny's relative was producer Garry Marshall, I guess that didnt leave Cindy Williams with much leverage. After agreeing to do another season, Williams abrubtly left. Check out Betty Garrett discussing the end of the show, and why her character, Mrs. Babbish, was abruptly written out... and why they went an extra season that probably shouldn't have happened:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=23EXP28YhEs

    That last season is a train wreck... the plots centered around weird character cast pairings. It was still called "Laverne & Shirley", but it was just Laverne.... and only Squiggy shared an opening-credits name check (why not Lenny too? baffling!).... watch the final season credits and see how odd the show looked with Laverne and no Shirley:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7hkGxU8slBg

    And, they should have just married Carmine & Shirley and figured out an in-story reason why Shirley was "absent" (sick relative?) Carmine was probably the weakest character on the show, and trying to give him a spinoff is an insane thought.

    Still, that's what they did. The last episode (in which neither Laverne nor Shirley appeared), Carmine was set up for his own spin-off. Here's the un-illustrious last-scene send-off:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G_h6QEWHLPs

    horrible!
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  9. #24
    14 Time Rita's Champion SUPERECWFAN1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by n8twing View Post
    With Laverne & Shirley, stars Penny Marshall and Cindy Williams were feuding on-set constantly. Since Penny's relative was producer Garry Marshall, I guess that didnt leave Cindy Williams with much leverage. After agreeing to do another season, Williams abrubtly left. Check out Betty Garrett discussing the end of the show, and why her character, Mrs. Babbish, was abruptly written out... and why they went an extra season that probably shouldn't have happened:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=23EXP28YhEs
    Its pretty true that Laverne and Shirley should have ended at 7. But I believe that Penny Marshall likely may have fibbed there about Cindy wanting another season. Because at that point she was pregnant and felt the producers were trying to ease her out of the show. (common sense would have been...Carmine gets Shirley pregnant , he moves into apartment ...you keep the same dynamic , just add him to the mix)

    Also the fact that Garrett did what basically Don Knotts did with Andy Griffith Show. Andy never told Knotts he was gonna change his mind and do a 6th season. Knotts felt the show was gonna end and when Disney handed him a movie contract , he signed it. Only later he was told (and regretted ...he loved the show a lot) that the show was going forward.

    Knotts came back when he could. The show seemed to handle his exit better than Laverne and Shirley producers gave a thought to with established characters.

    That last season is a train wreck... the plots centered around weird character cast pairings. It was still called "Laverne & Shirley", but it was just Laverne.... and only Squiggy shared an opening-credits name check (why not Lenny too? baffling!).... watch the final season credits and see how odd the show looked with Laverne and no Shirley:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7hkGxU8slBg
    Ok that is weird. I do think...at the time McKean had left Laverne and Shirley as well. Because he seemed to move into doing "This is Spinal Tap". On wiki its claimed he left in 1982.

    That final season happened I think due to the fact ABC saw that the show was still a top 20 show. It had actually went up a ratings point to finish in the top 20. Of course the ABC era of the late 1970's/early 80's had ABC 1# among the networks.

    But its hard remaining number #1. If the new shows don't deliver and the older ones start to fade. By 1983 , ABC was clearly fading. Happy Days was running its course in another season. Its Marshall shows were all gone by 1984. Love Boat , Fantasy Island and others were also either dead or fading too.


    And, they should have just married Carmine & Shirley and figured out an in-story reason why Shirley was "absent" (sick relative?) Carmine was probably the weakest character on the show, and trying to give him a spinoff is an insane thought.

    Still, that's what they did. The last episode (in which neither Laverne nor Shirley appeared), Carmine was set up for his own spin-off. Here's the un-illustrious last-scene send-off:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G_h6QEWHLPs

    horrible!

    Well he was the last character they really had left to do a supposed spin-off. Had they not broken up Frank and Edna , the 2 moving back to Milwalkee and raising Edna's grand kids (with guest appearances of Shirley) likely was a plan. But once they went where they did , they didn't have another direction to go.

    That spin-off seems to be trying a male Laverne & Shirley combination with Carmine. To make it about 2 friends who pursue careers and have wacky adventures.

    Also ABC may have thought ...we have a top rated 20 show. Its in its 8th season and we could possibly last as long as Happy Days . Plus our network needs this show to last. They never saw the A-Team as being competition from NBC.
    "Heads up-- If Havok's position in UA #5 really upset you, it's time to drown yourself hobo piss. Seriously, do it. It's the only solution." - Rick Remender

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  10. #25

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    Quote Originally Posted by n8twing View Post
    @SUPERCWFAN,

    Yup, you're correct with Laurie-Beth and Happy Days on a whole. The show changed so many times... the first two seasons were inspired by "American Graffiti" and centered on Ritchie's coming of age, along with Potsie and Ralph.
    Minor nitpick: Happy Days actually preceded American Graffiti, not the other way around:

    http://voices.yahoo.com/happy-days-w...e-1358883.html

  11. #26
    True heavyweight wrassler Jeremy A. Patterson's Avatar
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    Cindy Snow WAS an odd example!

    Jeremy Aron Patterson.

  12. #27
    Marked for Redemption David Walton's Avatar
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    The transition from Peter Parker to Ben Reilly as "the one true Spider-Man" made for some interesting complications. It was difficult to keep the Daily Bugle on as the supporting cast. They hinted at Ben still having feelings for Betty Brant, but that never really went anywhere before the whole thing went down in flames.
    Last edited by David Walton; 01-26-2012 at 09:11 AM.
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  13. #28
    Scary lady Chris Lang's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Theophilus View Post
    The transition from Peter Parker to Ben Reilly as "the one true Spider-Man" made for some interesting complications. It was difficult to keep the Daily Bugle on as the supporting cast. They hinted at Ben still having feelings for Betty Brant, but that never really went anywhere before the whole thing went down in flames.
    Betty Brant, as a whole, is a character that the writers have really struggled to keep 'relevant' to the Spider-stories. Over the past few decades, she's been sort of 'in and out'. She's faded into the background for a while, only to turn up as an important part of stories again. After her husband's death, she found herself part of the 'Cult of Love' run by a phony guru. After she recovered from that, she and Flash Thompson fought demons during Inferno.

    Probably the strongest use of her that I can remember in the past 20 years would be her role in the 'Hobgoblin Lives' mini-series, where she's one of the principle investigators trying to find out the truth behind the Hobgoblin. By doing so, she intends to find out the whole story behind her husband's death, and thus gain some closure.
    Last edited by Chris Lang; 01-27-2012 at 06:54 AM.

  14. #29
    True heavyweight wrassler Jeremy A. Patterson's Avatar
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    What other such examples are there?

    Jeremy.

  15. #30
    Scary lady Chris Lang's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeremy A. Patterson View Post
    What other such examples are there?

    Jeremy.
    Another Spider-Man supporting character: John Jameson.

    Introduced as J. Jonah Jameson's astronaut son (who Jameson would praise as 'the REAL hero, unlike that phoney Spider-Man'), there are times when he's pretty much been irrelevant, and the writers have to give him just about anything to do. I can't remember how he ended up working at Ravencroft (the Spider-comics equivalent to Arkham Asylum), but it gave him something to do.

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