Hellmail Updates

[Middenway]

From BPRD Hell on Earth: Gods #3
Here's the highlights:

• Mike definitely has plans to draw more. In fact, he's drawing comics now. Expect him to pop up in the new Dark Horse Presents before long, and stand by for news of whole new comics coming from him in the near future.
• The next Baltimore miniseries starts in August.

[shyrka]

Great news! Thanks!

[Angilas-Man]

I'm glad Dark Horse Presents is going to be bi-monthly. With new Concrete, Beasts of Burden, and whatever Mike's doing it seems each issue (with its $8 price tag) is going to be a must buy.

[Middenway]

From the Hellmail in Being Human it sounds like we'll be getting more (or something like it) of those backups from The Wild Hunt about Koshchei and the Baba Yaga.

Scott Allie:
We do intend to do more like that; we're just not sure when.

Something to look forward to.

[Neil Hill]

From the Hellmail in Being Human it sounds like we'll be getting more (or something like it) of those backups from The Wild Hunt about Koshchei and the Baba Yaga.Something to look forward to.

As much as I love the art on the various Mignolaverse books I've never really cared for the back-up story format. These have always seemed like merely a device to give the main artist some breathing room rather than have them create a full 32 page comic or simply to fill space otherwise. Also, add to this the fact that I don't really care for the anthology format and it's a perfect storm of factors that turn me off to these.

That being said, I can hardly complain when we get stories as beautiful albeit brief as Koschei the Deathless, Killer in my Skull, etc. You'd never have to twist my arm to want to see these. I just wish they were as stories of their own in their own book with a single artist rather than stapled to whatever the main story is in another book. Sorry, probably not a very popular opinion in this forum, but it's the truth for me.

[Kees_L]

From the Hellmail in Being Human it sounds like we'll be getting more (or something like it) of those backups from The Wild Hunt about Koshchei and the Baba Yaga.Something to look forward to.

As much as I love the art on the various Mignolaverse books I've never really cared for the back-up story format. These have always seemed like merely a device to give the main artist some breathing room rather than have them create a full 32 page comic or simply to fill space otherwise. Also, add to this the fact that I don't really care for the anthology format and it's a perfect storm of factors that turn me off to these.

That being said, I can hardly complain when we get stories as beautiful albeit brief as Koschei the Deathless, Killer in my Skull, etc. You'd never have to twist my arm to want to see these. I just wish they were as stories of their own in their own book with a single artist rather than stapled to whatever the main story is in another book. Sorry, probably not a very popular opinion in this forum, but it's the truth for me.

But Neil, wouldn't that be like looking at it from a hindsight or backwards perspective a bit?
Breathing room for the main artist would be of use I'd think?
Plus any opportunities - even bonus ones - for getting cool stories done and out there wouldn't seem very wrong to me?

I mean I could see how you would feel to be preferring stories as remaining main, instead of forming chopped up or (seemingly) cropped backup features. But at the same time I can like how stories even hold up as such.
And one shouldn't forget that if it hadn't been for some sort of convenience or free space presenting itself, than those stories wouldn't even get made at all?! Since comics get made from filling up pages pretty evenly, with every pageturner of cliffhanger at just exactly the right time? Where stories may logically prove to not be filling up issues perfectly?
And where in fact dragging stuff on for getting stuff to fit would be much more of a "faux-pas" (which is French speak, which is something I don't do normally) more than just to add a whole other cool story on its own, albeit in bits if required?
And as creatively, the backup-material would require some sort of sidestep from what would be main, so it wouldn't necessarily be like 'otherwise main stories getting demoted into forming backup stuff'? (I think this to be my point so lemme underline it for ya... )

What I also like of backups getting done is just the format of it: sure it's chopped up, but it adds such a comic-y richness to my reading: multiple or extra stories for just the normal price!

And anthologies are again platforms or opportunities created for stuff to get appreciated which otherwise wouldn't get invested into as much: The Dark Horse Books Of.... present prestigeous both as newly appreciatable stuff, next to eachother. That's the thing about them I'd think?
If it weren't for those, both as how mr Mike always seems to be teaming up with particular talents personally, I might for variety have missed the coolness of like Dorkin & Thompson's Beasts Of Burden for instance.

Stuff like the backups and the Hellmail letter section or the anthologies or even the editor/creator comments will be why I favour Dark Horse, in as profoundly a way as simply the quality of their books would be.

[Middenway]

As much as I love the art on the various Mignolaverse books I've never really cared for the back-up story format. These have always seemed like merely a device to give the main artist some breathing room rather than have them create a full 32 page comic or simply to fill space otherwise. Also, add to this the fact that I don't really care for the anthology format and it's a perfect storm of factors that turn me off to these.

I can see where you're coming from. Filler for filler's sake is never good and always feels a bit cheap.

But I like the format, especially when the back-up story is a long story. Some of my favourite stories (Tintin, Asterix and Hellboy's The Corpse) were written in installments, and it's a huge part of what gives those stories momentum. I'd love to see a long-form story (more than two issues worth of material) told that way, a few pages (or even just a single page) at a time, just to see what unfolds.

Ever since his serialised Kamandi story, I'd like to see Ryan Sook doing this sort of story. There's just something about the restrctions of the format that makes the storyteller become more inventive. And some characters, like Lobster Johnson, just seem to fit that format perfectly.

[Kees_L]

I can see where you're coming from. Filler for filler's sake is never good and always feels a bit cheap.

But I like the format, especially when the back-up story is a long story. Some of my favourite stories (Tintin, Asterix and Hellboy's The Corpse) were written in installments, and it's a huge part of what gives those stories momentum. I'd love to see a long-form story (more than two issues worth of material) told that way, a few pages (or even just a single page) at a time, just to see what unfolds.

Ever since his serialised Kamandi story, I'd like to see Ryan Sook doing this sort of story. There's just something about the restrctions of the format that makes the storyteller become more inventive. And some characters, like Lobster Johnson, just seem to fit that format perfectly.

What you say about Tin-Tin and Asterix being written in installments is not so, or at least they both developed into becoming standard "bandes dessinees", which would be predominantly full-story books or "albums", roughly 48 page A4 sized albums presented in a series.

Although of course, Tin-Tin, exactly like the very first US comics, evolved from getting presented as a full pages covering special section published into a newspaper, as of 1934.
Unlike US comics, did in Europe the strips or bandes dessinees mainly get offered as either serialized anthology magazines (as installments) or either the aforementioned albums, to be containing complete stories as much as possible.
Full title installments like the US comic-runs didn't get done too much in continental Europe, because installments by themselves would get deemed to feel or prove incomplete. In 'bandes dessinees' people wanna see things conclude as "FIN" instead of "to be continued..."
Often however, like in the books of Jean Giraud aka Moebius, or Goscinny's Asterix & Obelix, it would get specified that however 'fin' would mean 'fin', new adventures would get soon available.

[Middenway]

No, Tintin was originally serialised as two pages every week (roughly equates to one page of the current albums) from Tintin in the Land of the Soviets through to The Land of Black Gold. Then it was serialised in a daily format as 4cm high strips from The Crab with the Golden Claws through to The Seven Crystal Balls. After that they were serialised in Tintin Magazine, though I'm not sure of the details of that. But it was a serialised format.

As for Asterix, I was under the impression that the earlier stories were serialised in a magazine too, but I don't know for sure. I just assumed because that was the standard practice of that era in France. I'd have to look it up.

But I know my Tintin. A vast majority, right up to at least The Calculus Affair were serialised. That story had to adapt the original serialised A3 sized pages to A4 sized pages for the final album. It's the last I know of that did that. The others were still released in Tintin Magazine first as installments, but I think it was only after the entire book was completed, so the serialisation format had a lot less impact on the way the story was told.

UPDATE: Asterix was serialised in Pilote from the beginning through to 1973.

[Kees_L]

But I know my Tintin.

UPDATE: Asterix was serialised in Pilote from the beginning through to 1973.

Of course you may see things the way you like, but I said they developed into being what they'd be, which would be full-story 48 page A4 albums.

An enormous boom happened during the seventies when real shops began selling those albums. Before that the only possible way for strip publishers to get their stuff to the masses would be magazines, sold at newsstands or tobacco/betting shops.

Eventhough those magazines got published as such, won't mean that such would be the best liked or most suitable format.

As of the seventies and eighties the albums defined all the bandes dessinee stuff into how they're regarded nowadays.
Note how there is no resale value to most of the Strip magazines: they aren't sold at cons or stripshops anywhere eversince the eighties - not even in France, not in Belgium and not in Holland.

Fifteen years ago I found my favorite Moebius cover of an original Metal Hurlant issue at a flea market in a French village which I bought for 3 francs which is like 1 USD.
Some of the Moebius albums go for +$100 nowadays.

And although I never read much Tin-Tin I did read a few, plus all the Asterix's and I never ever witnessed any perceivable stylistic or narrative constructs resulting from having having gotten published in installments initially.

Like I said, I really think the magazine won't be a real format of itself: that's just publishers trying to getting their stuff read, in such a way that only magazine subscriptions would allow getting the stories published and sold in a complete and consistent fashion.

Once the stripshops and comicshops emerged, all that became redundant when the complete books became to be selling better. Would be my take.

[Kees_L]

I think I understand what you mean about cool intricate narrative approaches servicing format restrictions, like Ryan Sook's Kamandi for the DC Wednesday Comics.

It is my impression that "team Hellboy" have been proving the absolute pinnacle of such since the getgo.

Mr Mike has been inventive and full-on inspiringly creative in exploring or incorporating any thinkable story-approach or formative presentation into Hellboy or either even stuff besides that.
From short stories and newspapery-special page layouts to mini-series to maxi-series both as mini backups and larger backups, both as introducing the epilogue into like a standard approach. Or even page-long features on legendary dudes such as Wellman.

Other inventive guys were given the opportunity to play with stuff such as Guy Davis on LoJo the moviestar or Koschei, or Gary Gianni - being The Prince of Newspaper Strip stuff both as illustrated tales!!

Baltimore the novel seems for a format to be garnering towards a more pulp-novel kind of thing: more wordy but still ruthless or something like that, while in the Corben stuff things seem to get made for showcasing the weirdly fleshy whacky sense of that...

So I'm sort of thinking that the whole Hellboy & Co. have got the whole inventive format diversity thing sort of covered, in a big way, like a leading or exemplary way.

Although I would reckon that Hellboy: the Corpse & the Iron Shoes would have been made for the format of a single comic issue, not the two page photocopied feature in that comic publisher advertisement magazine.
I mean the standalone comic looks perfect for a format to me, way better than what I see in the Comics Advance #75 etc. I wouldn't say the pages seem made for two-page serialisation at all, personally.

And Middenway: you should look into Gary Gianni and Mark Schultz their stuff such as Prince Valiant if you haven't already.
It showcases all the inventive approachin' for old strips in a major way, doing Hal Foster and Alex Raymond proud I'm sure. John Fleskes / Flesk Publications has a nice site for books like those, I recommend it.

[Middenway]

Don't get me wrong, I prefer the collected versions of the stories too, but I think sometimes imposed restrictions can really unlocked the inventiveness of the author. It's one of the reasons I feel The Corpse is such a pivotal book.

As for Tintin, well Hergé drew those comics for ten years where every second page had to have a cliffhanger. Then along came World War II and forced him into a new format, much smaller with only about four panels in each strip. But he rose to the challenge, and that challenge made him a better writer. By the end of the war, his stories were much tighter.

Of course, Mike Mignola is doing this all the time. His stories are told in such a variety of formats, I think it's part of the reason the Hellboy Universe never got stale. After all, the demands of an eight-page comic are very different to that of a six-issue miniseries.

Plus I just want Ryan Sook on interiors again, and I think he could do something really interesting with the format.

[Neil Hill]

Don't get me wrong, I prefer the collected versions of the stories too, but I think sometimes imposed restrictions can really unlocked the inventiveness of the author. It's one of the reasons I feel The Corpse is such a pivotal book.

As for Tintin, well Hergé drew those comics for ten years where every second page had to have a cliffhanger. Then along came World War II and forced him into a new format, much smaller with only about four panels in each strip. But he rose to the challenge, and that challenge made him a better writer. By the end of the war, his stories were much tighter.

Of course, Mike Mignola is doing this all the time. His stories are told in such a variety of formats, I think it's part of the reason the Hellboy Universe never got stale. After all, the demands of an eight-page comic are very different to that of a six-issue miniseries.

Plus I just want Ryan Sook on interiors again, and I think he could do something really interesting with the format.

I like what you've said here, Middenway. I have nothing in particular to add that you haven't already articulated quite well, but I did want to say...here, here!

[Kees_L]

Don't get me wrong, I prefer the collected versions of the stories too, but I think sometimes imposed restrictions can really unlocked the inventiveness of the author. It's one of the reasons I feel The Corpse is such a pivotal book.

As for Tintin, well Hergé drew those comics for ten years where every second page had to have a cliffhanger. Then along came World War II and forced him into a new format, much smaller with only about four panels in each strip. But he rose to the challenge, and that challenge made him a better writer. By the end of the war, his stories were much tighter.

Of course, Mike Mignola is doing this all the time. His stories are told in such a variety of formats, I think it's part of the reason the Hellboy Universe never got stale. After all, the demands of an eight-page comic are very different to that of a six-issue miniseries.

Plus I just want Ryan Sook on interiors again, and I think he could do something really interesting with the format.

Well, sure, Hergé got to have the luxurious positition of garnering an audience to his stuff, with even showing lots of creativity and inventiveness and innovativeness even, likely.

Same as Mignola and Ryan Sook will be pretty swell as well.


But yeah, lots of creators might, should they get the chance to, or be to give others opportunity to such.
But youknow, I guess they just would if they would. Not much the outside world or audiences could be doing towards such - which reminds me about that asparagus story, you know that?

About a bunch of asparagus, cheering on one of their own, like going:
"Come on Gus! Be inventive again, like we know you can! Be special, just like you was before!"

And Gus sought and took center-stage and he did this amazing feat, like nobody ever saw before.

And the asparagus went: "nah man, not that. Do what you did last time!"
"You should do only exactly that! Now do it."

And Gus looked like he was smelling onions peeled.
And then everybody went to stew and boil.

And the asparagus said: "Aw man. Remember that guy, the special one? Now he was something, back when everything hadn't yet gone to soup." But it did.

Fin.

[Middenway]

Dude, that story was awesome.