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  1. #271
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    A lot of comments here that I skipped over so sorry if someone said this already. Take a look at Alan's work. How much of it is based on characters created by someone else? Alan comes across as hypocritical.

    That being said, I do think the idea of any Watchmen spin-offs are bad ideas that will never get any of my money. Just let it stand as is.
    "The most merciful thing in the world . . . is the inability of the human mind to correlate all its contents."
    H.P. Lovecraft

  2. #272
    the bandit diablo7's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mmurphy1968 View Post
    A lot of comments here that I skipped over so sorry if someone said this already. Take a look at Alan's work. How much of it is based on characters created by someone else? Alan comes across as hypocritical.

    That being said, I do think the idea of any Watchmen spin-offs are bad ideas that will never get any of my money. Just let it stand as is.
    Moore was talking about writers coming up with new story ideas and concepts not new characters.

  3. #273
    New Member ihewlett's Avatar
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    Default Man, Moore really?

    I agree with the previous posts citing Moore's hypocrisy - what the heck is an original idea? Watchmen was based on previous superheroes, Swamp Thing was a creation of Len Wein, et al - AND he rips off tons of classic literature for his League of Extraordinary Gentlemen. Everything previously created (what would any of the classic authors think of LoEG?) - so maybe Moore should just say what he really means - he doesn't want anyone else messing with things he did (like perhaps Robert Louis Stevenson would think of Moore?)

    I'd be mad if I was Jason as well. As for knocking the reprints of Marvelman - well, I think Doctor Jekyll and Mr. Hyde still gets "reprinted" as well. Swamp Thing became way more interesting when Moore reinvented a previous property. Who could say that someone couldn't do that with one of the characters from Watchmen (like why would a genius make a fake space monster - that is pretty damn lame). Moore was just being a contrary ass and Aaron has called him out on it. Kudos.

  4. #274
    the bandit diablo7's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ihewlett View Post
    I agree with the previous posts citing Moore's hypocrisy - what the heck is an original idea? Watchmen was based on previous superheroes, Swamp Thing was a creation of Len Wein, et al - AND he rips off tons of classic literature for his League of Extraordinary Gentlemen. Everything previously created (what would any of the classic authors think of LoEG?) - so maybe Moore should just say what he really means - he doesn't want anyone else messing with things he did (like perhaps Robert Louis Stevenson would think of Moore?)

    I'd be mad if I was Jason as well. As for knocking the reprints of Marvelman - well, I think Doctor Jekyll and Mr. Hyde still gets "reprinted" as well. Swamp Thing became way more interesting when Moore reinvented a previous property. Who could say that someone couldn't do that with one of the characters from Watchmen (like why would a genius make a fake space monster - that is pretty damn lame). Moore was just being a contrary ass and Aaron has called him out on it. Kudos.
    So you'd be mad over nothing too. Alan moore never called anyone out and says they suck. He said if there were a-list writers then they wouldn't be wanting to write prequels and sequels of the watchman. His point was basically what ellis, powell, niles and kirkman have been saying the industry needs new ideas and concepts not rehashing of old stories and plots.

    Moore didn't create swampthing, marvelman or captain britain but he introduced new ideas, concepts and characters into those books. Watchmen was supposed to have the charlton characters in it but when moore couldn't use them he created new characters. Go read some of those old comics them compare them to what moore created, they are very different. Why would someone want to write a book with watchmen characters? Swampthing was a series that was ongoing and was on the verge of cancellation before moore took over. Loeg is based off of literary works but has anyone made a super hero team out of them? Its a new idea which is what moore was talking about new ideas. The moore is a hypocrite is as off as saying powell's video is saying f the man, super heroes are bad and all creators working for the big 2 are being raped.

  5. #275
    New Member ihewlett's Avatar
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    Default Yeah You made my point

    Quote Originally Posted by diablo7 View Post
    So you'd be mad over nothing too. Alan moore never called anyone out and says they suck. He said if there were a-list writers then they wouldn't be wanting to write prequels and sequels of the watchman. His point was basically what ellis, powell, niles and kirkman have been saying the industry needs new ideas and concepts not rehashing of old stories and plots.

    Moore didn't create swampthing, marvelman or captain britain but he introduced new ideas, concepts and characters into those books. Watchmen was supposed to have the charlton characters in it but when moore couldn't use them he created new characters. Go read some of those old comics them compare them to what moore created, they are very different. Why would someone want to write a book with watchmen characters? Swampthing was a series that was ongoing and was on the verge of cancellation before moore took over. Loeg is based off of literary works but has anyone made a super hero team out of them? Its a new idea which is what moore was talking about new ideas. The moore is a hypocrite is as off as saying powell's video is saying f the man, super heroes are bad and all creators working for the big 2 are being raped.
    You made my point in a way. Moore introduced new ideas in established settings - who is to say that a current author would not do the same to Watchmen characters. That's the hypocrisy - that HE can work off of established franchises and create something new and interesting but a sequel to anything he has done could NOT be new and interesting. He discounts the new work in different comics genres and backhands the current creative community in his zeal to knock the corporations. I don't care that the Charlton heroes were crap and he recreated them and made something cool. I'm saying that other creators from the post-Moore world can make cool stuff with established characters. Great work is ALWAYS rare - even back when Moore was making Watchmen and V. And V is heavily influenced by Orwell - in fact I'd even say that V would be knocked for that in today's environment. I still love Moore's work but he is just a man - as flawed as any other men. Aaron's reaction may be a bit too visceral but that's his craft and his future potential or any of his buddies. I'm not saying that Aaron's work is currently better than Moore. But someone's work COULD be. Even with a Watchmen character. Just like Moore did in his heyday.

  6. #276
    the bandit diablo7's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ihewlett View Post
    You made my point in a way. Moore introduced new ideas in established settings - who is to say that a current author would not do the same to Watchmen characters. That's the hypocrisy - that HE can work off of established franchises and create something new and interesting but a sequel to anything he has done could NOT be new and interesting. He discounts the new work in different comics genres and backhands the current creative community in his zeal to knock the corporations. I don't care that the Charlton heroes were crap and he recreated them and made something cool. I'm saying that other creators from the post-Moore world can make cool stuff with established characters. Great work is ALWAYS rare - even back when Moore was making Watchmen and V. And V is heavily influenced by Orwell - in fact I'd even say that V would be knocked for that in today's environment. I still love Moore's work but he is just a man - as flawed as any other men. Aaron's reaction may be a bit too visceral but that's his craft and his future potential or any of his buddies. I'm not saying that Aaron's work is currently better than Moore. But someone's work COULD be. Even with a Watchmen character. Just like Moore did in his heyday.
    I can think of 3 writers that could do a watchmen sequel or prequel justice but any writer's work would be compared to moore's no matter how good it is. Honestly I doubt he knows who aaron is or any other writer that has come into the industry in the last 15 years since he doesn't read mainstream books. Yes he took a knock at the dc but he didn't take a run at any creators or took a jab at the different comic genres. Ivan brandon and b. clay moore doesn't think he did either. Its only people, whether fans or creative people, who misinterpreted his interview or see truth behind it that have go upset and want to tell moore f you. If you look there's not a lot of watchmen or even marvelman level of work out there, not saying there can't be. If that kind of work comes up it probably won't be at the big 2, it'll be a creator owned book where the writers can take chances. Morrison did it with flex mentallo and casey did it with automatic kafka.

  7. #277
    New Member parabolee's Avatar
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    Alan Moore is right. Stay the hell away from Watchmen. And his point is that the current writers could and should be creating new original characters and stories not recycling old ones that were never meant to exists outside what he created.

    Also he said it would be insulting to suggest there are not talented writers worthy of creating great new stuff. This guy (don't care what his name is, he's a nobody to me) is just a whiney oversensitive child that is too worried that he somehow as been insulted to see the point.

    Making new Watchmen comics without Moore's approval would be blasphemy, and virtually NOBODY wants it to happen.

    EDIT: Ooops old topic, I just came across the news item. Didn't mean to drag this back up.

  8. #278
    Senior Member Eumenides's Avatar
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    The difference in tone couldn't be more staggering:

    Alan Moore's interviews are always intelligent, erudite and provocative. He can easily talk about linguistics, art, literature, science politics, history, magic; I don't think there's a topic he's not knowledgeable about. In that regard, his interviews are comparable only to the interviews of writers like Umberto Eco, Jorge Luis Borges, Josť Saramago; in the comics industry, perhaps only Grant Morrison comes across as intelligent and refined.

    Then there's the other side of the comic book creators, who come off across as retarded man-children in most interviews: incapable of critical thinking, always brown-nosing their bosses, only capable of talking about comics, not even the comics medium, just comic stories; as an example of this type I offer you Jason Aaron's profanity-ridden, inarticulate rant. In any other medium an authority like Moore would be heard, respected and analysed for the wisdom of his words. But this is comics, the medium where so-called fans have only contempt for creators and always side with the publishers trying to short-change the creators.

    Jason Aaron writes a creator-owned comic book for Vertigo. He should thank Moore for that. It was people like Moore who fought hard, decades ago, for little writers like Aaron to have the right to profit from their own creations.

    I wonder: what has Jason Aaron done to change comics?

  9. #279

  10. #280

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    Alan Moore: Watchmen, From Hell, Promethea etc etc etc

    Complains about an industry still recycling and reducing his ideas, in lieu of any ideas of their own.

    Jason Aaron: Wolverine and his awesome pointy klwas etc etc etc

    Complains that he (Aaron) bought some comics he enjoyed. And Alan Moore never even wrote him a "thank you" note, the ungrateful bastard.


    Moore wins.

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