BPRD Hardcover

[Kees_L]

I figure if you're asking if you can jump ahead, then you probably already know the answer, whatever that may be. Basically, if you can skip an entire season of a TV show and jump in after having read an online summary and be satisfied, you'll be fine.

But I don't think it's good advice to tell someone to just jump ahead, you'll be fine, without considering they may be a very different kind of reader to you.

But here we're talking people asking whether they can read any of the books available to them, despite such being to mean not all of the books completely yet, aren't we?

And asterisks pointing to "plot-points" - how often does that happen? I would think most usually asterisks denote in which title somebody or something appeared or got mentioned before - but not as proving too vital to the plot of the story-at-hand?
And it will be good to be aware how Hellboy's own perspective would be or not for an event, but the question is: would such get necessarily spoiled, by reading stuff out of order for a first time?
I certainly would not think so, since any new reading of titles fitting any kind of an order, might bring about new perspectives or takes or reading experiences for me.
(This is why) I'd feel people shouldn't feel too skiddish about spoiling the reading for themselves.

[Middenway]

And it will be good to be aware how Hellboy's own perspective would be or not for an event, but the question is: would such get necessarily spoiled, by reading stuff out of order for a first time?
I certainly would not think so, since any new reading of titles fitting any kind of an order, might bring about new perspectives or takes or reading experiences for me.
(This is why) I'd feel people shouldn't feel too skiddish about spoiling the reading for themselves.

Precisely my point. You are one kind of reader I am another. My point was not that you can't read the stories out of order (quite the contrary) but that for some readers it is not satisfying to do so. If someone asks you if they can jump ahead, what they are really asking is, "Would it spoil it for me?" My point is simply that before you can answer, you should first determine what they would consider a spoiler. What you consider a spoiler or a satisfying reading experience is not a universal truth.

[Kees_L]

Precisely my point. You are one kind of reader I am another. My point was not that you can't read the stories out of order (quite the contrary) but that for some readers it is not satisfying to do so. If someone asks you if they can jump ahead, what they are really asking is, "Would it spoil it for me?" My point is simply that before you can answer, you should first determine what they would consider a spoiler. What you consider a spoiler or a satisfying reading experience is not a universal truth.

Indeed I perfectly agree: (personal) opinions (on personal reading experiences) are not universal truths, of course not (?!).

I will only welcome your or anybody's points. May they stand tall.

I would never be forcing my own opinions or thoughts onto others. Plus my aim would never be to simply be disagreeing.

But in my post I was agreeing in part to somebody's personal opinion (the part of which I quoted) on personal reading experiences, with trying to convey what my very own personal opinion would be having to be, concerning what will be personal reading experiences.

And where you in your opinion might come to be advising: watch out with how you read,
I would in my opinion be saying the opposite, namely: read away, anything you may get your hands on - and if it wouldn't work just try again with other or more complete titles. Won't spoil nothing, as long as one would be trying again as one's comic collection would be becoming to grow?

As that might be a thing for comics: the most available titles would be the newest ones, with some others (like the first one for a jumping-on-point) potentially not always there up for grabs?

[Jelio]

Precisely my point. You are one kind of reader I am another. My point was not that you can't read the stories out of order (quite the contrary) but that for some readers it is not satisfying to do so. If someone asks you if they can jump ahead, what they are really asking is, "Would it spoil it for me?" My point is simply that before you can answer, you should first determine what they would consider a spoiler. What you consider a spoiler or a satisfying reading experience is not a universal truth.

I agree with Middenway on this

[Bosco685]

It really depends what kind of reader you are. I've always been a far of long-form stories and I get a great deal of satisfaction out of seeing story elements evolve. Reading the stories out of publishing order destroys this.

I used to be a jump-ahead reader when I would pick up my orders infrequently, which would contain one-two books ahead in the story. It would kill the thrill later of reading the entire story in order, and having that first-time exciting feeling.

This is not to be confused with those read-comics-upside-down types. That's a category of people I just don't understand.

[Gary_B]

I don't think there is any approach you are "supposed" to take. I'd read them in what ever order you can get your hands on them, but continuity isn't a concern of mine. I got into comics in the early 80s after buying a handful of X-Men, New Mutants and Thor comics. One of the X-Men comics I bought that day was the death of Phoenix issue. Over the next couple of years I got into buying back issues and eventually got about 80 comics back from that event but I filled it in here and there before having a consecutive run. It never occured to me to wait until I had them all to go ahead and read them, I just read them as I aquired them and I don't remember feeling that I got spoiled or that the reading experience would have been richer if I had read them all chronologically.

Reading the stories out of their publishing order would diminish the experience for me, but that says less about the books and more about me....

...But I don't think it's good advice to tell someone to just jump ahead, you'll be fine, without considering they may be a very different kind of reader to you.

I understand that reading the books out order would diminish the experience for you but that is not the case with me. Which is why, when I suggested that they can be read in whatever order you acquire them I also said right in the same sentence that continuity isn't important to me. I provided the context and perspective from where I was providing my advice. If continuity is important to someone reading that advice they have the option of following someone else's advice. Sorry if I'm sounding a bit pissy here but it really is okay for both of us to provide opinions even if they are pretty much opposite ones.

[Middenway]

This is not to be confused with those read-comics-upside-down types. That's a category of people I just don't understand.

I can't say I'm familiar with them either.

I understand that reading the books out order would diminish the experience for you but that is not the case with me. Which is why, when I suggested that they can be read in whatever order you acquire them I also said right in the same sentence that continuity isn't important to me. I provided the context and perspective from where I was providing my advice. If continuity is important to someone reading that advice they have the option of following someone else's advice.

I actually didn't have a problem with your comment at all because you made a point of saying continuity wasn't important to you. It's important to establish context and I was glad you put that in.

It was mainly Kees downplaying the extent that the continuity plays in later stories that made me feel the need to say anything. The comment "As much as how any Poe or Conan Doyle story could be read perfectly on its own, will any Hellboy-story and any BPRD-story as well" just seemed a poor comparison. There is continuity in Sherlock Holmes, but it is relatively unimportant to the story compared to BPRD, where there is so much emotional context wrapped up in the continuity. So I felt the need to caution the new readers asking advice so if they did decide to skip ahead, it would be with eyes open. I've been spoiled like this enough times myself, so I just wanted to clarify.

Sorry if I'm sounding a bit pissy here but it really is okay for both of us to provide opinions even if they are pretty much opposite ones.

I never said otherwise. However, I did say, "...I don't think it's good advice to tell someone to just jump ahead, you'll be fine, without considering they may be a very different kind of reader to you." You made a point of saying you weren't concerned with continuity, so you had clearly considered this. I thought your advice was quite helpful.

[Kees_L]

It was mainly Kees downplaying the extent that the continuity plays in later stories that made me feel the need to say anything. The comment "As much as how any Poe or Conan Doyle story could be read perfectly on its own, will any Hellboy-story and any BPRD-story as well" just seemed a poor comparison. There is continuity in Sherlock Holmes, but it is relatively unimportant to the story compared to BPRD, where there is so much emotional context wrapped up in the continuity. So I felt the need to caution the new readers asking advice so if they did decide to skip ahead, it would be with eyes open. I've been spoiled like this enough times myself, so I just wanted to clarify.

Am I downplaying stuff, or am I simply taking another perspective?

I do not aim to downplay anything, like *emotional content* would be one thing, but the meta-continuity bits as far as the RHOD or the Ogdru Jahad or Hyperborea would be something as well, but I do wonder if fully new readers should feel skiddish of spoiling themselves because of such.

Is that allowed? Am I allowed to have my own opinion, Bucky?

I feel that any of the stories do concern themselves mainly and that each complete arc can be read perfectly on its own. You might miss some stuff but if you're new a couple of rereadings over the years will be good anyway.

What I don't get will be the *irrevocable* *irrepairable* spoilings or spoilers. I really don't. I get how some stories shed new lights or provide lead-ins or encores like the Mole and such, or how slight details within the 'actual chronology' would technically be differing from the 'publication order', but should each and every new reader be advised or warned against such? I really don't think so.
Because the fun of leaving some stuff as not quite spelled out, like up in the air, as interpretational for readers themselves, I'd say that would be what shouldn't get spoiled.
To me it seems like saying: Oh yeah if you're gonna be playing Skyrim the video game than that will be good - as long as you make sure to become a Breton warlock enchanter blacksmith, without becoming anything else, because that will give you advantages both as two extra side quests.
When the point of the game would be that mostly anything would be possible, with or without any extra side quests.

[Middenway]

What I don't get will be the *irrevocable* *irrepairable* spoilings or spoilers. I really don't. I get how some stories shed new lights or provide lead-ins or encores like the Mole and such, or how slight details within the 'actual chronology' would technically be differing from the 'publication order', but should each and every new reader be advised or warned against such?

I'm not warning anyone against anything. I never said the stories can't be read out of order, nor did I say they shouldn't be read out of order. I simply said for some readers it is not satisfying to do so, and to exercise caution if they thought they were this kind of reader. This isn't about your opinion versus my opinion. This is about us each offering our own perspectives on the importance of the continuity so that a new reader can make up their own mind, form their own opinion and make an informed choice. That we disagree is completely irrelevant.

And don't call me Bucky.

[Gary_B]

Sorry Middenway. I thought I read judgement and attitude in your reply to me earlier when apparently there was none. I'm okay with us having different opinions too.

[Bosco685]

Too bad we couldn't have a poll on continuity reading vs vignette/self-contained story reading to see where the vote lands.

I was involved in a discussion on another forum concerning Hellboy vs Goon vs Walking Dead, and why Hellboy was not as popular as the other two titles (not that I agree with this assumption). I think part of the reasoning brought to the discussion was market value of early appearances, which to me doesn't always translate to popularity of a title: it just means there are some collectors willing to overpay for what they want.

Some felt the average reader couldn't figure out the continuity of Hellboy as easily as they could Goon and Walking Dead because the latter two were dedicated titles, while the former had quite a few short stories requiring research to understand the continuity fit. I had never looked at it that way before. So there were those feeling the market demand was stronger for Goon and Walking Dead because it was easier to relate to the straight storyline, and collecting pretty much everything on a given title.

It was an interesting viewpoint on why the general market leaned towards one approach to publishing a series, and their money spent being the voice of the customer.

[UnravThreads]

Oh dear, what did I start?

I'll just wait to see what happens with Exorcism, and in the mean time just stuck with the omnibus editions.

[Kees_L]

Oh dear, what did I start?

Please don't feel bad.

Nobody on here should be feeling bad. Would be my opinion.

I mean, one minute we're just discussin' - by which I'd mean 'pleasantly exchanging personal viewpoints or either asking questions, or raising points personally'.

And the next minute all of a sudden it might be that for some or anyone it would appear some of us would somehow be feeling attacked or I don't know what?

All I know is I try to propose my own opinions and viewpoints as plainly and as unthreatening/unhampering to others as possible, with motivating why I would be proposing my viewpoints as how I do, with remaining open to any other views?!
So I feel quite in the dark towards any kind of problems or difficulty to exist or arise because of such?

[Kees_L]

But I don't think it's good advice to tell someone to just jump ahead, you'll be fine, without considering they may be a very different kind of reader to you.

Am I doing that, how you say it, or would I be explaining why I would be reading how I would be reading, strictly as such being my own personal preference?

This isn't about your opinion versus my opinion. This is about us each offering our own perspectives on the importance of the continuity so that a new reader can make up their own mind, form their own opinion and make an informed choice. That we disagree is completely irrelevant.

And don't call me Bucky.

I'm sorry for calling you Bucky. Completely uncalled for.
But I'm getting the feeling you would sort of be accusing me of doing something wrong or harmful, apparently because of not agreeing with you?
I'm not however.
I mean I'm disagreeing with you, but such shouldn't be wrong or harmful towards you, I'd think.

My opinion is not that "people should be aware that for some people or either new readers the Hellboy or BPRD books may propose spoilerific qualities or should in any way be read in any out of the ordinary kind of order".

I have read the books both in publication order, both as "chronological" order, even partly in mixed up orders somewhat on occasion: didn't cause me any sort of problems whatsoever. All the books are numbered and more importantly: any kind of continuity itself is made part of the stories or narrative, for the reader to be found out, like because of how within the stories dates and times are getting mentioned - eversince the earliest publications.
So it would appear to me personally that Hellboy or either BPRD books would basically be readible with no sweat.
Is that such a shitty or weird opinion to have?

[Bosco685]

Oh dear, what did I start?

I'll just wait to see what happens with Exorcism, and in the mean time just stuck with the omnibus editions.

Hey, at least you didn't ask the tough questions like, "Should you dampen your fingers before turning the page in a comic." Now that would have been a knockdown-dragout fight.