Controversial Avengers Opinions

[Frank]

Thanos is too good of a villain to be used in anything but the LAST Avengers movie made EVER.

At least use him in the third or fourth movie. Do the Infinity Gauntlet.

[whiteshark]

Yeah, I agree, that is more editorial's current lazy way of thinking (and of advertising) than anything else. I actually got to enjoy the original Dark Phoenix saga without getting into it in ground zero. I started reading Uncanny X-Men around 112 (when they were facing Magneto), managed to get the back issues up to 109 (Wolverine vs Weapon Alpha), but it was only years later that I maneged to get the issues with Jean Grey's transformation into Phoenix, her saving the Universe, and other early details of the story. For crying out loud, the 80's and 90's are full of fans that became lifers without being around since ground zero, and they didn't have the internet, wikipedia, Essentials, the trade market, etc.. like we do nowadays. I remember Reading at the same time Avengers (around 170), Marvel Triple Action (which was reprinting around 20) and Marvel Super-Action (which was reprinting around 65), and I never got confused, just more curious and anxious to fill out the holes in my knowledge of the team. Everything you need to know about AvsX is exaustingly being rehashed almost everywhere you look (basically, The Phoenix Force is comming to Earth, Cap belives it will destroy it, Cyclops belives it will restar the mutant gene, Hope is belived by both parties to be the host for the PF, the rest are just details. It's not rocket science, nor Shakespeare. Far from it. The way both sides are being so blatantly mischarachterized as to fit the plot, I actully think someone who doesn't have much knowledge of the MU might enjoy it more than someone who does. Honestly, I don't know where this myth that you can't enjoy a comic without knowing the whole continuity and mythology came from.

Peace

I remember the first X-Men stories i read were the ones right before the first issues of Uncanny X-Men,the last issues of X-Men (v1).
And after the next x-men stories i read were the Dark Phoenix saga,and even way back then i did not have to knew the continuity of the x-men characters to get the story.
Thus why i dont see how Avengers vs X-Men can just be read by fans that have read recent marvel events,AvX basics are right in the issue one.
The story of AvX is not a repetition of older stories though,more like a well thought way to have the main super hero teams of marvel clashing with each other with the role of Phonix in this event being intriguing.
I know it have me read more recent x-men stories.

[tommyman]

Because new readers aren't morons and they can handle a different team with different members. Especially since there is a title with the exact team in the movie just in case. There's no need for an entirely homogenous lineup. If that's the case, then the main title, Secret Avengers and other title with "Avengers" in the title should just have the team from the movie to avoid "confusion."

And yet they can't handle a white Nick Fury, or Hawkeye wearing a mask and pirate boots, according to Marvel.
So clearly they disagree with you about Fury and Hawkeye, at least, and it's their opinions that interest me more than yours, since they publish the comics and you don't. (No offense, your opinions are as valid as any other fan's, including mine).

It's clearly inconsistent to go out of your way to shoehorn in some of the movie 'verse but then just go "meh, they'll get why a book about Luke Cage's baby raising problems and Bendis' favourite random characters ties to the franchise".

Give us a Whedonesque Avengers book full of action, and humour that is funny, and you might get new readers.

[Nomads1]

Give us a Whedonesque Avengers book full of action, and humour that is funny, and you might get new readers.

Let's see what will happen after Bendis leaves. Who knows? You might get your wish.

Peace

[RDMacQ]

And yet they can't handle a white Nick Fury, or Hawkeye wearing a mask and pirate boots, according to Marvel.
So clearly they disagree with you about Fury and Hawkeye, at least, and it's their opinions that interest me more than yours, since they publish the comics and you don't. (No offense, your opinions are as valid as any other fan's, including mine).

It's clearly inconsistent to go out of your way to shoehorn in some of the movie 'verse but then just go "meh, they'll get why a book about Luke Cage's baby raising problems and Bendis' favourite random characters ties to the franchise".

Give us a Whedonesque Avengers book full of action, and humour that is funny, and you might get new readers.

OK, just before we continue, is this supposed to be mocking Marvel's policies in changing things to mirror the movies, or is this a legitimate argument against Bendis' contributions to the franchise?

[Nomads1]

So, movie threads continue to dominate the boards. Even the AvsX ones took a beating. Can we talk about something else?

Peace

[Countgate]

So, movie threads continue to dominate the boards. Even the AvsX ones took a beating. Can we talk about something else?

Peace

It's hard when the movie is way superior than the recent Avengers comics.

[tommyman]

OK, just before we continue, is this supposed to be mocking Marvel's policies in changing things to mirror the movies, or is this a legitimate argument against Bendis' contributions to the franchise?

It's genuine confusion about the point of small stuff like Black Nick Fury, Coulson and Ultimate/Movie Hawkeye if one of the books you publish under the Avengers imprint features a cast that is nothing like the movie you are supposed to be lining your books up with (not you, obviously. A rhetorical "you" aimed at Marvel).
Surely they could at least bring in one of the movies heroes, so there would be some sort of reference point for the alleged "new readers".
As it is, you have Wolverine, an X-man, and Spiderman, both in movies but not in THE avengers movie. Then there's a bunch of people no movie goer will know or care about.
They might as well call the book "Movie goers, £$%^ off!", because that is the effect it's likely to have.

I suppose that if Bendis is leaving, (and it seems to be taking a suspiciously long time for him to go), the book may well be cancelled or re-tooled to look like an actual Avengers team.

I suspect Secret Avengers to be nearly as bad for new readers, but at least there you have Hawkeye, and Cap to show it's an Avengers book.

It just seems weird to have all this publicity, all this attention from the enormously successful movie, and to willfully field this obscure unattractive (to movie goers) team under that name.
We know they are quite happy to piss off the comic book buying customers they already had, apparently they intend to continue that trend with any new ones the movie might bring in.
I can hear it now: "if you want Cap/Thor/Hulk/Iron man, you can always go watch the movie again, nobody can take that away from you"

[tommyman]

So, movie threads continue to dominate the boards. Even the AvsX ones took a beating. Can we talk about something else?

Peace

No.
All we will ever talk about from now on is the movie.
The Movie Is.
no, wait, that's Darkseid..
Be fair it's been a week, and it's an extraordinarily good movie, and a Big Deal to boot.
As long as it stops all those retarded AVX discussions, I'm all for it.

[Wren]

It's genuine confusion about the point of small stuff like Black Nick Fury, Coulson and Ultimate/Movie Hawkeye if one of the books you publish under the Avengers imprint features a cast that is nothing like the movie you are supposed to be lining your books up with (not you, obviously. A rhetorical "you" aimed at Marvel).
Surely they could at least bring in one of the movies heroes, so there would be some sort of reference point for the alleged "new readers".
As it is, you have Wolverine, an X-man, and Spiderman, both in movies but not in THE avengers movie. Then there's a bunch of people no movie goer will know or care about.
They might as well call the book "Movie goers, £$%^ off!", because that is the effect it's likely to have.

I suppose that if Bendis is leaving, (and it seems to be taking a suspiciously long time for him to go), the book may well be cancelled or re-tooled to look like an actual Avengers team.

I suspect Secret Avengers to be nearly as bad for new readers, but at least there you have Hawkeye, and Cap to show it's an Avengers book.

It just seems weird to have all this publicity, all this attention from the enormously successful movie, and to willfully field this obscure unattractive (to movie goers) team under that name.
We know they are quite happy to piss off the comic book buying customers they already had, apparently they intend to continue that trend with any new ones the movie might bring in.
I can hear it now: "if you want Cap/Thor/Hulk/Iron man, you can always go watch the movie again, nobody can take that away from you"

I thought Avengers Assemble was supposed to be the movie-tie-in book with the movie cast? Just because there's other books is not a problem. It's *new* Avengers, after all.

[Nomads1]

I thought Avengers Assemble was supposed to be the movie-tie-in book with the movie cast? Just because there's other books is not a problem. It's *new* Avengers, after all.

You can always change the name of the book to "Luke Cage and the New Crew" to avoid confusion.
But seriously, I think there are great chances that New Avengers will be completely retooled or canceled after Bendis leaves. Maybe he'll even take a few with him to whatever he's doing next. Though I have to say Luke Cage, X-Man or Luke Cage, Galactic Hero for Hire have strange rings to it. Appearently Wolverine has already left the building.

Peace

[carabas]

So, movie threads continue to dominate the boards. Even the AvsX ones took a beating. Can we talk about something else?

Peace

Why don't the mods just shove them all over to the Television And Movies board anyway?

[tommyman]

I thought Avengers Assemble was supposed to be the movie-tie-in book with the movie cast? Just because there's other books is not a problem. It's *new* Avengers, after all.

It's "Avengers".
"New", "Secret", "On Ice", makes no odds.
People go into the comic shop and look for "avengers".
Or worse, to the TPB store and pick up a "new Avengers" trade, flick through and think what?
They might as well buy a Green Lantern TPB, it has as much to do with the Avengers movie.

They've gone to all the trouble of setting up Fury and Coulson in 616 to match the movie.
They've changed Hawkeye's costume to match the movie.
If they were serious about making their books new (movie going) reader friendly they would get all their ducks in a row and put somebody from the movie in that team, at the very least.

It's not like it doesn't need the sales help the movie could bring, after all, it's getting outsold by Wonder Woman and Aquaman, for Set's sake. It's been stale and lacklustre for a while, why not spruce it up and maybe get some of the movie audience into the book?

[Telos]

Why don't the mods just shove them all over to the Television And Movies board anyway?

It'd be really great if they did that. And put the Avengers Alliance thread on the Gaming board. It's frustrating having so many non-comic-related threads open.

[Wren]

It's "Avengers".
"New", "Secret", "On Ice", makes no odds.
People go into the comic shop and look for "avengers".
Or worse, to the TPB store and pick up a "new Avengers" trade, flick through and think what?
They might as well buy a Green Lantern TPB, it has as much to do with the Avengers movie.

They've gone to all the trouble of setting up Fury and Coulson in 616 to match the movie.
They've changed Hawkeye's costume to match the movie.
If they were serious about making their books new (movie going) reader friendly they would get all their ducks in a row and put somebody from the movie in that team, at the very least.

It's not like it doesn't need the sales help the movie could bring, after all, it's getting outsold by Wonder Woman and Aquaman, for Set's sake. It's been stale and lacklustre for a while, why not spruce it up and maybe get some of the movie audience into the book?

How is it going to work if all the other teams suddenly get replaced by one movie-team? Honestly I don't want to read that and I think it would ruin the franchise.

There's always going to be confusion, that's why marketing is important and not just piling all the books on a shelf and calling it a day. Clearly demarcate which one you should pick up based on the movie. Clearly show this on the Marvel website, and on Amazon, etc...

Anyway if it's set in 616 it's going to be very different just because the characters are different and their relationships are drastically different.

That's why Avengers Assemble just puts the continuity on hold and (if it's good) will gently introduce new readers to the Avengers as they are in comics, rather than as they are in the movie.

Maybe they should start a new line like the Ultimate universe. That might be better actually.