Young Justice

[Theozilla]

Pretty much this. The big problem is regardless of whether or not any of these "mysteries" are answered or not doesn't change that they shouldn't of been mysteries in the first place. Off screen development mentioned in passing/flashbacks is not in any way the equal to seeing the development unfolding over the course of a series. One of the best things about Justice League(Unlimited) was it was a continuation of two already established shows. So we saw how Batman, Superman and their villains developed over the course of their appearances. We just got cheated out of five potential seasons worth of occurances. Though in practice i doubt most of the changes would really of needed more than one or two. The best series are the ones that let us grow with the characters not just hit the reset button right when things were coming together.

But all you're really saying is that you inherently oppose the idea of time-skips in the first place. Obviously Weisman and Vietti differ in taste from you.

I just disagree with the notion that time-skips are inherently bad, plenty of other series do time-skips and they turn out great. IMO I see no difference here.

I felt like they were doing the exact same thing with Rocket and her ebonics.

She was not talking in ebonics, that is just how the voice actress, Kali Bianca Troy (who has worked with Weisman before), sounds in general.

[Farealmer]

But all you're really saying is that you inherently oppose the idea of time-skips in the first place. Obviously Weisman and Vietti differ in taste from you.

I wouldn't say this proves they have different tastes just that they went with a time skip on this show. That doesn't really say anything about how they feel about time skips in general.

I just disagree with the notion that time-skips are inherently bad, plenty of other series do time-skips and they turn out great. IMO I see no difference here.

But most of those don't do so between the first and second season or are superhero shows(which have a rather sketchy history on TV as is). My issue isn't just that a time skip happened, it's the timing. The characters were just finding there legs and now we are effectively getting a reroll on them.

We just had a season of OMG! MM is a white martian, OMG! Superboy is having clone issues, OMG! Artemis is related to badguys. I don't need a season full of new 5 year missing time issues to replace them. Now they may not go that direction and just say the bare minimum but that is also bad because then we'll be essentially cheated out of all the stuff that caused them to change. The problem with this time skip was it was both unnecessary and now the stuff that has happened during it will take screen time away from stuff we should of been seeing(the plot of this season). This may turn out good for the series, but considering the history of shows about superheroes it's more likey not to.

You can like it as you will all i've been doing is explaining why i don't like this particular one. I may not like time skips but that doesn't mean i don't think that any are well done(there are plenty i find acceptable). I just generally find them a lazy way to shake stuff up without doing any of the work.

[Theozilla]

I wouldn't say this proves they have different tastes just that they went with a time skip on this show. That doesn't really say anything about how they feel about time skips in general.


But most of those don't do so between the first and second season or are superhero shows(which have a rather sketchy history on TV as is). My issue isn't just that a time skip happened, it's the timing. The characters were just finding there legs and now we are effectively getting a reroll on them.

We just had a season of OMG! MM is a white martian, OMG! Superboy is having clone issues, OMG! Artemis is related to badguys. I don't need a season full of new 5 year missing time issues to replace them. Now they may not go that direction and just say the bare minimum but that is also bad because then we'll be essentially cheated out of all the stuff that caused them to change. The problem with this time skip was it was both unnecessary and now the stuff that has happened during it will take screen time away from stuff we should of been seeing(the plot of this season). This may turn out good for the series, but considering the history of shows about superheroes it's more likey not to.

You can like it as you will all i've been doing is explaining why i don't like this particular one. I may not like time skips but that doesn't mean i don't think that any are well done(there are plenty i find acceptable). I just generally find them a lazy way to shake stuff up without doing any of the work.

Well, I personally felt the characters were developed enough in Season 1 to make a time-skip acceptable. And your use of "unnecessary" does not make sense, one could make the argument that any use of a plot-pint, character, etc. is unnecessary simple because they think something/one should have been used instead.

But I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree on the general use of time-skips, you find "lazy way to shake stuff up without doing any of the work.", I think they provide interesting new settings, new dynamics, and mystery.

[Farealmer]

And your use of "unnecessary" does not make sense, one could make the argument that any use of a plot-pint, character, etc. is unnecessary simple because they think something/one should have been used instead.

While it is true a large amount of plot points in anything is rather arbitrary, that doesn't make all of it equally so.

I think they provide interesting new settings, new dynamics, and mystery. .

The thing is the last two could be done as shown story telling. And the first is rather counter productive, most people don't watch a running series featuring the same characters for them to be suddenly and unexpectedly changed. They watch so they can see what causes those characters to grow and change with their own eyes. Flashbacks don't really cover that.

Or more to the point...
They signed up in the first season for a new setting, if they wanted a newer one they'd of looked elsewhere.

[Theozilla]

While it is true a large amount of plot points in anything is rather arbitrary, that doesn't make all of it equally so.

The thing is the last two could be done as shown story telling. And the first is rather counter productive, most people don't watch a running series featuring the same characters for them to be suddenly and unexpectedly changed. They watch so they can see what causes those characters to grow and change with their own eyes. Flashbacks don't really cover that.

Or more to the point...
They signed up in the first season for a new setting, if they wanted a newer one they'd of looked elsewhere.

Shown story can't give new dynamics and mystery on the same level that time-skips can give, its giving new status quos without completely changing everything.
But as I said we'll just have agree to disagree on the general use of time-skips.

[zomg]

I love timeskips, but this one is handled poorly. If you're going to do a timeskip and focus on a new set of characters than the old core cast needs to have an either satisfying conclusion to their story or you must have told enough stories with the old cast to warrant a status quo change; neither of which applies to the season one team. They barely got together as a team, with a new member called Rocket added in episode 25 who, two episodes later, turned into a mute background character on the JL, seriously what was the point of adding her to the team?
To make matters worse the two characters who got the most development in season one are still on the team (M'gann and Superboy, who not so coincidentally appeared in most episodes of season one) and based on the episodes description they'll be focusing on them in next week's episode.

They should have waited a season or two before doing the timeskip IMO.

[GrampaGen]

Shown story can't give new dynamics and mystery on the same level that time-skips can give, its giving new status quos without completely changing everything.
But as I said we'll just have agree to disagree on the general use of time-skips.

They barely established the status quo before changing everything, though. Things were finally coming to a head from all the Light buildup and now we're essentially watching a different show.

Watching our characters grow is what brings us closer to them, and they were doing just that in the last five or so episodes. In this case, the timeskip feels like a cheap device to shuffle things around and get new faces on the Team, nothing more.

[Theozilla]

They barely established the status quo before changing everything, though. Things were finally coming to a head from all the Light buildup and now we're essentially watching a different show.

Watching our characters grow is what brings us closer to them, and they were doing just that in the last five or so episodes. In this case, the timeskip feels like a cheap device to shuffle things around and get new faces on the Team, nothing more.

There was a status quo IMO in the previous season and all the previous core characters are going to appear in Season 2 eventually, both the creators and voice actors have confirmed that. Time-skips allow the old characters to grow, were just watching them grow at later stages in their lives. And we also get to see new characters grow as well.

[wildclaw]

I have to agree with many about the time skip, it was handled very poorly. The transition was very jarring because it there was no setup for it all, so it felt forced. My biggest peeve is that they never really allowed Grayson to develop into the the true leader of the team in a way I thought was satisfying, he showed the glimpses of it towards the end of season one, but he never got that full build up and scene where he is fully acknowledged as the real leader of the team. JLU, Death Note, Naruto, and One Piece are examples of shows that handled their time skips much, much more smoothly and effectively than this one.

[Surtur]

Who was the black guy that was talking to the team over their com's during the mission?

[JL81790]

Quick question, isn't the Young Justice video game supposed to bridge the gap between the seasons? I saw someone on different boards pointed out the "One will rise, one will fall, one will die" tagline and the fact that we don't know the status of three team-members. With KF becoming Flash he would rise, Aqualad looks like he's turned into a villain in his new costume so he would fall, leaving Artemis as the one who dies. This is all just speculation obviously, but it would be pretty sucky to bank on a video game to bridge continuity. The X-men movie game tried to do that with the Nightcrawler story and it was just stupid.

[Surtur]

I think the time skip might of worked better if the 2nd season didn't start exactly one week after the first one ended.

[Superbeast]

I think it's less that and more that this goes against basic narrative structure of building a band of heroes and proving their worth through numerous trials. You build up your cast, have them forge alliances, have them question those bonds, reinforce them and prosper together as a result. We saw that happen over the course of season one and now we have a brand new batch we barely know and have reason to care for in place of characters that developed on screen allowing the characters to engage with them. The deep bond forged by all of the suspected moles confessing was barely used when it should have been a defining moment for the team to move forward from. It's the same gripe people had with the finale of CHUCK in a way, people complained all the character development we saw from Sarah Walker was flushed away as a plot device for the finale and no clear resolution was given at the end. Here, people are griping about the fact they missed out on seeing the characters they care for grow while being annoyed they have been replaced with new faces that are largely unfamiliar and not as engaging as a result. So we either will get cliff notes exposition moments or flashbacks to fill in the blanks when I think most would have preferred to have watched and been shown in context, not told retroactively or barely touched upon.

[Vibranium]

never watched Chuck, never cared for it




the average viewer wants (heroes, bad guys, beatings) they don't much care who is doing what to whom as long as it isn't overly horrible.....remember, this is the same network Adventure Time is on, so Im not sure what you're looking for here

and for the record I LOVE THE new GL series

[Superbeast]

Well GL is apparently keeping Thundercats audience and getting it's own bump and YJ is losing some of GL's audience. I expect both YJ and Thundercats to go with GL staying and being supported by Beware The Batman and SuperBFFs. Maybe a new Flash or Superman CGI cartoon like GL and Beware...