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  1. #1

    Default All-Star Batman and Robin

    Hey, first post guys, though I've been reading the boards a while, and thought I'd post a topic.

    So I just got done reading the TPB of ASBAR, and while I understand completely why this interpretation is so polarizing, I found it to really be an awesome piece of work and I really hope that Frank Miller and Jim Lee can finish it up.

    One thing which I find confusing is how anybody would interpret it to be satirical when I think clearly it's not .

    I just found the characterization of everyone involved to be really sort of fascinating. Yes, Batman is acting like a complete, world-class A-hole throughout, but really reading his internal dialog, you realize it's entirely an act , and he's treating Dick so badly only because he feels he has to. It's Bruce at a young, brash, and despite his obvious intelligence, somewhat foolish stage, and in spite of his confidence in his own ability, in reality, he isn't nearly as sure as he makes himself out to be. I think, actually, the story and characterization really humanizes Batman in a way which hasn't really been done before. He's making mistakes, he's feeling doubt, and hiding it beneath this bravado of self-assuredness and, basically, meanness. He's playing like he's crazy, and in some respects, he is, but not nearly so much as he'd like everyone to believe. He does it as a mechanism to frighten criminals.

    Then, as a striking contrast to that, you have Miller's interpretation of the joker, which I found to be completely frightening. The joker really is insane, and really is that mean and that much of a b*stard. It isn't a front, he isn't pretending or trying to compensate for something by acting that way like Batman is. He just is that way. I think Miller's really captured the core of the joker here, and why he's so scary. He's just chilling in his coldness and his apathy.

    What I'm trying to say, I guess, is that Batman is pretending to be this cold, heartless son of a bi*ch, but beneath all of that, he really does care. He cares a lot . And then you've got the joker who actually is that cold, heartless son of a bi*ch, and the contrast within the story is apparent I think. And the difference between the two characters is apparent, but also at the same time, it's interesting how their difference is so perfectly opposite of one another, so much so, that it highlights the much talked about dynamic of how both Batman and the joker are two sides of the same coin, how they each represent the extreme sides of the same spectrum.

    I think also the dynamic between Bruce and Dick is wonderful. I know this is a point of contention within the fan community, how Bruce treats Dick. But like I said earlier, I think it's to highlight Bruce's own uncertainty at that early stage in his career. This sort of need to be right, to be without doubt, and how he forces that on Dick, and then ends up paying for it. It's about Batman learning, I think, and not being perfect. Bruce doesn't really want to treat Dick like he does. But it isn't about what he wants. It's about what he thinks he needs . And in the process, forgetting what Dick needs.

    I think a lot of people mischaracterized what Frank Miller was trying to do here, and took it at face value, when it really runs much deeper then that, I feel.

    Just my opinion, of course. But thought I might share it. I really do hope they finish it up, because I'm really interested in seeing where this goes.

    And, by the way, Jim Lee's art is simply fantastic too! He really is an awesome artist!
    Last edited by cosmicjoke; 02-28-2010 at 12:47 PM.

  2. #2
    Peachy Keen Gabe De Los Muertos's Avatar
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    I loved it too, but prepare to be laughed at.
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  3. #3

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    Quote Originally Posted by DetectiveDupin View Post
    I loved it too, but prepare to be laughed at.
    lol, I'm sure I will be. But glad there's someone who agrees!

  4. #4
    Peachy Keen Gabe De Los Muertos's Avatar
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    I really do hope we get to see it finish.
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  5. #5
    Elder Member Karl O'Neill's Avatar
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    Really love this comic as well.
    "You can't trust them as poets either. The true poet is anonymous, as to his habits, but these boys have to look, act, and apparently smell like poets"
    Flannery O'Connor on the beats.

  6. #6

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    For sure, I'd be bummed if it didn't see its conclusion.

  7. #7
    Totally harmless RubberLotus's Avatar
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    I kinda like it, too.

    About the people bitching about how Joker's so bland and cold... this is the same reason why I liked TDK so much. Remember: these aren't just Batman's opening years; THEY'RE THE JOKER'S TOO!

    I think it makes sense that Joker would gradually acquire his warped sense of humor and joke gadgets in the few years after he fell into that vat of acid.

  8. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by RubberLotus View Post
    I kinda like it, too.

    About the people bitching about how Joker's so bland and cold... this is the same reason why I liked TDK so much. Remember: these aren't just Batman's opening years; THEY'RE THE JOKER'S TOO!

    I think it makes sense that Joker would gradually acquire his warped sense of humor and joke gadgets in the few years after he fell into that vat of acid.
    Good point. Same as how Batman becomes less abrassive and more thoughtful later. I actually really love the way the joker's written by Miller. People forget that he is a psychopathic mass murderer. Sure, the joker does it with humor, but at the end of the day, there's really nothing too funny about what he's doing, and he's just plain frightening. I think Miller really captured this aspect of the character well. He's so completely uncaring. Batman operates on fear, but the joker's so totally apathetic towards everything, that that doesn't work for him, and that's really scary. He showed this in The Dark Knight Returns also. I mean, the way he kills the woman in the hotel room, and talks to her while he's doing it, twisting it as though its some form of love, when he regards her, literally, as nothing more then a source for his amusement, it's very scary. And shows how warped his mind is. I got chills reading his joker and found the contrast between him and Batman, as well as the fact that they're standing opposite each other on the same level, really fascinating. I think Miller captures how they're each other's perfect foils very well.
    Last edited by cosmicjoke; 02-28-2010 at 01:36 PM.

  9. #9
    Dark Knight Detective DarkKnghtJared's Avatar
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    I think if it was meant to be the "official" origin of the two getting together, I could see where people would be angered, but since it is Miller doing his own thing in this little universe that DC's allowed him to create, I'm enjoying it for the slightly messed up roller coaster it is.

    I also hope they finish it--and if Lee's word in a recent DC blog is any indication, it should be coming soon.

  10. #10
    Senior Member
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    I hate it. But I can appreciate the perspective you're giving.
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  11. #11
    Super Moderator Global Honored's Avatar
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    Wow...an All Star love fest? On the interwebs? Who woulda thunk it?

    Count me in though as I am completely entertained by this series, as frustrating as it is to wait for every issue.

  12. #12
    those god-damned goggles chipsnopotatoes's Avatar
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    it's very entertaining. my favorite is the yellow room with green lantern.

  13. #13
    Shut up, Leonard FHIZ's Avatar
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    I friggen loved it. You take Frank Miller's over the top psychotic writing and you add Jim Lee's art and you got an instant win in my book

  14. #14
    I am Zero. DKR's Avatar
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    I like it but I like to make jokes about it as well.

  15. #15
    Future's Past R.E. Barnes's Avatar
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    After the you get past "Goddamn Batman" thing this book is pure fun.

    Bruce forcing Dick to live in the cave.

    Batman and Black Canary.

    And one of the sassiest Alfred's ever.

    The Green Lantern, Batman, and Robin confrotation is what got me, that is pure gold from begining to end. Yellow paint, lemonade, broken windpipe, and one of the best lines "You little snot." classic.

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