Doctor Doom Appreciation

[Rogue07]

I'm still upset about JMS making Doom cry. My inner geek just can't seem to let that one go. One last time people....Victor doesn't cry! He's DOOM! It's beneath him.

[Bad Wolf]

What was the context?

[Rogue07]

What was the context?

It was during the Amazing Spiderman run. It was a tribute issue to 9-11. I'm not trying to be insensitive to the subject matter but I still found it in poor taste to portray Doom like that. It really served no purpose...like victims of 911 are reading that issue going.."wow Doom cares..it really IS a tragedy!" Just because something horrific happens doesn't mean a writer gets a free mulligan to bastardize a whole character concept.

[Nefarius]

Is Doomwar worth checking?

BP fans were upset in many parts,but Doom fans would be pleased.It was a nice mini and i liked that both Doom and T'Challa acted like generals in a wide battlefield.

[Blight]

BP fans were upset in many parts,but Doom fans would be pleased.It was a nice mini and i liked that both Doom and T'Challa acted like generals in a wide battlefield.

I thought it was alright. Just that the finale fell apart and was horrible. I wanted Doom vs. T'Challa and instead got T'Challa just doing what he did and his sis all, "You lived this day. Consider yourself lucky." ..... Seriously? It felt more a victory for Doom then for them.

[Expletive Deleted]

What was the context?

Right after 9-11, JMS and JRJr did an issue of Amazing Spider-Man where they reacted to the tragedy using Marvel characters. One panel had Dr. Doom shedding a tear, and people who thought the integrity of a fictional character should supersede artistic expression in the wake of a horrible tragedy freaked out.

[Iron Maiden]

And to be specific, JMS only asked JR Jr to draw Doom at the scene along with the Magneto,etc. JR jr took a bit of artistic license and added the tear.

Almost a year later, Chuck Dixon wrote this scene in a Doom mini series and I often wondered if it was in direct response to that.

[Expletive Deleted]

And to be specific, JMS only asked JR Jr to draw Doom at the scene along with the Magneto,etc. JR jr took a bit of artistic license and added the tear.

The man's a native New Yorker, and it was drawn in late 2001.

The degree to which some people aren't willing to cut him a little slack for that baffles me.

Almost a year later, Chuck Dixon wrote this scene in a Doom mini series and I often wondered if it was in direct response to that.

Probably. It seems like something he'd do.

[DeadXMan]

Right after 9-11, JMS and JRJr did an issue of Amazing Spider-Man where they reacted to the tragedy using Marvel characters. One panel had Dr. Doom shedding a tear, and people who thought the integrity of a fictional character should supersede artistic expression in the wake of a horrible tragedy freaked out.

but then Millar did the unthinkable to Doom that made us forget about it.

[Iron Maiden]

The man's a native New Yorker, and it was drawn in late 2001.

The degree to which some people aren't willing to cut him a little slack for that baffles me.

Yeah, I know what you mean. I'm pretty sure he drew that when the country was still reeling from it all. The comic came out fairly quickly, IIRC. Like maybe late October??

[DoomScribe]

[nomadic writer]

Well, Doom did shed a - well justified - tear when he finally got to rescue his mother from hell in Triumph and Torment.



It's not like 'unemotional' has ever been Doom's schtick. He's a man of pretty passionate feelings. I don't think it's that impossible to believe that a tragedy that he sees as senseless (compared to the things he considers necessary parts of his plans for saving the world from itself) could affect him. Especially if it strikes some sort of personal chord - kids being orphaned is a thing with Doom, and as somebody pointed out on another site, odds are that there would have been some Latverians killed.

What makes it seem jarring really is not the supervillains' reactions themselves, but the fact that comics throw around fictional tragedies of a similar scale all the time, and those are rarely treated as emotionally real in the same way.

[Nefarius]

I thought it was alright. Just that the finale fell apart and was horrible. I wanted Doom vs. T'Challa and instead got T'Challa just doing what he did and his sis all, "You lived this day. Consider yourself lucky." ..... Seriously? It felt more a victory for Doom then for them.

My ideal finale of Doomwar would be T'Challa organising a revolution in Latveria to weaken Doom.Doom would hold his position,but he would be preoccupied for a period of time trying to eradicate the revolution inside his country.Thus,T'Challa would pay Doom with the same coin as Doom was financing the Desturi coup against Black Panther.

[Bad Wolf]

It was during the Amazing Spiderman run. It was a tribute issue to 9-11. I'm not trying to be insensitive to the subject matter but I still found it in poor taste to portray Doom like that. It really served no purpose...like victims of 911 are reading that issue going.."wow Doom cares..it really IS a tragedy!" Just because something horrific happens doesn't mean a writer gets a free mulligan to bastardize a whole character concept.

Oh yeah, I did read that one. That was bad. It was out of character not only for Doom to even be there, but most if not all of the other villains as well.

I wouldn't say that Doom would never cry, though. But it would have to be over something extremely personal, and he'd only do it in private. The example with his mother is a good one (before that was posted I thought of the old What If? issue where he tries to save his mother from Mephisto and fails.)

[Finganforn]

I thought it was alright. Just that the finale fell apart and was horrible. I wanted Doom vs. T'Challa and instead got T'Challa just doing what he did and his sis all, "You lived this day. Consider yourself lucky." ..... Seriously? It felt more a victory for Doom then for them.

Honestly, it felt much more like a "gotta finish this in a convenient way, very convenient way". Sorry Mayberry, it was too conveniently convenient despite how good the rest was.

But to the point, instead of the Deus Ex/Totally Convenient End-Game Device I would rather have T'Challa beat Doom in his own game. He and Reed (maybe others too) would accept to change some of their instances about certain critic areas, making possible futures were humanity doesn't annihilate itself viable to happen (and possibly happier futures). And in all of them, Doom had to make a choice: accept to change too, give up much of his plan and destroy much of what he had built (if you do not get the message: the future isn't set in stone and if the present seems to only lead to a shit future, change the present so it may lead to a better outcome). When confronted to cast predictions of the future again he would have no choice, he would have lost his own chess game. Something along those lines, at least.