View Poll Results: Conan vs Tarzan

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  • Conan

    34 64.15%
  • Tarzan

    18 33.96%
  • other

    1 1.89%
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Thread: Conan vs Tarzan

  1. #61
    S.P.E.C.T.R.E. destro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by berk View Post
    I'm surprised the Burroughs estate or whoever controls the copyright now hasn't hire someone to write some new Tarzan novels. The one Philip Jose Farmer did a few years ago, Dark Heart of Time, was quite good, I thought. Maybe it didn't sell very well, because it seemed to have been left open for a sequel, but it never happened.
    Well he has been marketed a bit in a kiddy way with the Disney stuff. Personally I think he is much more interesting as a mature character. It seems like a huge waste of a good character. Though I prefer Conan I still think that there is a lot that could be done with Tarzan.

    Conan has a bit of an advantage here, other than a short lived cartoon series he has always been used as a grown up (or at least marketed towards teens) character.

    I read an article in Filmfax awhile back about all of the on again/off again plans to do a John Carter movie over the years. If people are still considering that then I think we will see Tarzan make a comeback at some point. John Carter is really off people's radar screens, personally I would go with a Tarzan movie 1st.

  2. #62
    Elder Member Libaax's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by benday-dot View Post
    But if you jump outside the narrowish realm of swords and sorcery and fantasy consumers, and relate to the average person the names of Tarzan the Ape Man and Conan the Barbarian the contest of recognition is clearly in Tarzan's favour.

    Is there anyone who isn't at least passingly familiar with the name of Tarzan... that he is a white guy living in the jungle, that he was raised by apes? Is there anyone who is unfamiliar with the phrase of "Tarzan and Jane"?

    Conan, since the late 60's has certainly gained in renown (the comics and the movies have definitely helped him close the gap in name recognition) but for the most part he has resided only as supreme in the sword and sorcery subculture.

    Tarzan has always been the more universal character to the mainstream consumer.
    Thats what im saying. Tarzan might be slightly bigger in mainstream where people have distant memories of the german swimmer Tarzan movies. Same as mainstream people think Conan is lame Arnold movie.

    In genre fiction Conan destroys Tarzan. I know a few people old readers who have read Tarzan original stories while many more has read REH stories in the last decades. The fantasy readers know who REH are.

    Narrowish realm of fantasy you are talking about are the reason everything REH wrote are in print. Conan has been milked in huge numbers.

    Thats why Conan is better remembered today.

    Mainstream people dont care enough to read Tarzan,keep the him as strong as he was in pulp.
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  3. #63
    Modus omnibus in rebus Roquefort Raider's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Libaax View Post
    Thats what im saying. Tarzan might be slightly bigger in mainstream where people have distant memories of the german swimmer Tarzan movies.
    Mmmmh... You know, Libaax, we're both big R. E. Howard fans but I would still think that Tarzan's popularity in the general public is much, much bigger than Conan's... and even then, as you point out, what awareness of Conan there is in that public is unfortunately due to the Arnold movies.

    In genre fiction Conan destroys Tarzan.
    At this particular moment this is absolutely true (and I'm overjoyed)! There has been a very welcome revival of Howard's work in the past decade, while the Tarzan novels have apparently faded in the background. This is a fairly recent phenomenon, though, due to the hard work of a few dedicated fans and scholars. As recently as the 80s the Tarzan novels were available everywhere in the US, while the Conan stuff was either the sub-par DeCamp-Carter pastiches or the decidedly crappy TOR-published pastiches.

    Fantasy fiction is however only read by a small part of the population, and as a popular icon I don't think Conan is in the same league as Tarzan. He'd be more of a second-leaguer, like Doc Savage, Zorro, or James Bond; well-known, but not universally so. Tarzan belongs to the really big league along with Dracula or Sherlock Holmes; the kind of archetype that's instantly recognized by everyone across many generations.

    To determine what character belongs where, I'd suggest the grandma test : who would Grandma recognize among these characters?



    But to all the Tarzan lovers who are gloating over my admission that the jungle lord is better known than Conan: never forget that Tarzan tried to have a relationship with Teeka! My man Conan may have had sex with a lot of ladies, but never with an ape!!! So there!!!
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  4. #64
    Frugal fanboy Cei-U!'s Avatar
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    I've read and enjoyed all 24 ERB Tarzan novels and every REH Conan story. Given that relatively broad perspective, I'm comfortable saying that Tarzan is the deeper, more mythologically redolent character while Conan's is the richer, more interesting mileau. If I could only re-read one canon, it would be Howard's (on the other hand, I'd rather read Manning's or Kubert's Tarzan comics over any existing Conan comic, good as they are).

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  5. #65
    Elder Member Libaax's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roquefort Raider View Post
    Mmmmh... You know, Libaax, we're both big R. E. Howard fans but I would still think that Tarzan's popularity in the general public is much, much bigger than Conan's... and even then, as you point out, what awareness of Conan there is in that public is unfortunately due to the Arnold movies.



    At this particular moment this is absolutely true (and I'm overjoyed)! There has been a very welcome revival of Howard's work in the past decade, while the Tarzan novels have apparently faded in the background. This is a fairly recent phenomenon, though, due to the hard work of a few dedicated fans and scholars. As recently as the 80s the Tarzan novels were available everywhere in the US, while the Conan stuff was either the sub-par DeCamp-Carter pastiches or the decidedly crappy TOR-published pastiches.

    Fantasy fiction is however only read by a small part of the population, and as a popular icon I don't think Conan is in the same league as Tarzan. He'd be more of a second-leaguer, like Doc Savage, Zorro, or James Bond; well-known, but not universally so. Tarzan belongs to the really big league along with Dracula or Sherlock Holmes; the kind of archetype that's instantly recognized by everyone across many generations.

    To determine what character belongs where, I'd suggest the grandma test : who would Grandma recognize among these characters?



    But to all the Tarzan lovers who are gloating over my admission that the jungle lord is better known than Conan: never forget that Tarzan tried to have a relationship with Teeka! My man Conan may have had sex with a lot of ladies, but never with an ape!!! So there!!!

    Actually a swedish company own the copyright to Conan as a movie. Its worth alot like Sherlock Holmes,Bond. Actually James Bond is in the first league of the likes of Sherlock Holmes. He is worth billions.

    Also i know Tarzan mainstream popularity is big. Mainstream people have actually seen Conan films while how many are still alive from Tarzan era movies.

    Thats why i think he is a bit overrated by you in mainstream popularity. He isnt like Sherlock Holmes he hasnt had 100 films,tv shows in the last 40 years.

    Anyway i dont care about mainstream. I was saying in fantasy field Conan is royalty Tarzan isnt like that today. Conan has more books in print than many fantasy characters today, fantasy field is small procent of all readers but still one of the biggest genre and Conan has sold in many millions.
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  6. #66
    Idaho Spuds Slam_Bradley's Avatar
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    How quickly they forget.

    I'd be willing to bet the farm that with people 18 and under Tarzan is more recognizable than Conan by orders of magnitude.

  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by Libaax View Post
    Actually a swedish company own the copyright to Conan as a movie.
    Paradox owns all of Robert E. Howard's stories and trademarks, actually, except for the compromise it has with Red Sonja LLC over the Red Sonya character.

    (I wonder how it will enforce its copyright over stories that are now in the public domain, though). But you're right : the Conan name and franchise is worth many millions of dollars. I'm not saying Conan isn't a valuable property, or that he's not well-known: I'm saying that he hasn't yet attained the kind of mythological status that Tarzan, Sherlock Holmes or Dracula have.

    Mainstream people have actually seen Conan films while how many are still alive from Tarzan era movies.


    That Tarzan movie alone made a lot more dough than the Conan ones!

    Thats why i think he is a bit overrated by you in mainstream popularity. He isnt like Sherlock Holmes he hasnt had 100 films,tv shows in the last 40 years.
    Well, no, certainly not that many. He still did pretty well, though. Apart from the above-mentioned Disney movie and its inevitable sequel and associated TV cartoon, there was the bad movie Tarzan and the lost city in 98; before that there was the excellent Greystoke; there was some nondescript Tarzan TV show in the 80s; there was the Bo Derek movie Tarzan the ape man; there was a Batman/Tarzan TV show in the 70s, there was the Ron Ely Tarzan TV show in the 70s... I'd say Tarzan and Sherlock have had about the same exposure in different media. But that's not really my point: in terms of universal recognizability, I'd say both Tarzan in his leopard loincloth and Sherlock Holmes with his deerstalker hat are way up there among the truly iconic images of popular culture.

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  8. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by Libaax View Post
    Also i know Tarzan mainstream popularity is big. Mainstream people have actually seen Conan films while how many are still alive from Tarzan era movies.
    I don't know what years the Tarzan Movie Era encompasses, but those movies are still shown endlessly on tv. As a kid in the 60s I lost count of how many times I saw the MGM series.

    Those Tarzan movies can be bought or rented on dvd.

    It's bizarre to define people who know who Tarzan is as only those who saw the Tarzan films in their original theatrical release.

    Several generations of people, worldwide, have seen those movies on tv, tapes and now dvds.
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  9. #69
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    I haven't seen a Tarzan film on television since the 80s, with the exception of Greystoke and even that is rare. Of course I could have missed them, but they aren't on often.

    I see Conan on television flicking through the channels at least once every few months. I think some of you are downplaying what a big hit the Conan film was. It is still well remembered today. Not on the level of Terminator or Predator, but it is up there.

    I'm surprised that so many people in this thread are so down on the Conan movie. Yeah the 2nd one was lame, but I thought the 1st one was probably the best you could expect out of Hollywood. Arnold was a perfect choice to play him. I don't get to say that too often! Sure it took a lot of liberties with the Conan story, but not as many as they usually do with films like this. Definitely not a true classic, but core of Conan was there for sure.

  10. #70
    Senior Member InfoBroker's Avatar
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    Amazon (US) search of Tarzan
    * DVD (146)
    * Books (21,164)
    * VHS (161)
    * Home & Garden (1,271)
    * MP3 Downloads (305)
    * Kindle Store (142)
    * Music (90)
    * Toys & Games (59)
    * Everything Else (57)
    * Apparel & Accessories (48)
    * Video On Demand (36)
    * Office Products & Supplies (24)
    * Health & Personal Care (18)
    * Software (18)
    * Video Games (16)
    * Sports & Outdoors (14)
    * Baby (9)
    * Home Improvement (9)
    * Electronics (6)
    * Gourmet Food (4)
    * Jewelry (3)
    * Beauty (2)
    * Automotive (1)
    * Musical Instruments (1)

    Search on Conan -doyle -brien -zip
    * Home & Garden (194)
    * Books (3,992)
    * DVD (84)
    * Electronics (1)
    * Apparel & Accessories (49)
    * Health & Personal Care (2)
    * Toys & Games (201)
    * Music (47)
    * Everything Else (65)
    * Sports & Outdoors (8)
    * Office Products & Supplies (7)
    * Video Games (16)
    * Software (9)
    * MP3 Downloads (162)
    * Kindle Store (67)
    * VHS (56)
    * Video On Demand (15)

    Mainstream or genre, not sure where people are getting the idea that awareness, access, knowledge of Tarzan has dwindled in the past decade or two in this the Current Age of Instant Access. He'll win this iconic awareness contest going forward for a long time to come given that he is overall more Soccer Mom approved that the Cimmerian bloke.

    And be aware, while I tried to thin the ranks of a lot of excess non Conan the Barbarian paraphernalia, there are still things creeping into that not heavily filtered search (like the Bayeux Tapestry Prints featuring Conan du Lac... which I found curiously interesting). Probably some for Tarzan as well, but I think its a save bet that the Conan search numbers are more padded than the Tarzan ones.

    I didn't do a search of Amazon UK nor AU, but I welcome others to feel free do so...

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  11. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by destro View Post
    I haven't seen a Tarzan film on television since the 80s, with the exception of Greystoke and even that is rare. Of course I could have missed them, but they aren't on often.
    This reminds me of one of my high school art teachers and her shock that Nixon won the 1968 presidential election. She didn't vote for him, none of her friends voted for him, so how did he win? (She's from Boston). Then she took a job here in the fly-over states. Her point of view and perspective was broadened significantly.

    My point here is you aren't being objective in your observations, it's based on your viewing habits without much extrapolation outward to a broader range of tastes and people.

    Off the top of my head, and using tvguide.com as a very very minor reference aid:

    The Legend of Tarzan animation show is still making the daily rounds on UPN and WB stations. The Tarzan movies, especially the pre-Hayes code ones cycle through showings on Turner Classics moves 2-3 times a year, and sometimes they marathon them across a string of Saturn-day mornings. I know the later because I spend a lot of time snapsteaming TCM over the last twn years, and before that VHSing AMC (when it was still classic).

    re: the Arnold Conan Movies:
    I have to be limited in my critique of them, in that I have not been able to sit through more than ten minutes or so of either one of them.

    For some people, I am sure they are just the right movie and they got to watch for the first time at just the right age, moment to become ardent fans of them. And that is fine, Nothing wrong with it at all.

    And to be fair to Conan, the only Arnold movie I have watched all the way through is the second Terminator movie. Which I greatly enjoyed.

    - cheers-

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  12. #72
    Idaho Spuds Slam_Bradley's Avatar
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    I just noticed that I haven't actually answered this.

    Having read about half of Howard's work and the vast majority of Burroughs' I feel I can say that neither are even # 1 within their respective author. I certainly prefer Solomon Kane and possibly El Borak and Bran Mak Morn to Conan. As for Burroughs, Billy Byrne is my favorite of his creations. I'm also pretty fond of Carson Napier as a character though I'm luke-warm on most of the Venus novels.

    That said, overall, I prefer Tarzan to Conan. I think the character works better in multiple settings, from pure adventure to fantasy to SF to what-have-you.

  13. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slam_Bradley View Post
    I I'm also pretty fond of Carson Napier as a character...
    me too, but I'm even more fond of Princess Duare.

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  14. #74
    Modus omnibus in rebus Roquefort Raider's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slam_Bradley View Post
    That said, overall, I prefer Tarzan to Conan. I think the character works better in multiple settings, from pure adventure to fantasy to SF to what-have-you.
    Not to mention geriatric porn (as per the works of P. J. Farmer)!
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  15. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slam_Bradley View Post


    How quickly they forget.

    I'd be willing to bet the farm that with people 18 and under Tarzan is more recognizable than Conan by orders of magnitude.
    Quote Originally Posted by InfoBroker View Post
    Amazon (US) search of Tarzan
    ahhh....both good points. I may retract my statements...

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