The Brave and the Bold #17 - Who's your Daddy? *Spoilers*

**Squashua** · 09-17-2008, 01:34 PM

I wasn't going to pick this up. It's Supergirl. It's Raven. Who cares?

Oh man. They didn't say it on the cover; there's no hint.

RETURN OF A CHARACTER LONG FORGOTTEN.

A totally unexpected new Legacy Hero/Villain from a Long Forgotten Hero/Villain.

Man, spoilers if you say who. It was a good read.

**4thHorseman** · 09-17-2008, 01:45 PM

For those of us who didnt' look through this issue, would someone mind spoiling who the returning character is?

**Squashua** · 09-17-2008, 03:35 PM

Originally Posted by 4thHorseman

For those of us who didnt' look through this issue, would someone mind spoiling who the returning character is?

Let's just say it's a TRIUMPHant return.

And by that, I mean to say it's TRIUMPH, or at least his SON that he probably never knew he had because he appears to have conceived him BEFORE the original magnetic disturbance sent him through time.

And the son appears to be suffering from retcon poisoning. Seriously. It's a pretty fucking sweet concept, right out of Astro City.

**Bruce Wayne Jr.** · 09-17-2008, 06:43 PM

I gotta hand it to Wolfman; this was pretty compelling. Let's hope it wraps up well next issue.

**WorstThingUS** · 09-17-2008, 09:29 PM

I thought the art was ugly and apparently no one told him that the evil Zor-El had been retconned away and in fact, the good Zor-El appears this week in Action Comics. This will be the first issue of the new B&B I'm not picking up.

**zilch** · 09-17-2008, 10:12 PM

The vibe i got was Resurection Man.

maybe it was just the artwork.

**RabidWolfe** · 09-18-2008, 05:03 AM

Very interesting that this issue (with Raven going on and on about how she's overcome Trigon) comes out on the same day that over in Titans she gives in to her Dark side yet once again.

**Squashua** · 09-18-2008, 07:54 AM

Originally Posted by WorstThingUS

I thought the art was ugly and apparently no one told him that the evil Zor-El had been retconned away and in fact, the good Zor-El appears this week in Action Comics. This will be the first issue of the new B&B I'm not picking up.

It's not like any of the DC books match up in continuity at all these days anyway.

Just look @ Countdown and Final Crisis.

**CBikle** · 09-18-2008, 09:05 AM

Originally Posted by WorstThingUS

I thought the art was ugly and apparently no one told him that the evil Zor-El had been retconned away and in fact, the good Zor-El appears this week in Action Comics. This will be the first issue of the new B&B I'm not picking up.

I'm a fan of Wolfman's and I like the art, but I think it's funny that none of the Supergirl or Raven stuff matches what's currently going on with their regular books (Are all the DC editors all on strike or something ? Why does this stuff keep happening ?).

I suspect that the "evil Zor-El" thing was necessary for this story to work (I think the premise is about "bad fathers", as that seems to be what connects the 3 characters in the story and I further suspect that the "solution" to the story involves the 3 characters realizing that they are their own people and don't have to be defined by their parents actions or some such.

**WorstThingUS** · 09-18-2008, 09:17 AM

Originally Posted by Squashua

It's not like any of the DC books match up in continuity at all these days anyway.

Just look @ Countdown and Final Crisis.

Originally Posted by CBikle

I'm a fan of Wolfman's and I like the art, but I think it's funny that none of the Supergirl or Raven stuff matches what's currently going on with their regular books (Are all the DC editors all on strike or something ? Why does this stuff keep happening ?).

I suspect that the "evil Zor-El" thing was necessary for this story to work (I think the premise is about "bad fathers", as that seems to be what connects the 3 characters in the story and I further suspect that the "solution" to the story involves the 3 characters realizing that they are their own people and don't have to be defined by their parents actions or some such.

Honestly, it's mostly the art that drove me away. And mentioning Nightwing with no appearance? Marv, of all people...

**Shellhead** · 09-18-2008, 11:21 AM

Like nearly every issue of B&B since Perez left, #17 had disappointing artwork. It wasn't terrible, but it wasn't great either. It's also disappointing that Raven is apparently stuck with the single most boring costume in comics today, because her original look was pretty interesting. The story might have been good, but I put this one back on the rack without reading it.

**DeTroyes** · 09-18-2008, 02:00 PM

Originally Posted by CBikle

I'm a fan of Wolfman's and I like the art, but I think it's funny that none of the Supergirl or Raven stuff matches what's currently going on with their regular books (Are all the DC editors all on strike or something ? Why does this stuff keep happening ?).

Didn't someone at DC (Didio or Waid, perhaps?) describe BATB as taking place in a universe "next to" continuity?

**Jamie** · 09-18-2008, 02:07 PM

Originally Posted by DeTroyes

Didn't someone at DC (Didio or Waid, perhaps?) describe BATB as taking place in a universe "next to" continuity?

That would be appropriate, since the original series took place on "Earth-B."

**CBikle** · 09-18-2008, 04:07 PM

Originally Posted by Jamie

That would be appropriate, since the original series took place on "Earth-B."

Well, just the more "unlikely" stories that Bob Haney wrote that involved stuff like Sgt. Rock, the Earth 1 Spectre, Batman fighting "hippies" or Thomas Wayne jr- Batman's crazy brother.

**CBikle** · 09-18-2008, 04:12 PM

Originally Posted by DeTroyes

Didn't someone at DC (Didio or Waid, perhaps?) describe BATB as taking place in a universe "next to" continuity?

hmm. If that's true, that's a really bad call; for a lot of people, continuity is a big selling point.

Personally, I'm ok with that, but I know it'll hurt sales on the book.