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  1. #16
    Voice of the Authorities Cleric of Hell's Brigade's Avatar
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    I agree with Sharp. At 100 rounds a second, there is no way possible that the Marines can be acurate enough to put all the Knights down. Even if one bullet does multiple men damage, alot of ammo will still be wasted.



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  2. #17
    Moderator Sharpandpointies's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cleric of Hell's Brigade View Post
    I agree with Sharp. At 100 rounds a second, there is no way possible that the Marines can be acurate enough to put all the Knights down. Even if one bullet does multiple men damage, alot of ammo will still be wasted.
    Additionally, the knights killed by bullets don't just vanish when they're hit. They go down, but at that rate, groups of knights might soak up multiple rounds.

    So it's not just the rounds that miss that's a problem...the dying knights will often be struck by multiple rounds. So if a round penetrates one knight and kills the guy behind him...it's quite possible the next round 'kills' them both again, and not someone else.

  3. #18
    Terror On Wheels T51R's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cosmic eagle View Post
    At least it isn't those kinds mounted on warships for dealing with small vessels.....with explosive shells to boot.
    Uhh. THOSE ones have muzzle velocities out the wazoo because part of their design was originally meant to defend carriers against missile attack. Yup, as in shoot down incoming missiles as well as aircraft. they were tied into the ship's fire control system as well. Those bad boys with 500 rounds a piece firing at two different elevations will go for about a 1/4 second. But the rounds should dump enough energy to cut people in half and liquify the area around the wound(depending on the shell used)
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  4. #19
    Hero of Quesadillas Demon King Psycho's Avatar
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    The amunition restritions are theonly thing keeping the marines from winning this easy.

    Though if few enough knights are left the marines may be able to take htem out with the pistol and superior fighting techniquie.
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  5. #20
    Moderator Sharpandpointies's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Demon King Psycho View Post
    The amunition restritions are theonly thing keeping the marines from winning this easy.
    I agree with this.

    Though if few enough knights are left the marines may be able to take htem out with the pistol and superior fighting techniquie.
    Very, very few knights left.

    Considering the inherent accuracy issues with pistols in combat situations, the knights' armor versus the 'armor piercing' pistol ammo (such as it is, with a 9mm), the speed at which the knights remaining on horseback will close, the skill of the knights with their own superior weaponry to the knives of the marines, the armor factor versus the knives of the marines...

    I can't see the marines getting anywhere near one shot-one kill ratios with their pistols.

    And I wouldn't give a knife-armed marine even odds against a single knight on foot, really. Not given the weapon disparity. Knights were very well trained as well.

    I see a small number of knights mobbing the pair of marines and cutting them down, taking some casualties (wounded and killed) due to close-range pistol work.

  6. #21
    Terror On Wheels T51R's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sharpandpointies View Post
    I agree with this.



    Very, very few knights left.

    Considering the inherent accuracy issues with pistols in combat situations, the knights' armor versus the 'armor piercing' pistol ammo (such as it is, with a 9mm), the speed at which the knights remaining on horseback will close, the skill of the knights with their own superior weaponry to the knives of the marines, the armor factor versus the knives of the marines...

    I can't see the marines getting anywhere near one shot-one kill ratios with their pistols.

    And I wouldn't give a knife-armed marine even odds against a single knight on foot, really. Not given the weapon disparity. Knights were very well trained as well.

    I see a small number of knights mobbing the pair of marines and cutting them down, taking some casualties (wounded and killed) due to close-range pistol work.
    What about the Dragon Skin but? How moch coverage does the modern body armour give a soldier?
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  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by T51R View Post
    What about the Dragon Skin but? How moch coverage does the modern body armour give a soldier?
    Not enough to take a full speed lance to the chest or if they somehow survive that being trampled by a large war horse.

  8. #23
    Terror On Wheels T51R's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phrozen View Post
    Not enough to take a full speed lance to the chest or if they somehow survive that being trampled by a large war horse.
    Or getting trapped under a dead warhorse and knight after shooting them both, and suffocating to death.

    My god that would be so bloody ironic.
    "Our cash flow is as if a profligate son keeps borrowing money to spend on Geisha, which is why we donít have a choice not to enjoy the race." ~DOME CO. LTD, on their 2012 LeMans effort...

  9. #24
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    9mm beretta probably isn't going to have enoug oomph to due much damage to a knight with full plate. They actually wore hardened leather and a softer over coat under the plate mail. The bullet might not even penetrate the mail if it is of extremely good quality.

  10. #25
    科学のAIM天使 cosmic eagle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by T51R View Post
    Uhh. THOSE ones have muzzle velocities out the wazoo because part of their design was originally meant to defend carriers against missile attack. Yup, as in shoot down incoming missiles as well as aircraft. they were tied into the ship's fire control system as well. Those bad boys with 500 rounds a piece firing at two different elevations will go for about a 1/4 second. But the rounds should dump enough energy to cut people in half and liquify the area around the wound(depending on the shell used)
    There are pics on the Internet of people hit by normal HMG fire. They looked like jam.

  11. #26
    Moderator Sharpandpointies's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by T51R View Post
    What about the Dragon Skin but? How moch coverage does the modern body armour give a soldier?
    It's more meant to protect against ballistic stuff than axes, swords, maces, or lances. Any of these, in the hands of a proficient wielder wearing plate armor of some kind or another, is going to mean serious trouble for a guy in Dragon Skin armed with a knife.

    I'm also not of the opinion that, when all is said and done, it's going to be two knights against two guys in hand to hand combat, either. :(

    It's more likely to be thirty or forty knights, half of them a-horse, against two guys with pistols that would need a direct-angle shot against the lighter parts of the plate armor to do some damage (and would need to be in reasonably close range to get a shot like that to boot). And their knives.

    It's going to be an ugly mob scene as the knights basically ride them down and hack them up.

  12. #27
    Moderator Sharpandpointies's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by T51R View Post
    Uhh. THOSE ones have muzzle velocities out the wazoo because part of their design was originally meant to defend carriers against missile attack. Yup, as in shoot down incoming missiles as well as aircraft. they were tied into the ship's fire control system as well. Those bad boys with 500 rounds a piece firing at two different elevations will go for about a 1/4 second. But the rounds should dump enough energy to cut people in half and liquify the area around the wound(depending on the shell used)
    Those ones are also 20mm vulcan cannons (Phalanx defense system), not 7.62 mm.

    There is a HUGE difference between a 7.62 round and a .50 BMG round. Which is a 12.7 mm.

    There is, again, a HUGE difference between a 12.7mm round and a 20mm round.

    7.62 stuff, until recently, was used in infantry rifles. In the states, it's pretty much a GPMG (general purpose machinegun) round, rather than an HMG (the old M-60's were 7.62). What cranks the minigun up to HMG status is the grotesque rate of fire. Each individual round isn't any more potent than a single round from an H&K G3 battle rifle.

  13. #28
    科学のAIM天使 cosmic eagle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sharpandpointies View Post
    It's more meant to protect against ballistic stuff than axes, swords, maces, or lances. Any of these, in the hands of a proficient wielder wearing plate armor of some kind or another, is going to mean serious trouble for a guy in Dragon Skin armed with a knife.

    I'm also not of the opinion that, when all is said and done, it's going to be two knights against two guys in hand to hand combat, either. :(

    It's more likely to be thirty or forty knights, half of them a-horse, against two guys with pistols that would need a direct-angle shot against the lighter parts of the plate armor to do some damage (and would need to be in reasonably close range to get a shot like that to boot). And their knives.

    It's going to be an ugly mob scene as the knights basically ride them down and hack them up.
    Is Dragon Skin a fabric or ceramic plates?

  14. #29
    Atomic Powered Superman frostedone's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cosmic eagle View Post
    Is Dragon Skin a fabric or ceramic plates?
    I didn't expect this topic to get 27 replies!

    Dragon Skin armor is a combination of metal, ceramics, and aramid fiber. On the TV show Future Weapons the vest withstood several rounds from an AK47, MP5, M4-Carbine, and a direct hit from a grenade. The armor was heavily damaged, but there was no penetration of the armor.

    Has anyone seen Predator? A guy tears down huge chunks of a forest with a minigun. A mounted one would likely be even more devastating.

    I would guess that the marines would take out at least 850 or so with the Gatling guns, (and about 50 more wounded) then take out maybe another 25 with the AP pistols. The 75 knights left, after pulling out of their shock/fear rush the marines.

  15. #30
    The Skylord FalconX2000's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Immortal Watch Dog View Post
    falconx

    these guns wont be downing one knight per round

    they'll be ripping said knights apart killing their horses splattering their horses and the knights behind them ripping threw them too

    for several feet

    you have to factor just how freaked the fuck out these guys are gonna be

    top it off

    one bullet per knight?
    yeah

    like i said ealrier

    they used to spray fire weaker smaller slower minguns and it would levle cvhunks of forests

    and rip apart men..wildlife and yeah everything

    their gonna mow knights down in spades just fine

    and blood lust or night

    dudes form the eleventh century

    seeing dozens of their comrades

    fly all over the place...from invisible..magic fired by a cricle that spouts out fire by those two grizzled dishevled looking men

    these dudes are gonna freak right rthe fuck out
    Standard rumbles rules says they have common knowledge, so they're at least as somewhat mentally prepared to be mowed through.

    Also, as others have pointed out, it is not 1 bullet per knight and I stand by that. It doesn't matter how many knights each bullet can penetrate, 500 rounds per machine gun just isn't enough. You try spraying rounds from a machine gun in any video game and it becomes obvious you cannot kill 1000 people charging at you with 1000 bullets. ALOT of them are going to miss.

    Oh, and I didn't see anywhere in the OP that specified the knights were mounted on horses.

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