It's Not Easy Being Blue: Nightcrawler Appreciation

**mimschkin** · 06-12-2010, 07:42 AM

Originally Posted by kaktusic

I can't help myself having trouble accepting the whole incest thing.

Anyone who doesn't have trouble with it has problems I think, lol. So gross.

**Koni** · 06-12-2010, 08:54 AM

Originally Posted by kaktusic

I actually liked her as a character, but I can't help myself having trouble accepting the whole incest thing.

No one can have a normal relationship in X-Men, ever. They're uncanny after all.

Now in Weapon X Noir it creeped me out even more because they kept alternating between calling each other "sister" and "liebling".

**Syrinx** · 06-12-2010, 09:24 AM

Originally Posted by kaktusic

It's from Marvel Team-up #89, featuring Spider-Man, Kurt and Amanda. A good issue. From the time they obviously still hadn't thought of making Amanda Kurt's foster sister.

Thank you! Yeah, the whole "dating my sister" thing bugged me too. I like to rationalize it with "weeeell, depending on the story, he was raised more by the circus than by one particular family" except that that throws a wrench in the whole "I killed my brother!" thing which is basically Kurt's pre-X-men angst. He should be allowed to have that. It's a little more interesting than "sideshow freak."

It's interesting to me that the recent Origins reinforced that the Szardoses were Kurt's primary relatives, and whil they didn't portray Jimaine as a love interest, this still left it open so that we have to deal with Kurt and Jimaine dating each other in the future. Strange priorities over at the X-editor's office, I say.

Originally Posted by mimischkin

What do you mean? I use the term 'primo' daily

Well, if it's you, I guess I'll just have to get used to it

**Koni** · 06-12-2010, 09:33 AM

Originally Posted by Syrinx

Thank you! Yeah, the whole "dating my sister" thing bugged me too. I like to rationalize it with "weeeell, depending on the story, he was raised more by the circus than by one particular family" except that that throws a wrench in the whole "I killed my brother!" thing which is basically Kurt's pre-X-men angst. He should be allowed to have that. It's a little more interesting than "sideshow freak."

I'll second that. I liked that Kurt hadn't had to deal with as much outsider angst in his youth. The whole circus upbringing also accounted for his fun and charming personality. Getting raised in a cage, not so much.

**mimschkin** · 06-12-2010, 10:50 AM

Originally Posted by Koni

No one can have a normal relationship in X-Men, ever.

Oh Claremont, how I love thee...

Can anyone tell me this about Amanda/Jimaine: is her "default" state to appear as Jimaine or as Amanda? Because in the Nightcrawler's Inferno issue, it tells us something along the lines of 'oh look, it's Jimaine, whom we have come to know as Amanda Sefton.' It always confused me that if she's actually Jimaine, does she take on the appearance of Amanda all the time afterwards? Because Kurt was like 'oh hey! It's Jimaine, goodie!' but then it's revealed she's Amanda and he says 'oh boyo!' and it's all joyous and everything, but I'm sitting here thinking WTF?

Sorry if that's a really obvious question and I'm just being completely dim.

**Koni** · 06-12-2010, 11:36 AM

Originally Posted by mimschkin

Oh Claremont, how I love thee...

Kurt's actually one of the better relationships in there, isn't he.

Originally Posted by mimschkin

Can anyone tell me this about Amanda/Jimaine: is her "default" state to appear as Jimaine or as Amanda? Because in the Nightcrawler's Inferno issue, it tells us something along the lines of 'oh look, it's Jimaine, whom we have come to know as Amanda Sefton.' It always confused me that if she's actually Jimaine, does she take on the appearance of Amanda all the time afterwards? Because Kurt was like 'oh hey! It's Jimaine, goodie!' but then it's revealed she's Amanda and he says 'oh boyo!' and it's all joyous and everything, but I'm sitting here thinking WTF?

I thought she only altered his perception of her, not her own looks. Could be wrong, of course. It's kind of hard to tell with different artists and whatnot.

**DevilishRogue** · 06-12-2010, 12:05 PM

Originally Posted by Lord Nexus

Truly inspiring and deeply loved by many, words cannot describe the emptiness and void left behind. He is a legend a comrade a friend to us all. My heart goes out to all his family and friends that have adopted him into their lives. A piece of my soul has been stripped but my memories live forever.

I MUST AVENGE THE FALLEN NIGHTCRAWLER

I'm not sure how a feel about that myself... but kurt's religion says its wrong. Though I just had a conversation with a bunch of Catholics and even they cant agree on everything. So knock yourself out. ;-D

WOAH, that action figure is odd... but I like it. What is he supposed to be in those clothes, a circus barker.

Mimschkin! I really like that issue of Excalibur. Kurt wanted to take the car out for a spin but Kitty got pissed. I think Kurt was treating Kitty like a child... but oh well. I think he just wanted an excuse to take the car out.

**mimschkin** · 06-12-2010, 12:41 PM

Originally Posted by Koni

I thought she only altered his perception of her, not her own looks. Could be wrong, of course. It's kind of hard to tell with different artists and whatnot.

That would make more sense than my stupid theory. But then she'd also have to change the perceptions of all the X-Men in the room at that point? That was a weird story, really. I'm so confused. I think I'll just put it in a box and let it fester

Originally Posted by DevilishRogue

Mimschkin! I really like that issue of Excalibur. Kurt wanted to take the car out for a spin but Kitty got pissed. I think Kurt was treating Kitty like a child... but oh well. I think he just wanted an excuse to take the car out.

I really like the image of Kurt cruisin' down the highway for some reason. He should've been allowed to do that just once in his life.

**kaktusic** · 06-13-2010, 02:30 AM

OK, so...I've just read Nightcrawler:Origins and yes, the art is beautiful, the story is touching, but...
...this IS an alternate reality or something, right? Because it doesn't fit into anything else in the character's history, or into numerous stories that had been already written about his past, Amanda's past, Stefan, the circus...?

**Castel** · 06-13-2010, 02:37 AM

Erff, i just hated this origins stuff.

His time in a circus is supposed to have been a good time, one he has fond memory of.

Not some cheap Les Miserables rip-off.

**Koni** · 06-13-2010, 04:04 AM

Originally Posted by kaktusic

OK, so...I've just read Nightcrawler:Origins and yes, the art is beautiful, the story is touching, but...
...this IS an alternate reality or something, right? Because it doesn't fit into anything else in the character's history, or into numerous stories that had been already written about his past, Amanda's past, Stefan, the circus...?

I guess it was a way to give people new to the character something to hold on to, without having to go digging in various back-issues, when jumping into Second Coming. And making Kurt a martyr from his sad sad youth on. :/

Now when/if Marvel brings him back, they'll have another chance to go clean slate and mess up their pretension of continuity further.

Originally Posted by Castel

Erff, i just hated this origins stuff.

His time in a circus is supposed to have been a good time, one he has fond memory of.

Not some cheap Les Miserables rip-off.

Seconded. Angsty past does not a bette characterisation make.

**kaktusic** · 06-13-2010, 04:39 AM

Originally Posted by Koni

I guess it was a way to give people new to the character something to hold on to, without having to go digging in various back-issues, when jumping into Second Coming. And making Kurt a martyr from his sad sad youth on. :/
Angsty past does not a bette characterisation make.

I hope nobody will hold onto this. It's just so wrong. Starting from simply deleting a plethora of important things in Kurt's past (origin of his last name, the way Mistyque abandoned him, happy childhood, relationship with Jimaine- even that is better than this- Amos Jardine, Florida, Stefan's death, the circumstances in which Xavier found him), to being simply illogical. Nothing that grows up in a cage turns out to be a happy-go-lucky, bright person Kurt turned out to be. Had he been living like that his entire childhood, there's no way he'd ever had the opportunity to develop his pirate obsession, Erroll Flynn fandom, learn to fence, or even to read and write. Margali was a sorceress; certainly she hadn't been on the bottom of her powers for Kurt's entire life, unable to help him?
The only thing that is half-decently explained is Kurt's religious background, except it doesn't fit anywhere in the continuity we knew.
Is there somebody in Marvel who specifically hates Nightcrawler and Storm and takes delight in making them pathetic?

**mimschkin** · 06-13-2010, 05:59 AM

Yeesh, the more I read about it, the happier I am that I didn't read the Origins book =/

Also, happy 100th page, Nightcrawlerers

**Koni** · 06-13-2010, 06:31 AM

Originally Posted by mimschkin

Yeesh, the more I read about it, the happier I am that I didn't read the Origins book =/

I like it well enough as an angsty re-imagining or something, but it doesn't make it into my personal canon. But hey, at least the art was great.

His circus costume was pretty meh though.

Originally Posted by mimschkin

Also, happy 100th page, Nightcrawlerers

And a hundred more!