Rachel Summers/Grey Appreciation

[Mormel]

Despite all the activity buzzing in the Dazzler thread, Polaris thread, Psylocke thread at the moment I start THIS little thread, I felt I had to give it a shot. I sort of owe it to Ray: she's the one who sucked me into actively collecting X-Men, and now that she's been written out of the flagship title, I had better support her.

This thread will be where Rachel fans and Rachel enthusiasts talk about Rachel. I've noticed a number of passionate Rachel fans here on CBR, and, yes, she is popular enough to support more than one site dedicated to her. But this thread will be Rachel's stronghold, Rachel's embassy on CBR. I hope Brian Cronin will allow a fourth big character thread. If not, it can lay low till one of the other threads enters (temporary) hibernation. :)

If you wish to talk about your favourite Rachel moment in comic books, post in THIS thread:http://forums.comicbookresources.com...ad.php?t=99763

If you wish to post Rachel art, post in THIS thread:http://forums.comicbookresources.com...ad.php?t=94497

>whew!<

Very well then...
We will kick off with you, the Rachel fan or enthusiast, telling about why you like Rachel; how did you get introduced to her, what is it about her that appeals to you?
(I wil post my own reasons after some of you guys have had your turn... Maybe it's against the rules, but I'd feel impolite starting.)

[Pro]

Rachel is great. She was one of the characters that made me collect the x-men on a regular basis.

She is the posterchild for mutant abuse, coming from a future where mutants were largely killed off or imprisoned in disposal camps. She personifies one of the classic x-men stories, Days of Future Past, which more than any story made it abundantly clear what will happenif the x-men fail to bring about their dream. Her family ties to two of the original x-men firmly grounds her in x-men history.

I didn't care much for how shje was written by Claremont when he returned, aside from End of Greys. It just seemed she had been regressed from a holocaust survivor to a teeniebobber.

[Daithi]

I started reading Excalibur which introduced me to Rachel. I enjoyed this almost alien character and the cool visual stuff that Alan Davis gave her.

From there I tried to read as much as possible. I love the early Claremont/Romita stuff. UXM 196 still remains one of my favourite issues, rooted in the basic human vs mutants story. Loved the dynamic between Magneto and Rachel too. Always disappointed that Magneto and Rachel never get to interact anymore.

I didn't care much for how shje was written by Claremont when he returned, aside from End of Greys. It just seemed she had been regressed from a holocaust survivor to a teeniebobber.

While I loved End of Greys, looking back it was merley duplicating Rachel's past, replacing the USA government with the Shi'ar. Instead of moving on from Rachel's survivor guilt, Claremont repeats it again.

[Pro]

While I loved End of Greys, looking back it was merley duplicating Rachel's past, replacing the USA government with the Shi'ar. Instead of moving on from Rachel's survivor guilt, Claremont repeats it again.

I suppose so yea. I do think that Rachel should always have that guilt with her in some small measure. I recall how my grandmother was scared to death of locks due to having been imprisoned in world war 2. Didn't mean she stopped growing as a person but things like that tend to leave permanent scars. The difference between Rachel in Excalibur and the one that popped up after Morrison was jarring to say the least.

[Daithi]

I suppose so yea. I do think that Rachel should always have that guilt with her in some small measure. I recall how my grandmother was scared to death of locks due to having been imprisoned in world war 2. Didn't mean she stopped growing as a person but things like that tend to leave permanent scars. The difference between Rachel in Excalibur and the one that popped up after Morrison was jarring to say the least.

Oh yeah absolutely. She never got over her survivors guilt thing though. Alan Davis had break down the mental stuff that Ahab and Mojo imposed on her but she never forgot about her past.

But yeah Rachel Grey never got on the right foot and she's never really got back to her self. I still think Weinberg's Rachel is the best example of a post Askani-Excalibur Rachel.

I think that despite being the daughter of the first two X-Men, she never fitted in with them. She's more a Sci-Fi superhero that could be doing a Silver Surfer/Thor job. She fitted in with Excalibur because it was all about that.

While I'm eager for the Starjamm..."Emperor Vulcan" mini, it's a pity she's not on Earth. Fightening the Hulk, looking for Magneto, filling in for Cable. Rachel and Deadpool!

[Dagger]

I used to like Rachel, she was just never one of my favorite characters. I liked her until she became Phoenix, and her becoming over-powered. I don't really care for cosmically powered characters in books that, for the most part, are meant to be more down to earth. How frightening is it if a person can go toe to toe with a character who can devour planets? I especially didn't care for her portrayal from the beginning of Claremont's latest run on Uncanny. Wow, was she a trainwreck of a poorly written character. She was sooo whiny. And she was soo powerful, but was constantly getting pwned by everyone and their sister. She fricken created a black hole, yet couldn't stop a dinosaur from turning her into R'Chll. It was pathetic.

[Daithi]

I liked her until she became Phoenix, and her becoming over-powered. I don't really care for cosmically powered characters in books that, for the most part, are meant to be more down to earth.

I agree here. As I said I though she was fine in Excalibur because it wasn't a down to earth type of book.

However I did like the arc in Uncanny leading to Wolverine trying to kill her. It wasn't the fact that she was powerful, it was what she was willing to do with that power.

[Dagger]

I agree here. As I said I though she was fine in Excalibur because it wasn't a down to earth type of book.

However I did like the arc in Uncanny leading to Wolverine trying to kill her. It wasn't the fact that she was powerful, it was what she was willing to do with that power.

OH, yeah, I loved that story. But, I would have loved to see her lose the phoenix power and name after that story. She, Kitty, Storm and Rogue were my favorites from the Storm, Wolvie, Colossus, Nightcrawler, Kitty, Rogue and Ray team.

[Askani's Flame]

Rachel also was my way into the world of X-Men. I got hooked on her from reading the "Days of Our Future Present" annuals and then started collecting as many Excalibur and X-Men as I could with her in it.

In regards to her survivor's guilt, it should be there in some form. I know that she got over some of it when she went back to her reality and fixed the future there, and also when she switched places with Brian in the timestream. But it's still just beneath the surface.

My hopes are that when she gets back she has grown out of her "Rachel Grey" phase. All of these experiences recently should make her a calculating and strong young woman. Not some silly cheerleader that trips down stairs after having a costume with 3 inch heels most of her run in the Marvel Universe.

[DDM]

Rachel Summers is a very complicated character in that she comes from a dystopia Earth ruled by Sentinels on the verge of World War III with Europe; mutants are either killed outright, jailed in concentration camps within the United States, or, like Rachel herself, brainwashed, tortured, & branded with permanent facial tattoos to become Hounds. Living in the present alternate Earth reminds Rachel every day of her ghosts. Therefore, once she taps into her potential as Phoenix, Rachel overcompensates by literally almost destroying the universe to kill the Beyonder in Uncanny X-Men #202-203 by power given to her by the Beyonder himself, she goes recklessly into battle with Freedom Force only to be taken out by Spiral in Uncanny X-Men #206 then culminates in Rachel's attempted murder of Selene, the Hellfire Club's Black Queen, trying to silence Phoenix's ghosts, in Uncanny X-Men #207 to only be mortally wounded by her teammate Wolverine! This of course lead to both the Lords Cardinal & the X-Men to find Phoenix, but Spiral ended up with the prize. Uncanny X-Men #207-209 has so many unexpected twists & turns that the story remains compelling to reread over & over again.

Rachel Summers, as Phoenix, is one of my favorite characters because she is so different from the Jean Grey, Phoenix. I hope Marvel eventually comes to their senses to allow Rachel Summers to officially be Phoenix again.

[jarrod]

I'm excited to see what Yost does in Emporer Vulcan, which from what I understand was in part greenlit due to blowback requests from the diehard Rachel fans writing in. She seems a pretty popular character, despite being absent for most of the 1990s, horribly handled recently by Claremont/Brubaker and not really appearing notably in any mainstream cross-media projects.... hopefully she returns to the fold (and drops birdboy) when Yost's done.

Ideally, I'd like to see Carey handling her, preferably on a team with Nathan, Kurt, Kitty and/or Rogue, but I wouldn't mind seeing Ellis or Cornell take a shot either. Rachel's concept has always seemed like a good position to take a more sci-fi slant with the character imo, it's really a shame her background in "being from the future" gets perpetually limited to survivor's guilt plots. Really, I think any of the three current X-brits could do wonders with her though.

And while I like the diversity we've got in the core books, I feel like we probably missed out on some great Rachel stories when Millar passed on taking over the line. She's a character he clearly enjoys, as even her too brief cameos in Wolverine and Civil War show the sort of headstrong, inventive, capable Rachel we should be getting month to month. Hmmm... maybe Millar could use her in FF? ;)

[Flâneur]

Rachel and Deadpool!

Oh I'd pay to see that. I bet the first cover would have the two of them back to back, both in Marvel Girl costumes.:p

And while I like the diversity we've got in the core books, I feel like we probably missed out on some great Rachel stories when Millar passed on taking over the line. She's a character he clearly enjoys, as even her too brief cameos in Wolverine and Civil War show the sort of headstrong, inventive, capable Rachel we should be getting month to month.

I think we would probably have gotten Ultimate Jean if Millar wrote Rachel on a recurring basis - not that that would be a bad thing but it would be a rewrite just as much as the recent Claremont/Brubaker screw up. Albeit more interesting to read about.

[jarrod]

PS: this thread needz a poll. Maybe we could do fave Ray incarnation, but I think the spikes/heels Phoenix of early Excalibur would probably win.

[Dagger]

PS: this thread needz a poll. Maybe we could do fave Ray incarnation, but I think the spikes/heels Phoenix of early Excalibur would probably win.

But she had a mullet with that outfit!!!! EGADS, THE HORROR!!!:p

[jarrod]

I think we would probably have gotten Ultimate Jean if Millar wrote Rachel on a recurring basis - not that that would be a bad thing but it would be a rewrite just as much as the recent Claremont/Brubaker screw up. Albeit more interesting to read about.

I dunno... Ultimate Jean always felt more like Rachel in the first place to me actually, so I probably wouldn't have minded. :P

Really though, the brief glimpses we got of Millar's Rachel seemed pretty different from U-Jean... the only moments we got that felt at all Ultimatish were when she'd tell "dad" to shove it. <3 <3 <3