Captain America #25 *Spoilers*

**Pach!** · 03-07-2007, 09:50 PM

Originally Posted by Charles01

Well until the return of Steve Rogers as the one true Captain America, I'm not buying one more Marvel Comic book from any series. I made the mistake of trusting Ed Brubaker with one of my favorite comic book icon, thinking he wanted only the very best for Steve Rogers and only work in his best interest; but I was so wrong, and I profoundly regret even buying anything written by Ed in the past, and if I had the chance to start over I would never have encourage his work in any way, a mistake I won't repeat ever again, I promise

And for all this nonsense and aggravation, I'm boycotting all of Marvel and invite everyone to do the same

Welcome to my writer ignore list Brubaker, Thanks for nothing, and you can forget about me picking up your Iron Fist or DD or X-Men or your Icon series, or anything else you have publish anywhere from now on

Marvel needs a long overdue major clean up from top to bottom of its administration, because they really suck

I will join your cause, and leave all comics and try to get a LIFE.

**Shellhead** · 03-07-2007, 10:03 PM

Originally Posted by Capt USA

you missed an issue, not sure what it was, but I'm thinking the last issue before the current series. Really dumb Cap is blown up by terrorist in a small town.

Ah. I missed that one. See that's the most important reason to buy every Marvel comic. If you don't, you might miss the temporary death of one of their main heroes. Because that's how you know that you're reading an important and mature comic, when somebody gets killed temporarily. That is much more realistic than the standard silver age action when nobody got killed temporarily.

**bulbasteve** · 03-07-2007, 10:04 PM

Originally Posted by Shellhead

That's a very good point.

Now what *does* make Cap's death less tragic, sad or meaningful is that this is at least the fourth time that Cap has been "killed," not counting the other guys named Cap who were killed, like Roscoe the bodybuilder or William Naslund (formerly known as the Spirit of '76) or the MC2 Cap from Last Planet Standing.

1. Onslaught killed Cap and numerous other major Marvel heroes.
2. The End (to be fair, everybody else died, too, except for Thanos, Adam Warlock and a couple of others.)
3. Universe X (sure it was a future version from one potential future, but Marvel made enough of a big deal of it to print a special one-shot issue on the topic.

Well the worst part for me was number 3 was just so much better than this issue. Because it wasn't a "tune in next time" issue, it was really and believably the FINAL Steve Rogers story (even though he showed up in ghost form all throughout the rest of the series).

Heck did Cap even have one real line of dialogue this whole issue? Sure it gave some flashbacks which made it slightly better than the Death of Superman but really what did this comic have to SAY about Captain America the man or even Cap the icon? Did we learn anything new about him, was an aspect of his pyschology revealed to us? No, we just had a bunch of talking heads, some action and a death. The only good thing to come out of this issue is the hope that The Confession or Fallen Son are actually seriously able to deal with Cap instead of it just being an "event".

**Capt Hunter** · 03-07-2007, 10:04 PM

**grpunk** · 03-07-2007, 10:06 PM

Originally Posted by Charles01

Well until the return of Steve Rogers as the one true Captain America, I'm not buying one more Marvel Comic book from any series. I made the mistake of trusting Ed Brubaker with one of my favorite comic book icon, thinking he wanted only the very best for Steve Rogers and only work in his best interest; but I was so wrong, and I profoundly regret even buying anything written by Ed in the past, and if I had the chance to start over I would never have encourage his work in any way, a mistake I won't repeat ever again, I promise

And for all this nonsense and aggravation, I'm boycotting all of Marvel and invite everyone to do the same

Welcome to my writer ignore list Brubaker, Thanks for nothing, and you can forget about me picking up your Iron Fist or DD or X-Men or your Icon series, or anything else you have publish anywhere from now on

Marvel needs a long overdue major clean up from top to bottom of its administration, because they really suck

Dear god cant you just enjoy a story. I mean sure an icon was killed but it made sense as far as the story goes and it was done so well. If you really want to boycott such an amazing writer by all means go ahead, but he is writing some of the best comics coming out right now. Iron fist is amazing, Criminal is dark and gritty and just plain good his x-men is one of the better x space operas. So I hope you enjoy reading the back of your cereal box.

**Nomad** · 03-07-2007, 10:06 PM

Just finished. It's been my day off, and the mail came late on account of the weather, (I have a subscription) but everyone who stopped by my home made sure to let their favorite cap fan know that his hero had made national news. I only purchased American liquor tonight.

Like the good Dr. said "The American Dream truly is f#cked. I didn't believe it until now, and I'm not sure this is the reason."

**Berkey** · 03-07-2007, 10:11 PM

All I'm saying is in CW# 7 Captain America says they are not arresting Captian America but Steve Rogers. So I say yes Cap is dead the coustume and icon but steve rogers is still alive somewhere reclaiming his thoughts about the America he defends then he will come back when it appears a certain situation looks hopeless say WORLD WAR HULk maybe just my thoughts

What a great way to get publicity all over the news and guess what my comic shop was swarmming with people I never see buying this comic. He also has a movie comming up so I don't see him dead for too long. Scarlet witch and Hawkeye were dead for all of what 1 year close to 2 and they're back. It's a great way to get people interested in comics and maybe just maybe they will pick up some others thats my thought

**Beast** · 03-07-2007, 10:20 PM

Originally Posted by Berkey

All I'm saying is in CW# 7 Captain America says they are not arresting Captian America but Steve Rogers.

That's symbolic. Captain America is a symbol and an ideal. Where as Steve Rogers is a man. That's why he said that. I think you're really reading way too much into those comments.

**Berkey** · 03-07-2007, 10:21 PM

Originally Posted by Beast

That's symbolic. Captain America is a symbol and an ideal. Where as Steve Rogers is a man. That's why he said that. I think you're really reading way too much into those comments.

maybe but if you look at it you can say that Cap is dead all you want and it wouldn't be a lie technically. I don't know I just like to think all conspiricay style

**Erik Lehnsherr** · 03-07-2007, 10:40 PM

I never thought they had the guts to take him out. I had pretty much been off of the Net all day and just checked my email and eventually saw the news stories about "the death of an American Icon". It's MIND BOGGLING that they would let Tony go over like this in such dominant fashion while Captain pretty much gives up and his next appearance is him getting killed. A damn shame.

**Will.S** · 03-07-2007, 10:51 PM

Originally Posted by kal_el21

I just read it. It's late and I'm not looking through 29 pages of posts to see if anybody else asked this...

Unfortunately out of morbid curiosity I actually looked through every page. Very interesting responses (while other were predictable and wacky).

What are odds that Fury switched Cap with an LMD? They've been saying since 'Secret War' that the new ones were "surprisingly real" and could one of those be programmed to react just as Steve Rogers would in that situation?

I wouldn't be suprised.

There's certainly alot going on here. Faustus controlled Sharon under the false guise of Nick Fury's voice while the real Nick is talking to Bucky. The sniper could have been Crossbones but that's too easy so he was most likely there for misdirection, Sin is also there to rendezvous with Sharon so there's more to this.

I really liked the issue and Bucky/Falcon's reactions but I wasn't quite that shocked about Cap's "death". Perhaps it's because it hasn't hit home yet but I think I've become desensitized to deaths like this especially with a high profile character like Cap. If anything I'll be interested to see the turnout in his funeral scene which should be comparable to Superman's in Death of Superman. Plus I'm very curious to see the focus of the book shift onto the remaining cast and if the Punisher will factor into this somehow seeing as how he has the mask.

**Charles01** · 03-07-2007, 11:22 PM

Originally Posted by grpunk

Dear god cant you just enjoy a story. I mean sure an icon was killed but it made sense as far as the story goes and it was done so well. If you really want to boycott such an amazing writer by all means go ahead, but he is writing some of the best comics coming out right now. Iron fist is amazing, Criminal is dark and gritty and just plain good his x-men is one of the better x space operas. So I hope you enjoy reading the back of your cereal box.

Well, if I can live without Steve Rogers as the one true Captain America, than I can certainly easily live without anything else Marvel would ever have to offer, trust me on that. As for reading the back of cereal boxes as a substitute to comics, like internationally Marvel was all there is, still those cereal boxes are probably more of an interesting intelligent read that all that nonsense civil war gimmick stuffing

**Jonah Weiland** · 03-07-2007, 11:29 PM

So, did all the attention "Captain America" #25 received catch Marvel by surprise? We asked EiC Joe Quesada exactly that question, including what this moment means for the Marvel U and where things go from here.

http://www.comicbookresources.com/ne...em.cgi?id=9914

**Dusty.** · 03-07-2007, 11:30 PM

Regardless of who liked it and didn't, can we all at least agree that Steve Epting is freaking awesome! Damn, did he ever draw the hell out of this issue. The emotion and tension that he conveyed through his art desrves to win him an Eisner. Ed deserves one, too, because he would have won if Winter Soldier had been submitted.

Seeing Epting's art displayed on a national level has been a great thing for me, because I've long touted him as the best artist in comics, and it feels like the rest of the world was given proof of that.

I've been a fan of Steve's since his great Avengers days, and he always seemed to be better than other more highly touted artists. I recall an Avengers/X-Men crossover that took place in the 90's, and I thought Epting's art clearly outshined the artist who drew the X-Men issue. (a guy named Andy Kubert)

When he went over to Crossgen (with the level of artists that they had, Epting, Pelletier, Perkins, Guice, Perez, etc... how DID they fail? They had good writers, too) that's when he reinvented his already strong style, and leapfrogged everybody in the field. I only do Marvel now, but I'd pick up his Crossgen stuff if they collected it.

His covers are just out of this world. Look at the power of the cover to 25. The newspaper background, the drippings of blood, the handcuff, the motionless hand of one of the greatest iconic heroes ever created... If that doesn't win "cover of the year", there is no justice in the comic book community. I would love if Marvel would let Steve do an original montage cover for the upcoming trade instead of using a pre-existing cover.

I can't wait for this story to unfold. It's off to a great start! Sorry to interrupt, but I had to give some serious props and congratulations to my favorite artist.

**tonearcher** · 03-07-2007, 11:36 PM

I hope Cap stays dead because things should have repercussions in comics or else it's like Family Guy, an occasional thing will change but for the most part everything starts fresh. Captain America isn't for this time, and it hurts to say. Fighting russians and nazi's are over. And after the handling of CA during the CW there was really nothing left. The cap in jail arc would of been mega-lame.