The Rolling Stones thread!

[Ilash]

Ok, partly just for the hell of it and partly because I don't think it's right that Guns and Roses should have their own dedicated thread while these guys shouldn't, here's a place to talk all things Rolling Stones.

They have been around for over forty years and they are arguably (not arguably to me, mind you) the greatest representative of the genre of music we call rock and roll so I think there should be some stuff to talk about but just to get this thread started here's a few topics/ questions that might be of interest:

Which album from those golden years between Beggars Banquet and Exile on Main Street is your favourite? Were they in fact the greatest rock and roll band of all time during these years?

What do you think about their early covers-heavy R&B period?

The Stones pop period - 60s pop gold or pale Beatles imitators?

Goats Head Soup through Black and Blue - creative slump or underrated Stonesy goodness?

Some Girls - Comeback album or more of the same?

They sucked in the 80s (?) but was Tattoo You a brief shining light in the darkness and for that matter was it their last truly great album?

Steel Wheels to today - should they have packed it in or are you glad that they're still around? Have any of these albums been able to measure up to the past masterpieces? Does it matter?

700000 live albums, which are worth it?

Favourite Stones guitarist?

Any good bootlegs?

Etc...

So hey, I take it most people know these guys and most people have their opinions about them so he post away and maybe we'll get some nice discussion going.

[Ontir]

I'm not in-depth enough to list by eras, but I know what I like:

Paint it Black
She's a Rainbow
Ruby Tuesday
Mother's Little Helper
2,000 Light Years From Home
You Can't Always Get What You Want
Gimme Shelter (my absolute favourite!)
Emotional Rescue
Waiting on a Friend
Miss You
Almost Hear You Sigh
Continental Drift
... and many others which slip my mind, at the moment.

[david r]

Great idea for a thread, man. The Rolling Stones are my 2nd favorite rock band ever (behind the Fab Four.) I have all their CDs and seem to continually find new gems like "Winter" or "Blue Turns to Grey" to cherish.

1) Favorite record from '68 to '72?? It would have to be 1971's Sticky Fingers. I bought the reissue in 1994, with the zipper on the CD cover, and that album blew me away!! The Stones rocking at their absolute best. Mick Taylor on guitar was incredible. Sticky Fingers is the blueprint of much of the rock 'n' roll output that would follow, from Aerosmith to Guns N' Roses to Black Crowes. An amazing album.

Were they the best band during '68-'72? That is a difficult one. Along with Led Zeppelin, Jimi Hendrix, CCR, Black Sabbath, the Who, etc. I would say, by the early 70s, the Rolling Stones had really hit their peak, creatively. So yeah, they were probably the crowning kings.

2) I like their early R&B-tinged music. I always think of Brian Jones when I remember the early Stones. Covers like "Route 66" or "Not Fade Away" sound old-fashioned now, but I like the Stones started so early. (However, Keith's guitar playing often sounds like a rubber-band on these early tunes!!)

3) The Stones pop period: Awfully reminiscient to the Beatles' pop? Yes, this is pretty true. "As Tears Goes By" is straight-up stealing from "Yesterday". But I still enjoyed that period.

4) I enjoy their mid-70s "slump". There are many hidden gems on those records. Who can't like "Winter", "Memory Motel" or "Time Waits For No One"??

5) Some Girls rocks! The Stones play a little punk, and a little disco. This is their biggest selling studio album, so it was obviously their comeback record. (Though they never really went away.) "Beast of Burden", "Miss You", "Shattered", "When the Whip Comes Down", "Respectable" are all spectacular songs.

6) Their 1980s output is less good. I think Mick Jagger just stopped caring. I like Tattoo You , it has many good moments. I also liked 1989's Steel Wheels, and feel those two are their best 80s albums. I despise Dirty Work (1986) and consider it their worst album ever!!

7) I loved 1994's Voodoo Lounge. They showed some range on this CD, and tried to do some surprising things. I actually feel that Voodoo Lounge was their best record since Some Girls!! I liked it that much. 1997's Bridges to Babylon I also liked a lot. So I am definitely glad that the Stones have continued to record new music. Why the hell can't they? Last year's A Bigger Bang was good, but I haven't liked it as much as their 90s records.

8) Favorite guitar players? Obviously, Keith Richards has a very special place. But Mick Taylor is arguably the best guitar musician the band ever had. And I hold a special spot for Brian Jones, because he had such a pivotal role in the roots of the band. I wish Brian had lived.

[leonaozaki]

Which album from those golden years between Beggars Banquet and Exile on Main Street is your favourite? Were they in fact the greatest rock and roll band of all time during these years?

Hmm...probably a toss-up between Beggars Banquet and Exile on Main Street. Of course I love Let it Bleed and Sticky Fingers but Beggars gets many points for including many of my favorite Stones songs and Exile is of course great from end to end, which you can't really say about Let it Bleed or Sticky Fingers.

Were they the greatest rock and roll band? That's tougher. I'm not really interested in these Thor vs. Hulk contests, but that was definitely their peak as a band. They're certainly in my top 5 for making the most interesting music during the late 60's/early 70's (along with Neil Young/Crazy Horse, the Band, David Bowie, the Velvets)

What do you think about their early covers-heavy R&B period?

Once Mick Jagger stopped sounding like he was trying to do blackface ("I Want to be Loved") I like this period an awful lot. My favorite of the first three is probably NOW! because of their ace covers of Chuck Berry and Bo Diddley.

The Stones pop period - 60s pop gold or pale Beatles imitators?

Well, they always had a bit more edge to them than the Beatles ever did so it's tough to call them imitators-- although their blatant 'response' to Sgt. Pepper's did fall pretty flat. I really like BETWEEN THE BUTTONS and FLOWERS; "Backstreet Girl" is a great song and "Ruby Tuesday" has always moved me more than any comparable song in the Beatles catalog that isn't "A Day in the Life."

Goats Head Soup through Black and Blue - creative slump or underrated Stonesy goodness?

Three words: Too. Much. Heroin. I like what I've heard from BLACK AND BLUE. Otherwise: eh. There's so much other music from this period from other artists that I enjoy so much more that I don't know why I would bother with the Stones' smack days.

Some Girls - Comeback album or more of the same?

Most of this record I enjoy. However it gets docked many many points for including one of the stupidest songs the Stones have ever recorded: "Far Away Eyes." I loaaaaathe that song. I suppose this was a comeback album of sorts but by then the punks had stolen much of the Stones' thunder; witness their next record, the lamentable EMOTIONAL RESCUE.

They sucked in the 80s (?) but was Tattoo You a brief shining light in the darkness and for that matter was it their last truly great album?

"Start Me Up," "Waiting on a Friend," and "Undercover of the Night:" great. All available on compiliations, so there's no reason to own TATTOO YOU or UNDERCOVER.

Steel Wheels to today - should they have packed it in or are you glad that they're still around? Have any of these albums been able to measure up to the past masterpieces? Does it matter?

STEEL WHEELS starts out strong ("Sad, Sad, Sad" and "Mixed Emotions" are fun, dirty rockers) but get stupid real quick. I liked VOODOO LOUNGE a lot but it's waaaaay too long and runs out of energy four or five tracks before the end. Based on that experience I've never felt the need to buy BRIDGES TO BABYLON or A BIGGER BANG. I like that they're still rocking 40 years on but let's face it: the Stones stopped being a vital musical force in 1972.

700000 live albums, which are worth it?

GET YER YA-YA'S OUT. Everything else is fodder for the Strolling Bones Make-Money-All-the-Time machine.

Favourite Stones guitarist?

Other than Keef? Well, for pure musicianship I give the nod to Mick Taylor, but for sheer gonzo brilliance of course it's Brian Jones.

rob

[Jonathan Bogart]

As I think I've said before, my two favorite Stones albums are Exile on Main St and Between the Buttons. They're so different that I barely think of them as being by the same band.

I'm not going to answer the List O' Questions, because I don't have so much invested in the Stones that I have a worthwhile answer to most of them. Sure, they were great. But without a SuperECWFan to keep the conversation going with boundless enthusiasm for the Stones, I think the GNR thread will long outperform this one.

[Spike-X]

"I love the Stones. I can't believe they're still doing it after all these years.

Fred and Barney..."

Oh, and it's a tossup between Beggar's Banquet and Let It Bleed. Exile On Main Street would have made a great single album.

[howyadoin]

I'll chime in tomorrow when I'm more sober, but in the meantime let me say that for awhile there they definitely were the World's Greatest Rock 'n' Roll Band, and that Mick Jagger is and will always be the definition of "rock star".

[Buried Alien]

I'll chime in tomorrow when I'm more sober, but in the meantime let me say that for awhile there they definitely were the World's Greatest Rock 'n' Roll Band, and that Mick Jagger is and will always be the definition of "rock star".

Your nonsobriety is among the most coherent I've ever seen. My admiration to you.

As for the Stones, I'll contribute by saying that I attended their November, 2002 show in Anaheim, California and thoroughly enjoyed it. The tickets were too expensive, but the band gives you your money's worth. Not bad for a bunch of guys who by all rights should have stopped rocking thirty years ago.

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

[Ilash]

Well, might as well answer some of my own questions.

Which album from those golden years between Beggars Banquet and Exile on Main Street is your favourite? Were they in fact the greatest rock and roll band of all time during these years?

My favourite Stones album, and one of my top 3 albums ever is Let It Bleed so that one gets the nod. I love all of their albums from this period, of course but Beggars Banquet is probably my least favourite mainly because it just feels like Let It Bleed was the same album only better in just about every respect. Sticky Fingers does seem like a blueprint for much of seventies rock and roll and it has eight of the best songs I've ever heard in my life but I'm not too mad about I've Got the Blues and You've Gotta Move (they're both perfectly good though). Exile is probably the most singular album of all time and is probably my second favourite Stones album. It's just filled with these contradictions that make the album like nothing you've ever heard before. It's got a lot of filler yet its perfect from beginning to end. It's a simple, roots rock album and yet it's so complex and layered that there's new stuff to discover with each and every listen. The production is a muddled mess that also somehow happens to be incredibly clear, warm, lively and even spacious. Jagger's vocals are buried in the mix but overall the album contains some of his best singing ever.

And yes, they were the greatest band of all time at that point with only the Who offering them any real competition, in my opinion.

What do you think about their early covers-heavy R&B period?

I don't like it quite as much as ther other good periods thanks in large part to Keith "elastic-sounding guitars" (thanks David R, that sums it up perfectly) and indeed the general poorness of the production on these records, even on the new remasters. Sill, there's lots of good to be found here and the best of these is probably NOW.

The Stones pop period - 60s pop gold or pale Beatles imitators?

This whole period strikes me as being very underrated. Everyone likes the singles from these years but even Stones fans seem to constantly overlook pretty much perfect pop albums like Between the Buttons and Flowers. Aftermath is great too even if Going Home is muuuch too long. As for Satanics, well, while I hardly love it, I do respect how far out the Stones were willing to go here. As for it being a Sgt Peppers rip off, well, since so few of the songs sound even remotely close to what the Beatles were doing, I just don't see it. Between the Buttons is closer is sound and feel to Sgt Peppers than Satanics ever was.

Goats Head Soup through Black and Blue - creative slump or underrated Stonesy goodness?

Again, fairly underrated. None of these albums were perfect but they all had enough great moments that they're very much worth it. Goats Head Soup had 100 Years ago, Angie, Dancing with Mr D (how can you not love that groove) and one of my all time favourite songs, Winter. IORR had the title track, Fingerprint File and three very nice, if over long, ballads to choose from. Black and Blue had Memory Hotel, Melody and Hot Stuff and is just a fun, groovy if ultimately lightweight album from beginning to end.

Some Girls - Comeback album or more of the same?

A definite improvement over the last few albums and aside for Lies, it's GREAT from beginning to end. Miss You is the best Disco track ever thanks to that very underrated guitar riff, mesmerising groove and irreverant atmosphere. When the Whip Comes Down is just a fast, fun dirty rocker. Just My Imagination is a good cover that does admittedly pale in comparison to the original. Some Girls another great groove with gross but funny lyrics. Lies I've mentioned and the real fun begins on the second side. Far Away Eyes is catchy and funny as hell with an oddly beautiful (!) chorus; one of their best country send ups. Respectable out does punk for speed and energy and is the best all out rocker here; brilliant, brilliant song. I love most of the songs where Keef takes lead vocal and Before They Make Me Run is one of the very best of these. Beast of Burden is beautiful beyond words and has one of my favourite bits of guitar interplay in that short solo section (the Keef/ Woody guitar weaving is at its peak here in general, incidentally). Shattered is like nothing I've ever heard; another brilliant song and a fantastic closer.

They sucked in the 80s (?) but was Tattoo You a brief shining light in the darkness and for that matter was it their last truly great album?

Tattoo You is a masterpiece. Simple. As. That. It took a while to grow on me but I love it from beginning to end and that Motown-inspired (to me anyway) second side is beyond incredible. Worried About You may well be their most overlooked song ever.

Steel Wheels to today - should they have packed it in or are you glad that they're still around? Have any of these albums been able to measure up to the past masterpieces? Does it matter?

Steel Wheels has its moments but it's fairly weak overall. I freakin' adore Keith's Slipping Away though. Voodoo Lounge is indeed five songs too long but it's easily the best of these albums, with the first six or seven songs being especially good. Bridges to Babylon tries to hard to be hip and like all of these Don Was' produced albums, I don't like the dull, lifeless modern day production but some of these songs worked GREAT live. A Bigger Bang has more crappy production, weak Jagger vocals and is a pretty by-numbers affair for the Stones but is solid from beginning to end and again, I adore Keith's two solo vocal spots. From the DVDs I've seen though they're still real good live, though not nearly as tight as they used to be. All in all, I'm glad they're still around even just becase, really, who wants to see Keith Richards hang up his guitar? That would be a sad day for rock and roll.

700000 live albums, which are worth it?

Ya Ya's is great of course but No Securty and Stripped are very, very underrated. They put their modern day studio output to shame. Check these out if you find them at a good price.

Favourite Stones guitarist?

Well Keith, but of the second guitarists I would go for Ronnie because even if his soloing is often lacking (which is weird because this wasn't really a problem in the Faces or with Rod Stewart) and he is on the least amount of great Stones albums, their unique "ancient art of weaving" has resulted in some of my favourite guitar work ever. and his personality is the best fit for the Stones of the three. Mick T is an excellent guitarist but I do slightly prefer the Richard/ Wood weaving technique to the more conventional Richards/Taylor dynamic. Still, you can' deny his impact in the Stones and he did pick up the slack in the mid seventies when Keith had just too much Heroine to function (Winter!). As for Brian Jones, well, he's a legend and he founded the Rolling Stones but aside for his slide guitar, I generally think more about his playing on the exotic instruments in the Stones' pop period.

Any good bootlegs?

Everyone should check out the Definitive Brussels affair, it's excellent and Handsome Girls is pretty great too.

[Captain_Video]

Steel Wheels to today is my favourite Stones period ( blasphemy ? )

I just like the idea that the guys won and they survived and they are still on tour at some hellacious age and still can make a pretty good tune when they want, they are the definition of Rock Legends, the best of the best, they outlive everyone.

Thats what they stand for to me, but I werent there for the hey day.

[rick]

I don’t really know what to say about the Rolling Stones that hasn’t been said about them for as long as I’ve been alive.

I think that they were exactly what was needed during the mid-60’s to offset the entrenched sweetness of the Beatles. As much as I love the Fab Four, the truth is that sometimes they could be as schmaltzy as an Andy Williams record. The Stones on the other hand were always just a bit mean and just a little bit hard, and that really worked in a time when everyone else was taking the Ferry ‘Cross the Mersey, so to speak.

Honestly I am not really a huge fan of their early blues work. They sound like a bunch of white kids singing about things they didn’t even slightly know about inside of someone’s garage. Nothing wrong with what they were doing mind you, and it certainly shows some real strength in their choices of inspirations, but the actual songs just aren’t that great.

As for the early hits eras, As Tears Go by sounded much better when Marianne Faithful sang it and in fact several of their early songs ended up sounding better when other people sang them.

Still there is just no escaping Satisfaction, which in my opinion along with Rock Around the Clock is one of the two most important songs in the entire history of the Rock genre. The Bill Haley classic matters because it was the song that made Rock n Roll burst out into the mainstream and mass popularity, and the Stones song because it brought all of the anger and dissatisfaction (sic) of the original Rock form and slammed it right into popular culture in a way that nobody else before them ever had.

So you really can’t talk about the band without getting that out of the way right off the bat.

It’s hard to pick my favorite “era” with the Stones though since I really like music off of everything from Let it Bleed to Undercover, although I will admit to not being all that crazy about Black & Blue.

As for the guys on guitar, lots of props to both Brian and Mick, but I think that it was with Ron Wood that the Glimmer Twins found the perfect fit.

Still, Mick really was amazing though. And I can absolutely believe the rumors that he was tossed from the band for distracting too much from Mick and Keith.

As for Some Girls being a come back album, I guess my question would be, come back from what?

Certainly it was a huge hit, but it wasn’t like the boys had faded away before hand.

There are just so many good songs on that record, in fact I can’t think of a single one that isn’t great. And I admit that I really like both Far Away Eyes and Keith’s theme song, Before They Make Me Run.

As for their later stuff, I admit after Undercover I do think that they started to go a bit downhill, but then again they had been together for about 25 years by then and that really should be kept in mind. And even then some of their later music, most notably Steel Wheels have still had some really good stuff on it.

As for my favorite Stones songs, I guess my Top 10 in no real order would be…

1. Gimme’ Shelter
2. 2000 Light Years Form Home
3. Dead Flowers
4. Before They Make Me Run
5. Sway
6. Beast of Burden
7. Tumbling Dice
8. Paint It Black
9. Let it Bleed
10. Under My Thumb

But even as I write those 10 songs down another 10 pop right up to replace them….

1. Sympathy for the Devil
2. Happy
3. Sister Morphine
4. Jumping Jack Flash
5. Let’s Spend the Night Together
6. Satisfaction
7. Honky Talk Woman
8. Brown Sugar
9. Ruby Tuesday
10. You Can’t Always Get What You Want

And if I wanted to I could do anther top 10 after that.

It’s just that there is so much good music from this band that even trying to limit it to 10 is practically impossible.

So to Mick, Keith, Charlie, Bill, Brian, the other Mick, and Ron, thanks for all the really cool tunes.

[SUPERECWFAN1]

Nothing against the Rolling Stones , but I love the hits collection . I'm not a huge fan of them like I am Guns n Roses. :p

[david r]

I recall Axl Rose saying that Mick Jagger should have died after "Some Girls". His legend would have soared high apparently, at least in Axl's eyes.

Ilash mentioned their 1967 "attempt" at psychedelic called Their Satanic Majesty's Request. Frankly, I rather like this record. Mick later said it was their worst album, but there is much to enjoy on this one.

She's A Rainbow, The Lantern, Citadel, Bill Wyman's song "In Another Land", and of course, the best song "2000 Light Years From Home." There are good songs, but when the Stones try to get all weird and "psychedelic"-sounding, then it falls apart.

No, it's nowhere near as good as Sgt. Pepper, but an interesting little snapshot of the year 1967, when drugs and "weird ideas" were all the rage.

[SUPERECWFAN1]

I recall Axl Rose saying that Mick Jagger should have died after "Some Girls". His legend would have soared high apparently, at least in Axl's eyes.

.

Axl's a fan though. He has covered a few of their songs like " Jumpin Jack Flash " and SFTD " . Its a shame that Youtube.com video has him and Izzy recent;y covering a RS song and it was removed.

[Buried Alien]

I've found Rolling Stones songs to like from just about every period of the band's history, but I like their material from their very first years (1963-1965) and the end of the 60s/start of the 70s best. Those early Stones R&B and blues covers were raw, raunchy, and just ripple with menacing attitude: the Stones in 1964 were what the punks aspired to be in 1977. My favorites from that early era are "I Just Want To Make Love To You," "Not Fade Away," "Little Red Rooster," "The Last Time," and "It's All Over Now."

After Mick Taylor joined the band in 1969, the Stones became a more technically proficient band, without losing any of their raunch. The best from this period were "Honky Tonk Women," "Gimme Shelter," and "Brown Sugar."

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)