Is Shuma-Gorath an Elder God?

[DDM]

Is Shuma-Gorath considered an Elder God similar to Set, Chthon, & the others? Or is Shuma-Gorath an extra-dimensional demon from another place who seeks to conquer the Earth dimension?

[Expletive Deleted]

If we're going by the old school OHOTMU definitions, I think it's the latter.

[Dizzy D]

Extra-dimensional. He travelled to Earth from another dimension and was banished back there by Sise-Neg. No mention of Gaia, Cthon or Seth in any of his appearances. (In fact he is originally not even a Marvel character, but a Conan god/demon, mentioned in one of Howard's stories.)

[DDM]

Extra-dimensional. He travelled to Earth from another dimension and was banished back there by Sise-Neg. No mention of Gaia, Cthon or Seth in any of his appearances. (In fact he is originally not even a Marvel character, but a Conan god/demon, mentioned in one of Howard's stories.)

Shuma-Gorath fought Doctor Strange twice. The first time was in Marvel Premiere & Doctor Strange (second series) which resulted in the Ancient One's death. The second time Shuma-Gorath fought Dr. Strange, Gorath again seeks to enter Earth's dimension, but Strange prevents him by using chaos magic & turns into Shuma-Gorath before Strange kills himself in Strange Tales #1-17. Strange's soul is purfied then returns back to life.

[twilight]

Shuma-Gorath fought Doctor Strange twice. The first time was in Marvel Premiere & Doctor Strange (second series) which resulted in the Ancient One's death. The second time Shuma-Gorath fought Dr. Strange, Gorath again seeks to enter Earth's dimension, but Strange prevents him by using chaos magic & turns into Shuma-Gorath before Strange kills himself in Strange Tales #1-17. Strange's soul is purfied then returns back to life.

Excuse me DDM but what does that have to do with what Dizzy said?

He gave an answer to your question and you reply with a completely unrelated fact.

[Beast]

Excuse me DDM but what does that have to do with what Dizzy said?

He gave an answer to your question and you reply with a completely unrelated fact.

He likes to toss out unrelated facts, just to show off.... I guess. :rolleyes:

[Will.S]

It's DDM's way of messing with your head.

All joking aside, I think he was going with a rhetorical question since there's just no way he wouldn't know that.

[DDM]

Excuse me DDM but what does that have to do with what Dizzy said?

He gave an answer to your question and you reply with a completely unrelated fact.

The fact Shuma-Gorath showed up twice in Dr. Strange in the modern era. Conan was during the Hyborean era when Marvel owned the Conan character (Dark Horse has the rights to the character now).

[DDM]

It's DDM's way of messing with your head.

All joking aside, I think he was going with a rhetorical question since there's just no way he wouldn't know that.

No, I'm asking a straight question. An Elder God is an Earth demon (powerful demons whose powers usually a beyond comprehension for any mere mortal or lesser demons such as Mephisto, Satannish, or Zarathos). The N'Gari, for instance, are demons from another separate dimension not native of the Earth dimension, but they too wish to conquer the Earth dimension for themselves, usually through servants such as Kulan Gath.

Shuma-Gorath could be an Elder God or an other dimensional demon. He is never mentioned with Chthon, Set, or Gaia, but that does not mean Shuma-Gorath is not an Elder God.

[Flight]

How am I supposed to know Stop looking at me.

[Will.S]

I guess he would seem to be more of an extradimensional demon then but they haven't really been too revealing about his exact origin.

I'd like to see more of him in the future that's for sure.

[DDM]

I also mentioned the Dr. Strange reference because very few Conan villains come into modern day stories. Selene, the Black Queen, has been linked to Kulan Gath, but Gath himself made only three modern era appearances in Marvel Team-Up, Uncanny X-Men, & The Avengers. Shuma-Gorath fought Dr. Strange, but also fought Conan.

Is Shuma-Gorath an Elder God or extra-dimensional demon?

[DDM]

I guess he would seem to be more of an extradimensional Demon then but they haven't really been too revealing about his exact origin.

I'd like to see more of him in the future that's for sure.

But Chthon & Set went into separate dimensions when Gaia's son, Atum, destroyed the other Elder Gods. Like Shuma-Gorath, Set & Chthon have tried & failed to re-enter Earth's dimension.

Just because a demon is trying to re-enter Earth's dimension does not make him an extra-dimensional demon.

[Dizzy D]

Shuma-Gorath could be an Elder God or an other dimensional demon. He is never mentioned with Chthon, Set, or Gaia, but that does not mean Shuma-Gorath is not an Elder God.

He's not an Elder God: all Elder Gods except for Gaia, Cthon and Set were destroyed by the Demigorge million of years before the birth of humankind. We know it was before the birth of humanity, because from his hidden dimension Seth tried to promote the birth of the reptile intelligent races, but Gaia chose for mammals and promoted them: so Set was banished already at this time before humanity even existed.
When we see Shuma-Gorath in the prehistoric times, he's feeding upon humans and is banished by Sise-Neg: so he's no Elder God otherwise he would have been driven from Earth before that or killed by Demogorgon (no, he can't have defeated Demogorgon, because then Atum would either be dead or never have gone to rest because his task was finished.. and Atum came back when Set entered the world again, so he was still watching out for any Elder Gods that escaped him)

In fact Shuma-Gorath shows no tie to the Earth at all (he's even capable of destroying it with ease from his home dimension as seen with ), while all Elder Gods were born on Earth and destruction of Earth/Gaia is beyond their power.

So he's more powerful than the Elder Gods, arrived on Earth millions of years after they left, never mentioned by Gaia, Set or Cthohn as one of their equals (while they do mention each other often enough and compete with each other. No competition with Shuma-Gorath), claimed another dimension as his home, also none of the Elder Gods has Shuma-Goraths ability to become the person who killed him.

Edit: In fact the Marvel Universe original Handbook even uses Shuma-Gorath as THE example of a Type 3 demon.

[DDM]

He's not an Elder God: all Elder Gods except for Gaia, Cthon and Set were destroyed by the Demigorge million of years before the birth of humankind. We know it was before the birth of humanity, because from his hidden dimension Seth tried to promote the birth of the reptile intelligent races, but Gaia chose for mammals and promoted them: so Set was banished already at this time before humanity even existed.
When we see Shuma-Gorath in the prehistoric times, he's feeding upon humans and is banished by Sise-Neg: so he's no Elder God otherwise he would have been driven from Earth before that or killed by Demogorgon (no, he can't have defeated Demogorgon, because then Atum would either be dead or never have gone to rest because his task was finished.. and Atum came back when Set entered the world again, so he was still watching out for any Elder Gods that escaped him)

In fact Shuma-Gorath shows no tie to the Earth at all (he's even capable of destroying it with ease from his home dimension as seen with ), while all Elder Gods were born on Earth and destruction of Earth/Gaia is beyond their power.

So he's more powerful than the Elder Gods, arrived on Earth millions of years after they left, never mentioned by Gaia, Set or Cthohn as one of their equals (while they do mention each other often enough and compete with each other. No competition with Shuma-Gorath), claimed another dimension as his home, also none of the Elder Gods has Shuma-Goraths ability to become the person who killed him.

Edit: In fact the Marvel Universe original Handbook even uses Shuma-Gorath as THE example of a Type 3 demon.

Shuma-Gorath is just an all powerful other dimensional demon then...

Didn't Shuma-Gorath claim to be the Sorcerer Supreme of his home dimension?