DC Bring Back Mike Grell !

[SUPERECWFAN1]

Its clear that with OYL happening soon most of the DCU will have a really good books. New launches and series coming as well as great teams on LSH and Hawkman. So whats the problem with Green Arrow ?

Other than Meltzer and Smith the charactor has drifted thru crap for the last 2 to 3 years. Its gotten worse as the charactor has became mired in stupied plots with monsters as well as cheap super hero fare.

So what happened to bring down a charactor that Kevin Smith pretty much gave a shot in the arm to in 2000 ? Well its like this. After he left the other creator ( Winick) saw what Smith did so well and just wrote his stories based on it. Instead of realizing you give the fans the same stories repeated and no ones gonna stay.

Its clear that besides Smith only Mike Grell really knew the charactor. And since his departure DC's struggled to write this charactor on a consitant basis. So lets see DC bring back Grell to save this Book and charactor.

[Babylon23]

To be honest with you, I really disliked Smith's run. I think he stripped away much of the work that Grell had done on the character in the 80's, and left a shell of a character. I can understand that people liked what Smith did, but it just didn't work for me.

I'd love to see Grell back in any capacity at DC, whether on Green Arrow or another book. He's one of the most talented writer/artists in the industry, and his recent work on Jon Sable has shown that he's lost none of his artistic ability.

GA certainly needs a shot in the arm.

[Captain Jim]

Hmm. I definitely agree that GA needs a shot in the arm. And as much as I like Scott McDaniel (on the right character), I'm afraid he isn't going to do it. (Especially with Winnick's lackluster scripts.) Given GA's popularity under Smith et al, it's amazing how DC is letting this book slip.

Then again, I also agree that Smith's run was overrated.

I love Mike Grell (again, on the right character), but at the moment he seems to be occupied with Jon Sable at IDW. Still, if he was available, I'd love to see him reprise either GA or Warlord (possibly even more so the latter).

[Slam_Bradley]

I love Mike Grell (again, on the right character), but at the moment he seems to be occupied with Jon Sable at IDW. Still, if he was available, I'd love to see him reprise either GA or Warlord (possibly even more so the latter).


And that's the real problem. I'd love to see Grell doing Sable, GA and Warlord. He really shouldn't need to sleep should he?

[Thanos]

I, too, disliked Mr. Smith's take on the Green Arrow. I started buying it because of my love for Mr. Grell's run. I believe I quit reading the new series around issue 13. If DC decided to bring back Mr. Grell to write the Green Arrow I would be the first person in line to buy it.

- Thanos

[Apathy Boy]

Kevin Smith's GREEN ARROW was one of the most horrid stories I've read this decade.

I liked Winnick's run to begin with, but have fallen off of it recently. Not so much because I hated it like Smith's run, but more out of (... wait for it ...) apathy. Mayor Ollie sounds like a ton of fun, though.

Grell had the best run of the writers listed here, but I never understood the fascination with wanting to see creators return to a title they had a fair shot at. Grell had, what, 50+ issues on GREEN ARROW? I'd rather see someone new on GREEN ARROW, and Grell working on a character he hasn't worked on before. (Strangely enough, I think he might be an interesting pick for WONDER WOMAN.)

[LORD FALLEN ELDOR]

I must be the odd one out because I never did care for Mike Grell's run. I like the fun loving adventurer Ollie, not the grim reality based one Grell recreated. I'm not saying what he did was terrible, I just think it was to "dark". I'm not saying make him completely campy, I'm just saying lets not forget about the rest of the DC universe. That's what I liked about the current GA series that Smith and Meltzler rebuilt. Brad Meltzer's Archer's Quest and Kevin Smith's Sound of Violence where some great comics! That's how the book should always be written.

Winick did a good enough job with Straight Shooters and City walls. You think Mia would have never wanted to touch a bow again after that. Got it out of her system and all...Killing a guy tends to do that for most people! I hate that Black Canary left the book after that. Mia could use a mother type around, especially now. It was around #45 that I started to drift on the book. I liked the new Villain Brick, but the quality of writing had begun to slip. I think winick should have just stuck around for two story archs help to plot the Brick stuff and moved on. It would have helped to keep the title fresh. I hate that they made Mia HIV positive, I hate more that she became the new Speedy. I still think that was inappropriate and dangerous. The quickness of putting her in a costume was even more ridicules. I hope she dies just to teach everyone a lesson about inexperienced people who think any yahoo with a gimmick can fight super criminals!

Then Phil Hester and Andy Parks left and we got a garage replacement art team that looked way to silly and cartoonish. And not in a good animated style like Phil Hester or Bruce Timm, I mean cartoonish as in STUPID! speaking of stupid did I mention the villians?!?! Talk about WTF moments! That horrible #50th issue that wasn't even worth reading. After that we get three horrible filler stories. I keep telling my self I need to quit buying the damn book but I love Green Arrow so much... This current story is just uninteresting. If they wanted to follow up Identity Crisis they should have gotten Brad Meltzer back so he could do a better job of it!

I hope the OYL jump is worth it because I'm going to drop this title if it doesn't. No really I am...Serious I mean it guys...If it doesn't get better by #75 I'm gone...#100 tops!

[Calamas]

While I liked both Smith and Meltzer’s Green Arrow, I miss Grell’s take as well. Hell, I miss his old “written and illustrated by” tag, no matter the comic. OTOH, I’m just glad to have him back. Jon Sable: Bloodtrail #5 opened with the most innovative action sequence that I’d seen in a long time. The man hasn’t lost a thing.

[Freelyx]

I thought the best thing about Kevin Smith's story was that it brought Oliver back, after that I agree it was pretty lame. I had much higher hopes for it.

Grell's GA holds a lot in the root and development of the character, but I agree with the statement that GA is not as dark anymore as he was when Grell had his run. I also like the hunter stories that were running for a while. I can't recall who was writing them, but when he wore the green hood and was tracking down people and doing basic street justice, really good GA stuff.

That being said I also like the look and feel of the fun loving GA that Neal Adams wrote and drew. I don't much care for Neal's ego, but credit where credit is due, the guy can draw and write GA very well.

[The Shadow]

Phew!

I'm glad I'm not the only one that hated Smith's Green Arrow. I think Winnick ruined the character and I was indifferent to Meltzer's stuff...

I'd LOVE to see Grell on GA again... even if it's just as a writer.

[The Shadow]

That being said I also like the look and feel of the fun loving GA that Neal Adams wrote and drew. I don't much care for Neal's ego, but credit where credit is due, the guy can draw and write GA very well.
I don't recall Adams ever writing Green Arrow. He drew the Green Lantern series guest starring GA in the early 70's but that was written by Denny O'Neil.

As for Adams' ego... you gotta admit... he's earned it. ;)

[Babylon23]

That being said I also like the look and feel of the fun loving GA that Neal Adams wrote and drew. I don't much care for Neal's ego, but credit where credit is due, the guy can draw and write GA very well.

Was the O'Neill/Adams GA fun-loving? I remember him as a hot-headed liberal activist who took conservative Hal Jordan on a tour of America's social problems.

I thought Grell's GA was a natural extension of this, an older, wiser Ollie who still retained his social conscience. There was a real depth to his personality adn character during Grell's period on the title.

Kevin Smith created a fanboy caricature of Ollie, stripping away much of the personality established by O'Neill/Grell. Much of the real social commentary was replaced with the occasional pseudo-liberal catchphrases. He de-aged Ollie and wiped a big chunk of his memory, undoing all of Grell's work in the process.

I thought Hester did well with what Smith had set up, and Winnick has been a bit hit and miss. For me, Hester's excellent artwork really carried the book through it's first 48 issues.

[Captain Jim]

I hate more that she became the new Speedy. I still think that was inappropriate and dangerous. The quickness of putting her in a costume was even more ridicules.

I agree. Only I think it was ridiculous. ;)

Then Phil Hester and Andy Parks left and we got a garage replacement art team that looked way to silly and cartoonish. And not in a good animated style like Phil Hester or Bruce Timm, I mean cartoonish as in STUPID! ... I hope the OYL jump is worth it because I'm going to drop this title if it doesn't.

Garage replacement? Oh, I get it; you mean garbage.

I know that McDaniel isn't everybody's cup of tea, but I think he may be a good follow-up to Hester on GA. (At least Hester was a good follow-up to McDaniel on Nightwing, so it ought to work the other way too, right?)

[Wonder Dude]

I want to see Grell on Legion of Superheroes again.

[Slam_Bradley]

I want to see Grell on Legion of Superheroes again.


And the inevitable return of bell-bottoms.

[Agentum]

I don't think they like Green Arrow to be more realistic, crimefighting in the dark alleys, they seems to want the trick arrow GA that fight supervillians.

[Agentum]

Grell had the best run of the writers listed here, but I never understood the fascination with wanting to see creators return to a title they had a fair shot at. Grell had, what, 50+ issues on GREEN ARROW?
He left with #80, so he was on a long time, and the series went downhill from there.

I don't hate the GA v.2 run, but it's nothing like the v.1 run was, but i like that a second rate character like GA kan sell on his own, that he don't need any GLs and such to be in a book.

[handOFfate]

Am I the only guy here who really liked Kevin Smith's GA run? I understand that longtime fans of Ollie didn't like it because it essentially started fresh and ignored stories from before. But I didn't know anything about GA before reading Quiver, so it didnt bother me. I personally found Smith's stories fun; incredibly silly at times, but fun. Meltzer's story, Archer's Quest, was awesome. And I liked Winnick's first two arcs, Straight Shooters and City Walls. But the comic really sucked after that, and I dropped it. It lacked the witty dialogue and interesting stories from before. I really hated Mia becoming the new Speedy. She doesn't seem to fit in the role at all.
I agree with everyone else that Green Arrow really needs a fresh start. I would put Meltzer back on the title, at least for the first six issues or so. He's a hot name right now due to Identity Crisis. Archer's Quest is generally beloved by GA fans, so it'd be interesting to see if he could duplicate his success.

[The Shadow]

Am I the only guy here who really liked Kevin Smith's GA run?
Yes... yes you are. I suggest trying some older stuff like Long Bow Hunters and the first 30 or so issues of Grell's ongoing. Then compare them to Smith's run. THEN you can thank me! LOL

I would put Meltzer back on the title, at least for the first six issues or so. He's a hot name right now due to Identity Crisis.
Yeah but it's a bad kind of hot... as in fans are hot because of what he did in IC to their favorite characters, histories and it started all the Infinite Crisis crap... not because it was good.

[SUPERECWFAN1]

I don't hate Meltzer at all. I just feel he's more of a realistic writer and we'd need a new creative team entirely on art that wouldn't be so cartoony. I do like a lot of his Oliver stuff in IC.

I was praying Winick would be replaced on the book after Infinite Crisis. But hearing of a storyline where Oliver will become Mayor of Star City's just screams STUPIED. I mean seriously....is there no editor on this book anymore ?

[Calamas]

Am I the only guy here who really liked Kevin Smith's GA run?
No. I'm with you. I loved Smith’s entire resurrection storyline. Meltzer’s follow-up was just a good. But I also have to concede that Smith lost interest after bringing Ollie back to the land of the living. Everything after he accomplished what he set out to do was crap. That half-assed hero Buckeye and the lame villain that killed him and the clichéd deathbed vigil so everybody can emote; obviously thrown together without thought.

I find that if I just consider “Quiver,” I remember Smith’s run as one of the best in recent years.

[Bicycle-Repairman]

You know what I would do if I got the gig of writing Green Arrow? I'd truly make him a modern-day Robin Hood, robbing from the rich and giving to the poor. Ollie realizes that there's only so much a guy with a longbow can do against super-villains, and that the biggest criminals are rich and powerful enough to buy the law, so he goes after what really matters to them: their money. Green Arrow could steal from wealthy villains like Lex Luthor and the Penguin, and then redistribute the money to worthy social causes. What Green Arrow does is illegal, so he has to evade the police, but he becomes a folk hero to millions. I would have Green Arrow say the following after racketeering charges are dismissed against a wealthy businessman and political donor with mob ties:

GREEN ARROW: "Superman handles the space aliens and giant robots. Batman's got the street thugs on the run. But who goes after the biggest criminals--those who can buy enough lawyers to stay out of prison, or buy enough lawmakers to legalize injustice? I may be just a man with a bow and arrow, but I'm somebody, and somebody's got to do something!"

[handOFfate]

Yeah but it's a bad kind of hot... as in fans are hot because of what he did in IC to their favorite characters, histories and it started all the Infinite Crisis crap... not because it was good.

But Meltzer on GA would definantly boost sales, if anything so critics of IC can have something fresh to complain about. I personally liked Identity Crisis, and Ollie in particular. Judging by its sales, i'm sure i'm not the only one.

[Babylon23]

No. I'm with you. I loved Smith’s entire resurrection storyline. Meltzer’s follow-up was just a good. But I also have to concede that Smith lost interest after bringing Ollie back to the land of the living. Everything after he accomplished what he set out to do was crap. That half-assed hero Buckeye and the lame villain that killed him and the clichéd deathbed vigil so everybody can emote; obviously thrown together without thought.

I find that if I just consider “Quiver,” I remember Smith’s run as one of the best in recent years.

That's interesting. I'm actually the complete opposite. I found his initial storyline to be fanboyish and irritating (too many guest stars, ignoring 10 years of storylines and returning Ollie to the point that Smith wanted to write him, transforming Stanley and his Monster into a disturbing horror story, etc.) I thought his second story was a lot stronger.

[Agentum]

It's stupid to use GA in supervillian space battles an such, they have lot of superheroes they can use for that.
Why not take the chance to write something diffrent?

Or maybe people want more of the same in every book they read?