Every once in a while perfection ocurs(56 k take a nap)

[THE OG GL]

Every once in a while there is an image the perfactly defines a character.
it like whenever i think of this character at their best i think of this
whats yours?

wonder woman
http://www.comicartcommunity.com/gallery/data/media/116/WWchi2.jpg

Superman
http://www.comicscontinuum.com/stories/0502/20/allstarsuperman1.jpg
it was gonna be that till i saw this

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y33/xpac257/superman3.jpg

Hal Jordan

http://www.comicartcommunity.com/gallery/data/media/76/glpainting.jpg

[jadegiant77]

cool...half the pictures have been replaced by a tiny RED X!

[Slam_Bradley]

cool...half the pictures have been replaced by a tiny RED X!


Those must have been the perfect pictures because the Superman ones certainly weren't.

[Simon Garth]

Those must have been the perfect pictures because the Superman ones certainly weren't.

The first Supes is OK (nothing special, but OK), but the seconds one is horrible. What's up with his face?

[Shellhead]

Those are good pictures, except that Superman has a bigger jaw than a female country-western singer. That's a major jawbone.

[Shellhead]

The first Supes is OK (nothing special, but OK), but the seconds one is horrible. What's up with his face?

I think he's holding his breath while he is swimming through all that urine.

[THE OG GL]

^you guys are crazy that superman is perfect

[malephoenix]

^you guys are crazy that superman is perfect

Quietly just makes my skin crawl.

[Arrjay]

What's up with his face?

Frank Quitely's inability to draw faces. They look more like feces. :p

[THE OG GL]

quietlys cool

[Captain Jim]

I think he's holding his breath while he is swimming through all that urine.

:D :D LOL ! :D :D

[Lex]

Wow. Don't let Joe Rice find this thread.

EDIT: But I certainly agree with the first poster that those Quietly Superman pics are the height of awesomeness.

[Taskmaster]

I've always disliked Quietly's art, but today I took a friend into the comic shop and he couldn't believe that the art was so incredibly horrible on Allstar Superman. He said something to the effect that his four year old cousin could do it better

[Beatnikman]

I can understand the complaints about Quietly's faces (even though they don't bother me), but there's more to a comic artist than just their ability to draw the people. And even then you can at least tell the different characters apart.

And I think Frank Quietly is an outstanding visual storyteller. Go back to all-star Superman or some of his X-books and don't read any of the words. I'll bet you still understand what's going on. And in a comic book, I'll take that over someone who draws people all purty.

[dancj]

I think Quitely is one of the best artists in the business. He draws faces in the style of his choosing, which is unconventional. This isn't the same thing as being bad at drawing - though a lot of people on these boards seem to have trouble with this concept.

Dan
(Being a slight hypocrite because I find it hard to look at anything by Dan Brereton and see it as anything other than completely incompetent)

[hondobrode]

Wow. You guys are harsh.

I'm am 110 % down with All Star Superman and totally dig his Superman, just like someone said about his mutants.

People love him or hate him, apparently. Count me on the love side of the room.

Too bad we couldn't see the other images.

[Shellhead]

I think Quitely is one of the best artists in the business. He draws faces in the style of his choosing, which is unconventional. This isn't the same thing as being bad at drawing - though a lot of people on these boards seem to have trouble with this concept.


I'm torn about Quitely's artwork. It is mostly very, very good. His sense of color and composition and movement is very professional. But sometimes the proportions are a little peculiar, and the faces are sometimes strange, and that can occasionally pull me right out of the story.

Just looking at these two examples above... the cover shot is actually beautiful, except that Jay Leno jaw throws off the face, and causes me to reconsider the rest of the picture, even though my initial reaction was good. Looking again, I see that those clouds are indeed delightful, giving this picture a nice dreamy quality that snaps into focus at the center of the page, on Superman, making him seem more real than real. My eye follows the large curve of his back, right back to that calm face with the gigantic jaw.

The second picture is also pretty good, but flawed. The pose is dynamic, and I can practically hear the sizzling energy as he dives into the sun. The face is odd again, although at least this time it's in shadow. Shadow? Wait, this is the sun, right? Is his face in shadow because the inker didn't like the face, either? About that face, it looks constipated.

It's possible that Quitely is right, and I'm wrong about the faces. If you look at photographs of athletes in action, they often have very intense, distorted facial expressions when they are in the middle of the action. So maybe superheroes should be making ugly faces in action, and Frank is quite right to be drawing them that way. But I've been reading comics a long time, so I'm used to my heroes having calm, stoic expressions during most action scenes.

[thehod]

Hate to say it, but Tim Sale drew my perfect version of Superman.

As for others...

Wonder Woman...George Perez

Flash...Mike Wieringo

Batman... I really struggling to come up with someone I like better than Dick Sprang.

Green Lantern...Ethan Van Sciver has been one of the better artists in recent years, but I've yet to see a real killer artist on GL. Whilst I appreciate Gil Kane, his work never really knocked me out. Maybe I was born a little too late for it.

[The Adventurer]

I generaly don't like Quitely particularly for his faces, of which I usualy just want to reach out and punch.

But I think people are more up in arms over the fact that All-Star Superman's face doesn't look exactly like Core Superman's face. And are just up in arms over Changes to a classic character. Why can't Superman have a large jaw? Why must he have the classic face, esspessily when this is an alternature universe? If I was in charge, All-Star Superman wouldn't even be in the classic costume (or any costume for that matter) or be able to fly. And I'm sure you'd all want to kill me, but Superman is more then what he looks like, he's symbol for what he does, not his imagry.

[Slam_Bradley]

I generaly don't like Quitely particularly for his faces, of which I usualy just want to reach out and punch.

But I think people are more up in arms over the fact that All-Star Superman's face doesn't look exactly like Core Superman's face. And are just up in arms over Changes to a classic character. Why can't Superman have a large jaw? Why must he have the classic face, esspessily when this is an alternature universe? If I was in charge, All-Star Superman wouldn't even be in the classic costume (or any costume for that matter) or be able to fly. And I'm sure you'd all want to kill me, but Superman is more then what he looks like, he's symbol for what he does, not his imagry.


I haven't read the book so I'm not up in arms about anything. I just find the pics to be far from perfect.

And I can't imagine wanting to kill someone for something as unimportant as their take on a fictional character.

[SUPERECWFAN1]

I think he drew the X-Men charactors very well. This right here scares me. Is Superman's big jaw supposed to invoke fear now ?

[The Adventurer]

Superman is just a big man. Which makes perfect sense.

I like how you don't see the muscule definition on his costume.

[Tadhg]

He said something to the effect that his four year old cousin could do it better

It's crap like this that bugs the hell out of me. People don't like Quitely's style. Fine, I get that, afterall, aesthetics are subjective. But when people just out and out dismiss the great craft he brings to comics with moronic statements like that, ARGH! RAGE SEETHING!

[Tadhg]

The second picture is also pretty good, but flawed. The pose is dynamic, and I can practically hear the sizzling energy as he dives into the sun. The face is odd again, although at least this time it's in shadow. Shadow? Wait, this is the sun, right? Is his face in shadow because the inker didn't like the face, either? About that face, it looks constipated.

If the sun is directly above him on his back, would he not be casting a shadow?

[Shellhead]

If the sun is directly above him on his back, would he not be casting a shadow?

Oh. Okay, that makes sense. I couldn't remember the context of that panel, so I thought that he was diving into the sun there, not flying right past with his back to it. In that case, my only concern is the fact that he looks like he's constipated or holding his breath.

[The Adventurer]

He's got the wind in his face.

Ok, yes it's comics and yes it's superhero comics, but does every interpretation of a character have to have them cast in some kind of "greek god" kind of imagry? Why can't they look a little uncomfortable doing their day job?

[Shellhead]

He's got the wind in his face.

Ok, yes it's comics and yes it's superhero comics, but does every interpretation of a character have to have them cast in some kind of "greek god" kind of imagry? Why can't they look a little uncomfortable doing their day job?

Fair point, but the line has to be drawn somewhere. Most fans don't need to see Captain America reading the Saturday Evening Post (Norman Rockwell cover, of course) while he is taking a dump. Maybe our expectations of iconic heroes are too high, but I say better too high than too low.

[SUPERECWFAN1]

He's got the wind in his face.

Ok, yes it's comics and yes it's superhero comics, but does every interpretation of a character have to have them cast in some kind of "greek god" kind of imagry? Why can't they look a little uncomfortable doing their day job?


Bahhh!! I say...we need to see Thor standing there in a stance that says " Bow to me like a Pagan God as I take this pose!! "

We have Superman flying like a GOD. He's in his pose of glory! Bow to him and his big damn jaw !

[The Adventurer]

Only one Jaw gets my worship welp!

http://img476.imageshack.us/img476/7770/brucecampbvespa6091834008vr.jpg

All other Jaws are false jaws!

[thik_3rd]

quietlys cool
maybe. but he sure can't draw.

[Corsair]

I like the WW from the shoulders up, but the crossed bracelets thing has gotten to be such a cliche that it looks kind of silly to me anymore. That, and she's kind of scrawny lookin'. Where'd her hips go?

I'm not a fan of Quitely. Pretty much in agreement with Shellhead though that while his style is often downright ugly, his composition and storytelling ability are first rate.

As for the last, c'mon. Neal Adams. Hal Jordan.

[Gingold]

I think Quitely's awesome. Fabulous composition, beautifcul lines, attention to detail, great storytelling, unique style, what's not to love?

But what do I know? Apparently Michael Turner and David Finch are really good, and I'm just missing something.

[Joe Rice]

I think Quitely's awesome. Fabulous composition, beautifcul lines, attention to detail, great storytelling, unique style, what's not to love?

But what do I know? Apparently Michael Turner and David Finch are really good, and I'm just missing something.

You know quite a bit. Quitely's the best artist in corporate comics today. His draftsmanship, design, and storytelling are without equal and constantly on the move.

And the two others you mentioned are absolutely awful and not very good, respectively.

[Babylon23]

You know quite a bit. Quitely's the best artist in corporate comics today. His draftsmanship, design, and storytelling are without equal and constantly on the move.

And the two others you mentioned are absolutely awful and not very good, respectively.

I was going to post something here, but Joe really captured my feelings towards all 3 artists. Great work, Joe.

[Joe Rice]

I was going to post something here, but Joe really captured my feelings towards all 3 artists. Great work, Joe.

Cross-Continental Good Taste High Five, Babylon23!

[thik_3rd]

you can cite stuff like storytelling or whatever you want, but when you look at it it's ugly, that's the bottom line.

[Joe Rice]

you can cite stuff like storytelling or whatever you want, but when you look at it it's ugly, that's the bottom line.

Perhaps to someone of, er, your aesthetic values. I think it's goddam beautiful. Besides, "ugly" doesn't have anything to do with artistic quality. A lot of great art can be visually jarring or ugly. Quitely's isn't, except when he wants it to be.

[thik_3rd]

Perhaps to someone of, er, your aesthetic values. I think it's goddam beautiful. Besides, "ugly" doesn't have anything to do with artistic quality. A lot of great art can be visually jarring or ugly. Quitely's isn't, except when he wants it to be.
in comics, or life drawing in general, i'd say ugly is paramount to artistic quality, or the lack thereof.

[Joe Rice]

in comics, or life drawing in general, i'd say ugly is paramount to artistic quality, or the lack thereof.

You'd be wrong. It may be important to YOU, but it has no inherent tie to artistic quality.

[tangentman]

in comics, or life drawing in general, i'd say ugly is paramount to artistic quality, or the lack thereof.

"Ugly"? I think the word that you're reaching for to describe Frank Quitely's art is "Sublime". ;)

[thik_3rd]

You'd be wrong. It may be important to YOU, but it has no inherent tie to artistic quality.
pretty sure i'm right on this one.

[Joe Rice]

"Ugly"? I think the word that you're reaching for to describe Frank Quitely's art is "Sublime". ;)

We may vote for different folks in silly games, but you're right as rain here.

[Joe Rice]

pretty sure i'm right on this one.

A "beautiful only" rule would pretty much eliminate a lot of the most important comic artists that ever were. Let's see, Crumb, Sienkewicz, Clowes, Pope (to some), Weston, Cambell, O'Neill . . .yeah. Sorry, guy, but "ugly" can be great art.

[Babylon23]

Cross-Continental Good Taste High Five, Babylon23!

Right back at ya, Joe.

I thought I'd try and articulate some of my thoughts on Quietly's Superman. I hope this helps/makes sense.

For me, Quietly captures the quiet majesty and iconic status of Superman beautifully. He presents him as a truly noble and heroic figure. He also subtly offsets this by showing the figures around Superman as less majestic/iconic. In this way, his Superman stands out as truly Super.

I think this is one of Quietly's real skills as an artist. Each character has their own body language/nuances that reflect their personalities.

[thik_3rd]

A "beautiful only" rule would pretty much eliminate a lot of the most important comic artists that ever were. Let's see, Crumb, Sienkewicz, Clowes, Pope (to some), Weston, Cambell, O'Neill . . .yeah. Sorry, guy, but "ugly" can be great art.
by campbell i guess you're talking about eddie not j scott right?
well, none of them (besides weston) are ugly.

edit - and i've never known anyone to consider weston important.

[Paul Newell]

My thoughts about Quitely is that I've alays been disappointed with his super-hero work. I think he kicks arse in other genres....His Judge Dredd work was absolutely beautiful, as was Flex Mentallo, but, apart from his "leather clad" X-Men, I don't think his style really suits the spandex.

[thik_3rd]

Right back at ya, Joe.

I thought I'd try and articulate some of my thoughts on Quietly's Superman. I hope this helps/makes sense.

For me, Quietly captures the quiet majesty and iconic status of Superman beautifully. He presents him as a truly noble and heroic figure. He also subtly offsets this by showing the figures around Superman as less majestic/iconic. In this way, his Superman stands out as truly Super.

I think this is one of Quietly's real skills as an artist. Each character has their own body language/nuances that reflect their personalities.
he presents him as a balloon animal.
or...

http://www.toywebb.net/images/superman-10inch.jpg

[Babylon23]

he presents him as a balloon animal.

Hey, Cool Super-toy.

Quietly certainly has a more rounded art-style, if that's what you mean. It's a more traditional, minimalist style, as opposed to the more angular manga-influenced style.

I think his style makes him a decent successor to the Superman work of Boring, Swan and Byrne.

[David O Burcham]

I think Quitely's a great artist... but THE perfect, definitive Superman image?

Hardly.

http://www.supermanartists.comics.org/superart/superman014_cvrs.jpg

[Babylon23]

That's a fantastic image. I'd also add Neil Adam's "Superman Bursting out of the Chains" image (sorry I don't have a scan handy. Maybe someone can help with that).

[Shellhead]

I think Quitely's a great artist... but THE perfect, definitive Superman image?

Hardly.

http://www.supermanartists.comics.org/superart/superman014_cvrs.jpg

That's not Superman, that's Ronald Reagan. He just thought he was Superman.

[Bat-Mite]

Speaking of "ugly" yet "pretty" perfect images, here is my favorite Batman and Robin picture from Frank "Make her butt bigger, Jim Lee" Miller.

http://www.frankpepito.com/Batman/Batman-FrankMiller.jpg

[Bat-Mite]

I'd also add Neil Adam's "Superman Bursting out of the Chains" image (sorry I don't have a scan handy. Maybe someone can help with that).

Google is everyone's friend, cause Google is made of happy thoughts and candy.

http://comics.drunkenfist.com/linked/supes233.jpg

[Bat-Mite]

by campbell i guess you're talking about eddie not j scott right?
well, none of them (besides weston) are ugly.

Out of curiosity, how is R.Crumb not ugly in the same way Quitely is ugly?

[Taskmaster]

"Ugly"? I think the word that you're reaching for to describe Frank Quitely's art is "Sublime". ;)

I think you mean substandard

[tangentman]

Nah, that's not usually the word I choose for striking art drawn with care and possessing a distinct character which sets it leagues above most comic book art nowadays.

[Babylon23]

Google is everyone's friend, cause Google is made of happy thoughts and candy.

http://comics.drunkenfist.com/linked/supes233.jpg

Oh yeah, that's the one I'm talking about. Thanks Bat-Mite.

[Shellhead]

Normally, I am a big fan of Neal Adams, especially his work in the 70's, but I have to say... that chain-busting cover seems kind of safe and bland, lacking his usual dynamicism. I don't like Quitely's ugly faces, but those two pictures from Allstar at the start of this thread are actually better than Neal's, imo.

[ApexPredator]

although beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

you guys are retarded.

this quitely guy can draw.

this is one of the top superman interpretations in the HISTORY of the character.

you are living through it.

you will reflect on it in the coming years.

you will realise you were wrong.

Fank Quitely will not notice or care

[Lex]

you guys are retarded. While I may disagree with the people who hate Quitely's art, calling them "retarded" is not the way to go. It's unnecessary and disrespectful.

[SUPERECWFAN1]

I actually think Curt Swan was the definitive Superman artist. I have a few of his issues and its good art.

[bitplayer]

Wow some of you guys are rough.

[dancj]

I like the WW from the shoulders up, but the crossed bracelets thing has gotten to be such a cliche that it looks kind of silly to me anymore. That, and she's kind of scrawny lookin'. Where'd her hips go?

I'm not a fan of Quitely. Pretty much in agreement with Shellhead though that while his style is often downright ugly, his composition and storytelling ability are first rate.

As for the last, c'mon. Neal Adams. Hal Jordan.

I can only see t he Superman pictures, but I've got the Green Lantern/Green Arrow trades and (much as he draws a great Batman) I wasn't impressed with Neil Adams's rendition of Hal Jordan. For me the definitive Green Lantern would be drawn by a more fluid artist like Stuart Imomen or Steve Rude

Dan

[dancj]

you can cite stuff like storytelling or whatever you want, but when you look at it it's ugly, that's the bottom line.

Maybe when you look at it, but when I look at Quitely's art it's a thing of beauty. There are a very few artists who's art brings a sense of majesty to any comic. The two who spring to mind right now are Tim Sale and Frank Quitely.

Dan

[thik_3rd]

majesty? wow. thats probably the last word i could ever come up to describe either of those guys' works.

[Tadhg]

in comics, or life drawing in general, i'd say ugly is paramount to artistic quality, or the lack thereof.


Comics != Life Drawing

[Tadhg]

majesty? wow. thats probably the last word i could ever come up to describe either of those guys' works.

But you don't think composition or storytelling are important. When the only thing you're concerned with is how "pretty" the characters are, then you're obviously not going to look at the art the same way most people are.

[Shellhead]

While I may disagree with the people who hate Quitely's art, calling them "retarded" is not the way to go. It's unnecessary and disrespectful.

His calling Mr. Quitely "Fank" was a little disrespectful, too. ;)

[thik_3rd]

But you don't think composition or storytelling are important. When the only thing you're concerned with is how "pretty" the characters are, then you're obviously not going to look at the art the same way most people are.
i do think composition and storytellig are important. how "pretty" the characters are is not the only thing i'm concerned with.

[shyguy]

But you don't think composition or storytelling are important. When the only thing you're concerned with is how "pretty" the characters are, then you're obviously not going to look at the art the same way most people are.

Given the popularity of "splash-page" artists who draw only gorgeous people who all look the same like Michael Turner and, yes, Jim Lee (which isn't to say that Jim Lee isn't very, very good at what he does), I'm thoroughly convinced that most people who read superhero comics couldn't care less about storytelling ability or composition.

Which says alot about why Quitely's work is underappreciated. The image of Superman pressing against 200 quintillion tons is stuck in my mind probably forever. The way Superman was standing, the way his cape draped over him, the composition of the entire page. And that's not even the most memorable image from that single issue!

Of course, I've read a lot of people say that they don't like Jack Kirby because he "draws ugly people," so there you go.

[xnef1025]

An example of Quitely's genius is the Clark Kent Trip scene. That one scene tells you immediatly that Allstar Superman will have old school Clark, not captain of the football team Clark.

[Tadhg]

i do think composition and storytellig are important. how "pretty" the characters are is not the only thing i'm concerned with.

You're the one who dismissed storytelling and said "when you look at it it's ugly, that's the bottom line." were you not?

[Ultraman Max]

To me, Quitely's work seems closer to the work of pre-Neal Adams era artists like Kirby, Swan, or Wayne Boring. The later of whom also drew his Superman with a fairly sizeable chin, so it's not like that look is unusual for the character. The main comics industry has been so enamored with the Neal Adams look that it seems to have forgotten how to incorporate styles that are differently influenced yet still pack a dynamic punch. Quitely's work is a refreshing change of pace without looking dull or too vertigo/literary style.

[thik_3rd]

You're the one who dismissed storytelling and said "when you look at it it's ugly, that's the bottom line." were you not?
yes. and? doesn't mean i don't value the other aspects, but when it comes to quitely, the aesthetic value is so low it overwhelms any other potentially good qualities of his work.

[Harry]

I guess I'll chime in on this one. Quitely is probably my favourite artist working in comics today, and has been since his New X-Men work. I'm not sure I could give real concrete reasons as to why. There's a real elegence to his work and something unspeakably classic - not to mention when you see his work it immediatly resonates as his and his alone. NO ONE does work that looks anything close to his (good or bad, depending on your point of view), but despite that, there's still something vaguely traditional about his art. His art simpy resonates with me in a spontaneous, instinctual way. It strikes me as warm, technical, and fluid all at once, which is more than I can for most modern comic artists.

[Babylon23]

To me, Quitely's work seems closer to the work of pre-Neal Adams era artists like Kirby, Swan, or Wayne Boring. The later of whom also drew his Superman with a fairly sizeable chin, so it's not like that look is unusual for the character. The main comics industry has been so enamored with the Neal Adams look that it seems to have forgotten how to incorporate styles that are differently influenced yet still pack a dynamic punch. Quitely's work is a refreshing change of pace without looking dull or too vertigo/literary style.

I agree. Quitely captures a "classic", majestic Superman, but in a contemporary style. While I consider Curt Swan to be the definitive Superman artist, I think Quitely is a worthy successor.

[SUPERECWFAN1]

I agree. Quitely captures a "classic", majestic Superman, but in a contemporary style. While I consider Curt Swan to be the definitive Superman artist, I think Quitely is a worthy successor.


I like Quitely and think his art on Bite Club and New X-Men was the best I've seen. But this really isn't what I call the successor. I always thought the Superman Ordway and company drew in the early 90's was the closet to Swan's.

It had a classic look I always thought when I picked up those comics.

[Tadhg]

I like Quitely and think his art on Bite Club and New X-Men was the best I've seen. But this really isn't what I call the successor. I always thought the Superman Ordway and company drew in the early 90's was the closet to Swan's.

It had a classic look I always thought when I picked up those comics.

He only drew the covers to biteclub

[SUPERECWFAN1]

He only drew the covers to biteclub


They were awesome. I didn't know. I always thought he did the complete book.

[Cowlander]

Why are people complaining about Quitely's chin when McGuinness draws him with a bigger chin than that? Even Reis draws supes with a jay leno at times.

FQ is a helluva talent artistically, but honestly his people are downright ugly. HIs storytelling, panel design, sense of movement is all stellar. HIs people are just ugly. Alot of the complaints of he cant draw are made from people who dont understand the difference between technical proficiency(sp?) and artistic style. They hate his style so they dont recognize his technical merits.

[Babylon23]

I like Quitely and think his art on Bite Club and New X-Men was the best I've seen. But this really isn't what I call the successor. I always thought the Superman Ordway and company drew in the early 90's was the closet to Swan's.

It had a classic look I always thought when I picked up those comics.

Both Ordway and Jurgens are great artists, and both drew an excellent Superman. However, this was during the "humanising" period for Superman, so the emphasis was less on the majestic elements of the character. I think Quitely captures a more majestic figure, hence my comparison to Swan.