Has Bendis made DD villains weak?

[The Master Meglomaniac]

I just realized something, under Bendis DD has easily defeated almost all of his villains. In Out he easily beat Mr. Hyde with a mailbox, in Lowlife he took out Owl with a few punches and in Hardcore he took down Bullseye like he was punk and beat Kingpin without his club.

Not mention Stilt-Man saying the other DD rogues were too afraid to attack him now that he has been outed. Heck, it wasn't until the Murdock Ppaers that Bullseye and Kingpin had any good showings under Bendis. Why does Bendis make DD villains so weak?

[Sentry]

i disagree, matt is going through a strange phase at the moment so i think that his attitude when fighting is going to be a lot different.

Some of the fight scenes have been the best in comics that i have read, esp the last issue with bullseye, electra, black widow and daredevil.

+ yopu know bendis, he likes his chit chat, so why would he want to write page long fights, it does not mean that they are weaker, just more chatty.

[agrich]

Bendis has made Daredevil's villians cool, at least, the ones Miller hadn't already made cool. Considering his best villains were lifted from Spider-man anyway, that takes some doing.

Maybe the Owl and Mr. Hyde and Kingpin aren't as physically "strong" as they were, but that doesn't mean they're weaker. We're not talking about one of the best rogues galleries in comics here to start with.

[Alan2099]

I really don't think bendis has done a good job with them. Owl isn't that bad and Kingpin has his moments, but for the most part, I feel they suffer from what lots of Bendis's work suffers from.

Poor Knowledge of the characters abilities, horrible fights scenes, and (with some characters) too much talk and not enough action.

[agrich]

I can accept that some people don't like Bendis, but are you suggesting that before Bendis and Maleev took over the book all of the things you talk about were great? Daredevil sucked for a number of years beforehand.

[Shellhead]

I can accept that some people don't like Bendis, but are you suggesting that before Bendis and Maleev took over the book all of the things you talk about were great? Daredevil sucked for a number of years beforehand.

Bendis had done some decent writing, but I don't think that he actually appreciates the superhero genre for what it is. He keeps dragging down to a level of realism that downplays costumes, action, competence, etc. It reminds me of how Bruce Jones wrote the Hulk so that he rarely appeared in his own series.

[agrich]

Bendis had done some decent writing, but I don't think that he actually appreciates the superhero genre for what it is. He keeps dragging down to a level of realism that downplays costumes, action, competence, etc. It reminds me of how Bruce Jones wrote the Hulk so that he rarely appeared in his own series.

If Bendis did this with, say, the Silver Surfer, I could see your point, but in Daredevil - a character whose only powers are his radar sense and enhanced remaining senses anyway - I can't see any complaint. Arguably that's what Miller did, and that pretty much defined the character as he's been since.

I don't personally need to see an issue-long battle between Daredevil and someone like Stilt-Man, but others can disagree.

[Sentry]

I really don't think bendis has done a good job with them. Owl isn't that bad and Kingpin has his moments, but for the most part, I feel they suffer from what lots of Bendis's work suffers from.

Poor Knowledge of the characters abilities, horrible fights scenes, and (with some characters) too much talk and not enough action.


you thinik the fiught sceens in daredevil are horrible??!?!?!

i think they are the best in comic today, mavee (sp*) is wicked. fact.

[El Santo]

Mr. Hyde and Typhoid Mary were both beaten with help. Spider-Man's strength level is high enough that all DD had to do was mop up Hyde. Typhoid Mary was softened up by Luke Cage, who was holding her in position while Matt knocked her out with a precision blow.

The Kingpin and Bullseye had quick losses to Matt in Hardcore, but it's worth pointing out that he was in the middle of (another) nervous breakdown, and was certifiably insane at the time. I mean, the first thing he did after beating the Kingpin was tear off his mask and declare himself Kingpin. Since that time, both the Kingpin and Bullseye have regained their dignity (and then some) in The Murdock Papers. The Kingpin has simultaneously screwed Matt, Ben Urich, and the FBI. Bullseye lost the fight, but held off Elektra and Daredevil for basically an entire issue, turning Daredevil into a glass pincushion and killing an innocent women in the process.

And lets not forget the ass-kicking Matt got from the Yakuza until he called in his friends (and good lord, was that fight overkill).

[abyss]

Bendis had done some decent writing, but I don't think that he actually appreciates the superhero genre for what it is. He keeps dragging down to a level of realism that downplays costumes, action, competence, etc. It reminds me of how Bruce Jones wrote the Hulk so that he rarely appeared in his own series.
No it's jsut a different approach thats all...like for me I don't like the whole costume average superhero think jsut doesn't do anything for me. But I loved Bendis DD I enjoyed how he gave a alot realsim to his story even though DD is a superhero. And I liked Jones runs on Hulk.

[The Master Meglomaniac]

Bendis has made Daredevil's villians cool, at least, the ones Miller hadn't already made cool. Considering his best villains were lifted from Spider-man anyway, that takes some doing.

Maybe the Owl and Mr. Hyde and Kingpin aren't as physically "strong" as they were, but that doesn't mean they're weaker. We're not talking about one of the best rogues galleries in comics here to start with.

There are no bad villains, only bad writers (well with some exceptions like Matador). I think there is a wasted opportunity here, we haven't had a proper reaction to DD's outing by his rogues gallery, the whole their too scared to attack excuse is weak.

[XPac]

Kingpin came off a BIT weak. He should have been more of a challenge for Matt. But that's not TOO terrible.

Hyde is a different story though. This is a guy that started out his career as one of Thor's rogues. It should take a bit of a miracle for DD to take him. Hydeps not some pumped up street thug... I'm not sure Bendis realizes that when they have him duking it out with Daredevil sometimes.

[Shellhead]

No it's jsut a different approach thats all...like for me I don't like the whole costume average superhero think jsut doesn't do anything for me. But I loved Bendis DD I enjoyed how he gave a alot realsim to his story even though DD is a superhero. And I liked Jones runs on Hulk.

Exactly my point. I'm not sure why either you or Bendis are interested in superhero comics.

[Jake V]

Exactly my point. I'm not sure why either you or Bendis are interested in superhero comics.
Theres a lot of people that like the concept of superheroes and superhumans but don't like the execution in traditional superhero comics.

Some people enjoy seeing concepts turned on their head and notraditional storytelling methods being applied to classic characters.

[El Santo]

Kingpin came off a BIT weak. He should have been more of a challenge for Matt. But that's not TOO terrible.

Hyde is a different story though. This is a guy that started out his career as one of Thor's rogues. It should take a bit of a miracle for DD to take him. Hydeps not some pumped up street thug... I'm not sure Bendis realizes that when they have him duking it out with Daredevil sometimes.

Again...all DD did was hit him with a mailbox. Spiderman had been wailing on Hyde for about a page or so. Spiderman beats up higher quality rogues than Mr. Hyde, who hasn't been Thor-worthy in like 10 years.

[abyss]

Exactly my point. I'm not sure why either you or Bendis are interested in superhero comics.
Well not everything has to be about superheroes with color costumes fighting for jsutice in the traditioanl way...its been to death sure poeple like it but i mnot one of them I like to read about things that are dark and gritty and more street level which DD whats wrong with that. Your viewing superheros in one perspective which is wrong they are many different ways you can view a superhero and use the sotrylines in different ways. And these nothing wrong with that. I jsut dont like my superheroics all neat and clean and cut..I want more relaism and grit to them. Not too mention character develpoment an interesting storylines.

Theres a lot of people that like the concept of superheroes and superhumans but don't like the execution in traditional superhero comics.

Some people enjoy seeing concepts turned on their head and notraditional storytelling methods being applied to classic characters.
Exactly.

[Uncensored]

Bendis had done some decent writing, but I don't think that he actually appreciates the superhero genre for what it is. He keeps dragging down to a level of realism that downplays costumes, action, competence, etc. It reminds me of how Bruce Jones wrote the Hulk so that he rarely appeared in his own series.

There's alot more to Daredevil than simple costumed superheroism, you actually have a problem with that? God forbid someone comes along and gives a character some depth.

[Doom Hammer]

It's kinda tough to say.

The Owl has never been especially resilient. His getting the crap kicked out of himself (in an enclosed area where he cannot apply his natural advantage) should be expected.

Bendis' Kingpin, I think, is awesome. He has twice in one run taken a situation where he had practically no advantage whatsoever, and turned all his competitors and enemies on their heads. If he's not quite so physically threatening, that's okay. Keep in mind, the Kingpin also nearly choked Daredevil to death in Hardcore.

Typhoid Mary was getting pounded on by three super-heroes. It stands to reason that she'd be defeated.

Bullseye held his own, except in Hardcore, where DD just totally flipped out and went psycho on him. It was quite the acceptable confrontation, I thought.

I don't think Bendis has made DD's rogues all that much weaker. I mean, DD beats them, but he's the hero. Plus, when the guys are not facing Matt himself, they usually come off as incredible badasses. I would argue that Bendis made DD stronger, not his rogues weaker.

Oh, and Daredevil is one of Marvel's best comics, and it's on a run that is maybe definitive of the character. It is awesome, I accept no arguments.

[Shellhead]

Theres a lot of people that like the concept of superheroes and superhumans but don't like the execution in traditional superhero comics.

Some people enjoy seeing concepts turned on their head and notraditional storytelling methods being applied to classic characters.

That's a valid point, but ignoring all of the conventions of a genre should be done sparingly, as needed to tell a specific story, not all the time. New Avengers fans are becoming disgruntled that the New Avengers rarely accomplish anything without outside help. Most Hulk fans got tired of Bruce Jones, because he rarely gave them scenes of Hulk in action. That last Silver Surfer series died quickly for the same reason, not enough action with Silver Surfer. Clue: people tend to buy superhero comics because they like superheroes. They want the incredible Hulk, because if they just wanted the adventures of some normal guy on the run, they could rent The Fugitive.

[Shellhead]

Well not everything has to be about superheroes with color costumes fighting for jsutice in the traditioanl way...

See, you're already missing the point. If there is one thing in life that *does* need to be about superheroes in colorful costumes fighting for justice, it's... guess what... wait for it... here it comes... SUPERHERO COMICS!

Take your realistic drama about some guy in street clothes and put it on tv, or in the movie theater, or even in a great non-superhero comic, like Sin City. Let the superheroes run free in the one genre they own, superhero comics.

I was a fan of Daredevil years before Frank Miller took over the title, and I freely admit that it was mostly typical silver age fare. There were a few flashes of potential here and there, like the issue where Daredevil and Torpedo battled, and didn't even notice that they trashed a family's house in the process until the housewife started shouting at them. Or the issue where Daredevil considered joining SHIELD.

Frank Miller transformed Daredevil into a more serious comic, and I enjoyed that. He showed more interest in Matt Murdock beneath the mask than anybody before, including Stan Lee. But Miller also gave us a lot of dark, gritty, intense action... nearly every single issue.

Bendis is doing something different, I get that. I was very impressed with this one issue where he defended White Tiger in court, it was probably the most realistic court scene in the history of comics. But Bendis has been rationing the action to a degree that I can't tolerate anymore. The stories are decompressed, there's so much talking, and it's discouraging how often Daredevil needs help. I would like to see Brubaker get a shot at writing Daredevil, and Bendis can go to Hollywood and write the modern film noir scripts that he's carrying around in his head and make the big bucks.

[The Master Meglomaniac]

See, you're already missing the point. If there is one thing in life that *does* need to be about superheroes in colorful costumes fighting for justice, it's... guess what... wait for it... here it comes... SUPERHERO COMICS!

Take your realistic drama about some guy in street clothes and put it on tv, or in the movie theater, or even in a great non-superhero comic, like Sin City. Let the superheroes run free in the one genre they own, superhero comics.

I was a fan of Daredevil years before Frank Miller took over the title, and I freely admit that it was mostly typical silver age fare. There were a few flashes of potential here and there, like the issue where Daredevil and Torpedo battled, and didn't even notice that they trashed a family's house in the process until the housewife started shouting at them. Or the issue where Daredevil considered joining SHIELD.

Frank Miller transformed Daredevil into a more serious comic, and I enjoyed that. He showed more interest in Matt Murdock beneath the mask than anybody before, including Stan Lee. But Miller also gave us a lot of dark, gritty, intense action... nearly every single issue.

Bendis is doing something different, I get that. I was very impressed with this one issue where he defended White Tiger in court, it was probably the most realistic court scene in the history of comics. But Bendis has been rationing the action to a degree that I can't tolerate anymore. The stories are decompressed, there's so much talking, and it's discouraging how often Daredevil needs help. I would like to see Brubaker get a shot at writing Daredevil, and Bendis can go to Hollywood and write the modern film noir scripts that he's carrying around in his head and make the big bucks.

I agree, Miller was able to combine adult stories with super hero action and I believe that's works best for DD. I hope Brubaker does the some appraoch as Miller. Bendis has explored some interesting themes, but has missed some opportunities with DD's outing. We have yet to see a really strong reaction from the super villain communty to DD's outing and I hope Brubaker will address that, as well as trying to revamp some B list DD vilains like Mr. Hyde into real threats.

[agrich]

Presuming to say what superhero comics should or shouldn't be is just unreasonable.

For every person who doesn't like a more talky Daredevil, or a New Avengers team getting outside help, there are certainly many who like it much more than the kind of book you'd like.

I got tired of Bruce Jones' run on the Hulk too, but I didn't fault him for doing something a little different. I mean geez, there are 40 years of the Hulk leaping around and fighting the Rhino and so forth. If somebody wants to do the Hulk as The Fugitive for a few years, so be it.

I understand there are some people who will only buy the Hulk if he's smashing tanks or whatever, but there are just as many who've read that 100 times and don't need to see it any more. Do those people count less than the people who want the Hulk or Daredevil of the '80s? I don't think so.

There is certainly no shortage of superhero comics that are exactly what you're talking about, so why not have some with a different take. Daredevil is a superhero comic - even if it's not one you personally can tolerate anymore.

Anyway, Bendis only has two more issues, so maybe you'll get what you want.

[Will.S]

Bendis has explored some interesting themes, but has missed some opportunities with DD's outing. We have yet to see a really strong reaction from the super villain communty to DD's outing and I hope Brubaker will address that, as well as trying to revamp some B list DD vilains like Mr. Hyde into real threats.
Sure we have. Ever since he's been outed a villain from the past (now knowing the rumor) comes around and tries to use this to their advantage such as Jigsaw, Kingpin, The Owl, Jester, Alexander Bont and various organizations such as the FBI so you honestly can't say that there hasn't been much of a villain reaction to DD's outing because that was a major turning point of the book.

And I fully agree with agrich, not liking the style of the book doesn't mean I would automatically hate the more traditional approach to superhero comics. I like variety in my superhero comics and each title has a character or characters that can be molded into different ways and with DD's case it was action, pulp, and noir. When Bendis uses action it's well realized, explosive and always relevant to the story such as DD training Del Toro using the White Tiger amulets, the DD & Elektra vs Bullseye fight, the Spider-Man/DD/White Tiger fight with Doctor Octopus and Bont, the Typhoid Mary vs DD Luke and Jessica Jones fight, DD vs Kingpin, DD vs The Gladiator, DD vs The Yakuza, DD vs Jester all very memorable and well played.

I will say that Alex Maleev isn't a perfect sequential artist since the panel to panel transitions aren't always smooth but for the most part the details and the motions can be seen and usually the fights are very well played.

I think with Brubaker on DD, he may be what Shellhead is looking for since he uses action more with his style of writing but I don't think I'll find it automatically better since he's going to have a different style of superheroics than Bendis. Personally I can enjoy all types of superhero stories as long as they're well told and can show different facets to the character alongside the action.

[The Master Meglomaniac]

Sure we have. Ever since he's been outed a villain from the past (now knowing the rumor) comes around and tries to use this to their advantage such as Jigsaw, Kingpin, The Owl, Jester, Alexander Bont and various organizations such as the FBI so you honestly can't say that there hasn't been much of a villain reaction to DD's outing because that was a major turning point of the book.

And I fully agree with agrich, not liking the style of the book doesn't mean I would automatically hate the more traditional approach to superhero comics. I like variety in my superhero comics and each title has a character or characters that can be molded into different ways and with DD's case it was action, pulp, and noir. When Bendis uses action it's well realized, explosive and always relevant to the story such as DD training Del Toro using the White Tiger amulets, the DD & Elektra vs Bullseye fight, the Spider-Man/DD/White Tiger fight with Doctor Octopus and Bont, the Typhoid Mary vs DD and Luke fight, DD vs Kingpin, DD vs Jester all very memorable and well played.

I will say that Alex Maleev isn't a perfect sequential artist since the panel to panel transitions aren't always smooth but for the most part the details and the motions can be seen and usually the fights are very well played.

I think with Brubaker on DD, he may be what Shellhead is looking for since he uses action more with his style of writing but I don't think I'll find it automatically better since he's going to have a different style of superheroics than Bendis. Personally I can enjoy all types of superhero stories as long as they're well told and can show different facets to the character alongside the action.

Bendis has ignored several villains that could threaten DD like Bushwacker and Mr. Fear, he didn't even use his own revamped version of Purple Man. besides you also have stilt-Man;s comment that a lot of villains are too afraid to mess with DD. These are just scatter shot reactions, I was hoping fort something more solid. Besides we have seen some heroes talking DD being outed, but why not a bunch villains sitting around talking about it? Seems like DD spends more time dodging the media then dodging villains.

Besides I thought the action scene with Mr. Hyde was really lame, Hyde looked goofy taking a beating from DD with that mailbox, it was silly. Besides the Owl vs. DD fight lasted only a few panels and Owl was portrayed as a moron. In Born Again Matt treated to beat Kingpin in similar circumstances and was creamed, in Hardcore he could beat Fisk without his billy club

[Expletive Deleted]

he didn't even use his own revamped version of Purple Man.Bendis used him in two different books. A third would've been be overkill, I think.In Born Again Matt treated to beat Kingpin in similar circumstances and was creamed, in Hardcore he could beat Fisk without his billy clubYou mean the scene where Matt is having a psychotic break and hasn't slept in days?

I'd hardly say the two situations are comparable.

[abyss]

See, you're already missing the point. If there is one thing in life that *does* need to be about superheroes in colorful costumes fighting for justice, it's... guess what... wait for it... here it comes... SUPERHERO COMICS!
Why is that? How BORING taking a concept and applying through one conventional method....sorry I will pass...don't get me wrong in not saying is all boring im a massive fan of New Thunderbolts which your old school comic with flashy costumes and codenames and team-ups I enjoy it alot but I do like to see other Superhero used defiinernly. And yes thats your defintion of superheros however that doesn't mean its correct. You can have superheroes without the flashy costumes and such. You take a genre and use it many different ways. Alias was a superhero book....It was about a former superhero who simply didn't cut with the fancy costumes etc. So she became a PI. whats wrong with that? Alias was one of the most underrated books Marvel put out and one of the best. And it was not traditional or conventional. I see nothing wrong with that. And its not jsut Alais there are many titles out that don't use the whole covnentional depiction of a superhero. Its called variety!

[Tommy]

Alias was never ment to be about Superheros. Alias was about an Ex-Superhero.

Daredevil has allways been about being about being a superhero.

Bendis should be a crime story writter. He has released nothing but drech this past year when he writes Superheros.

[abyss]

Alias was never ment to be about Superheros. Alias was about an Ex-Superhero.

Daredevil has allways been about being about being a superhero.

Bendis should be a crime story writter. He has released nothing but drech this past year when he writes Superheros.
But yet it feature superheroes....a lot...we had numerous Avengers and other cahracters show up throughout the series. And it did deal with superhero issues. All the main cast were superheroes themesleves soo how can you say it was not about superheroes.

[Will.S]

Bendis has ignored several villains that could threaten DD like Bushwacker and Mr. Fear, he didn't even use his own revamped version of Purple Man. besides you also have stilt-Man;s comment that a lot of villains are too afraid to mess with DD. These are just scatter shot reactions, I was hoping fort something more solid. Besides we have seen some heroes talking DD being outed, but why not a bunch villains sitting around talking about it? Seems like DD spends more time dodging the media then dodging villains.
No, I think Bendis used just enough DD villains to keep the stories interesting. I don't think Bendis made DD's rogue's gallery weak in any way but he did made them much, MUCH more interesting than the jokes they were at some point. I mean, who cares about Bushwacker and Mr. Fear (who got punked hardcore in Spider-Man Breakout) when you've got Kingpin, Mr. Hyde, Bullseye, Gladiator (although not really a villain nowadays), Jigsaw, Alexander Bont, The Yakuza, Typhoid Mary, Sammy Silke, Jester, The Owl, Quinn, and Nitro?

Besides I thought the action scene with Mr. Hyde was really lame, Hyde looked goofy taking a beating from DD with that mailbox, it was silly. Besides the Owl vs. DD fight lasted only a few panels and Owl was portrayed as a moron. In Born Again Matt treated to beat Kingpin in similar circumstances and was creamed, in Hardcore he could beat Fisk without his billy club
I liked the fight between Spidey, DD and Mr. Hyde. Granted Spidey did most of the legwork but DD hit him with all he had in his disposal. The fight with the Owl made sense, he doesn't have a chance against Matt in close combat.

[XPac]

Again...all DD did was hit him with a mailbox. Spiderman had been wailing on Hyde for about a page or so. Spiderman beats up higher quality rogues than Mr. Hyde, who hasn't been Thor-worthy in like 10 years.

Even Spider-Man doesn't beat people THAT powerful by just wailing on them. More often than not he outsmarts people like Sandman and Rhyno. As strong as he is, he shouldn't be KOing people that powerful by walking up and hitting them with mailboxes either. I'm skeptical of Spidey being able to do it... no way DD should be able to.

[The Master Meglomaniac]

No, I think Bendis used just enough DD villains to keep the stories interesting. I don't think Bendis made DD's rogue's gallery weak in any way but he did made them much, MUCH more interesting than the jokes they were at some point. I mean, who cares about Bushwacker and Mr. Fear (who got punked hardcore in Spider-Man Breakout) when you've got Kingpin, Mr. Hyde, Bullseye, Gladiator (although not really a villain nowadays), Jigsaw, Alexander Bont, The Yakuza, Typhoid Mary, Sammy Silke, Jester, The Owl, Quinn, and Nitro?


I liked the fight between Spidey, DD and Mr. Hyde. Granted Spidey did most of the legwork but DD hit him with all he had in his disposal. The fight with the Owl made sense, he doesn't have a chance against Matt in close combat.

Please Bendis treated Jigsaw, Owl and Mr. Hyde as stupid third rate thugs, who DD can beat within a few panels, their still jokes. Bendis hasn't revamped them at all, he just treats them as jokes, which is lazy writing. Owl came off as a total idiot in Lowlife. Heck it wasn't until the Murdock Papers that any villains got any good showings at all. Bendis has made DD's rogues gallery look worse, not better.

[BizarroBeachHead]

Bendis made Daredevil's villains weak? We're talking about Daredevil's villains right? How could Bendis make them any weaker. Daredevil has had arguably the worst rogues gallery ever. Even most of his great villains were pathetic at one time but somebody had to revamp them. It's no secret how Bendis feels about them either becuase he told us vicariously through Daredevil in issue 16:

Because sometimes, just sometimes, I feel saddled with the most pathetic rogue's gallery. It's embarrassing.

That was taken from the Wake Up story, you know, the one with that totally awesome villain Leap Frog. I'd have to say Bendis has done lots of Daredevil's rogue's a service by portraying them NOT in a completely campy pathetic light. Also, he's used plenty of villains. The reason they get punked out is because, quite frankly, most of them suck hardcore. Leap Frog, Boomerang, Shotgun, even the Jester, these are excellent villains?

I could go on more about Bendis' run on Daredevil, but I'd be cut and pasting what Agrich, Abyss, and Will.S have said.

[The Master Meglomaniac]

Bendis made Daredevil's villains weak? We're talking about Daredevil's villains right? How could Bendis make them any weaker. Daredevil has had arguably the worst rogues gallery ever. Even most of his great villains were pathetic at one time but somebody had to revamp them. It's no secret how Bendis feels about them either becuase he told us vicariously through Daredevil in issue 16:



That was taken from the Wake Up story, you know, the one with that totally awesome villain Leap Frog. I'd have to say Bendis has done lots of Daredevil's rogue's a service by portraying them NOT in a completely campy pathetic light. Also, he's used plenty of villains. The reason they get punked out is because, quite frankly, most of them suck hardcore. Leap Frog, Boomerang, Shotgun, even the Jester, these are excellent villains?

I could go on more about Bendis' run on Daredevil, but I'd be cut and pasting what Agrich, Abyss, and Will.S have said.

That's a lazy attitude, there are DD villains who have potenial to be scarey if writers would start treating them like jokes. Take Mr. Hyde for example, he is supposed be the incarination of evil, yet he gets written as a goofy thug. Hyde should committing monsterous deeds not being DD's punching bag. Mr. Hyde should also be somewhat cunning considering he is a genius bio chemist in his civilian ID. There is a lot of potenial there.

[Will.S]

That's a lazy attitude, there are DD villains who have potenial to be scarey if writers would start treating them like jokes. Take Mr. Hyde for example, he is supposed be the incarination of evil, yet he gets written as a goofy thug. Hyde should committing monsterous deeds not being DD's punching bag. Mr. Hyde should also be somewhat cunning considering he is a genius bio chemist in his civilian ID. There is a lot of potenial there.
So The Jester during the Decalogue was still just a joke? C'mon man, you're crazy if you think Bendis is treating them as if they were no type of threat..

Bendis has been taking every villain as serious as he could. Hell even Melvin Potter and Bont got in some good shots at DD practically beating him to a pulp.

[The Master Meglomaniac]

So The Jester during the Decalogue was still just a joke? C'mon man, you're crazy if you think Bendis is treating them as if they were no type of threat..

Bendis has been taking every villain as serious as he could. Hell even Melvin Potter and Bont got in some good shots at DD practically beating him to a pulp.

I'm sorry the whole demon baby thing was just weird and I didn't like it, too supernatural for DD. If he wanted to take some of the villains seriously why not write Owl as an intelligent crime boss instead of a moron or write Mr. Hyde as cunning, blood thristy monster instead of a stupid, goofy thug.

[MistyG]

Mr. Hyde was on a downward trend since he ran into Thor's chest and knocked himself out. There is ABSOLUTELY nothing wrong with Mr. Hyde's appearence in Bendis' DareDevil when Spider-man was beating on him for a page, then DD comes in, acting hardcore and rips a mailbox from the sidewalk and smashes him over the head with it.

You tell me WHEN Mr. Hyde has been written as a cunning villain rather then a superstrong thug? There have been instances, but not nearly as many as the latter.

DareDevil has become more focused, more gritty and overall just better as a hero then his villains.

And the Owl in Lowlife wasn't a third rate moron. But he was trying to fill in the Kingpin's void. And the Kingpin was a bloody genius. The Owl was able to squelch all of those other villains trying to muscle in on his territory (ie Stilt-Man got his arm broken) and was smart enough to surround himself with solid help, such as the Kingpin's old advisors and included almost entrapping DD. Only at the end of Lowlife, when the FBI was at his door and he was about to get screwed over did Owl lose control (as he has done) and try to fight DareDevil.

DareDevil is a better fighter and has always been improving. Owl hasn't, so he lost.

And JIGSAW? He only met DD like once before. He had no idea how to handle DareDevil since they never met. So he tried handling him like he would any other goon challenging him instead of cooperating with him. He stormed his place with twenty guys heavily armed with guns KNOWING full well that Matt Murdock, if he fought them, would pretty much identify himself as DareDevil. He didn't plan for Black Widow showing up though as pure coincidence.

Meanwhile the Kingpin, Bullseye, Alexander Bont, Gladiator, and Quinn have all managed to get their licks in on DareDevil as of late.

[XPac]

Mr. Hyde was on a downward trend since he ran into Thor's chest and knocked himself out. There is ABSOLUTELY nothing wrong with Mr. Hyde's appearence in Bendis' DareDevil when Spider-man was beating on him for a page, then DD comes in, acting hardcore and rips a mailbox from the sidewalk and smashes him over the head with it.

You tell me WHEN Mr. Hyde has been written as a cunning villain rather then a superstrong thug? There have been instances, but not nearly as many as the latter.



Hyde has 5o ton strength though. How many instances has Daredevil been shown capable of KOing people that metahumanly strong with that level of ease? Does DD have any other instances of outright KOing people that strong?

If Daredevil is suddenly metahumanly powerful then fine... I just wish the writers would tell us so there wouldn't be as much confusion on the matter.

[Will.S]

Hyde has 5o ton strength though. How many instances has Daredevil been shown capable of KOing people that metahumanly strong with that level of ease? Does DD have any other instances of outright KOing people that strong?

If Daredevil is suddenly metahumanly powerful then fine... I just wish the writers would tell us so there wouldn't be as much confusion on the matter.
I always thought that Mr. Hyde while very strong doesn't have a huge degree of invulnerability but you're right, Bendis has shown DD's strength level to be superhuman at times such as with the mailbox and that "huh?" inducing car overthrowing.

[Hiromi]

Hyde's strength fluctates like mad, Ghost Rider's matched him in strength before.

[Smarty Jones]

"Well not everything has to be about superheroes with color costumes fighting for jsutice in the traditioanl way...its been to death sure poeple like it but i mnot one of them I like to read about things that are dark and gritty and more street level which DD whats wrong with that. Your viewing superheros in one perspective which is wrong they are many different ways you can view a superhero and use the sotrylines in different ways."

BUT THAT'S THE POINT, you are reading about superheroes. You're reading a book about a blind man with superhuman senses who fights villains with a billy club wearing a red outfit! Daredevil IS a superhero, so if you're reading book about a superhero yet you don't want superhero adventures why are you even bothering?

Seriously, there are plenty of fictional books out there detailing long narratives and plots that unfold over long periods. If you're looking for a comic book version of "CSI," "Law & Order" or "The Shield" -- where you don't have to deal with superheroes -- then I hope you find it or a John Grisham novel. But other than that, you really don't need to buy superhero books.

I'm sorry, but I dropped "Boredevil" quite a while, because I literally got tired of buying a book I couldn't read because it was so non-eventful. When you have a story arc where people are in a church in an AA-type setting talking about Daredevil, that was the epitome of boring.

[Smarty Jones]

"Theres a lot of people that like the concept of superheroes and superhumans but don't like the execution in traditional superhero comics.

Some people enjoy seeing concepts turned on their head and notraditional storytelling methods being applied to classic characters."

Reading superhero comic books should not be all-or-nothing, but at the same you have to wonder why people are even trying to convert characters whose existence is based on superhuman abilities that cannot be duplicated in real life into something else.

I'm sorry, but "Daredevil" -- or should I call him "Boredevil?" -- had gotten ridiculously tedious over the past 18 months. Brian Michael Bendis does write as if he has a disdain for traditional superhero stories, also witnessed by his handling of "New Avengers."

I get tired of looking at pages where the panels are repeated for two pages before a person says "OK" at the end of the last one. A story line where people are in a circle talking about Daredevil's alleged impact on their lives?

What do these people like about traditional superheroes and what don't they like? I would like to hear from these people.

[Doom Hammer]

Just to let you know, Smarty, although I don't mind the slower pace, it has been kicked up considerably in the latest arc. I think you should give it a shot, or buy the TPB or something.

[Will.S]

Bendis's DD definitely reads alot better when all the issues are in one nice package. At times I didn't even read the book until an arc was finished to get the feeling of the whole story.

[XPac]

I agree about reading Bendis is tpb form. I actually liked House of M more than some of the people I know because I read most of it in one sitting. So it really dragged a lot less since you get everything in one shot.

Bendis is one of the reasons I'm spending more time at Borders and less time at my local comicbook store.